New developer diary at Bethesda
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requiem_for_a_starfury
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
First thing I thought on looking at their concept art was this game is getting closer and closer to being FOT Renegade.Brother None said:
Xenophile
It Wandered In From the Wastes
I actually like it. I think it flows out nicely, makes sense to me.
Organizations that are in "decay" are likely to alter their operations.. in this case send out scouts.. what is a likely location for an organization who's root's are military... DC... ok.. if they find something too big to move, you hunker down and reinforce as best you can.. then you get a disagreement between people and the organization decides to cut it's loses.
I don't think it is "reaching"..
I think in the frame of the original fiction, it fit's organization and their goals change.. often quite dramaticly overtime.
Organizations that are in "decay" are likely to alter their operations.. in this case send out scouts.. what is a likely location for an organization who's root's are military... DC... ok.. if they find something too big to move, you hunker down and reinforce as best you can.. then you get a disagreement between people and the organization decides to cut it's loses.
I don't think it is "reaching"..
I think in the frame of the original fiction, it fit's organization and their goals change.. often quite dramaticly overtime.
Xenophile said:
Yes, it totally makes sense when you're in trouble to send a large portion of your best men on a possibly futile and risky trek across the country...
...
wait for it.
...
NOT!
The BoS alternate mode of operations has already been offered in Fallout 1:
The Brotherhood of Steel, under new leadership after the death of Rhombus, becomes an overzealous, techno-religious dictatorship. In 20 years, the Steel Plague devastates the newly formed New California Republic, and starts a Dark Age that could last a thousand years.
Doesn't that make more sense, as an alternative to dying?
PS: if Rosh were here he'd have done a much better rant. There're plenty of stupid points, holes and inconsistencies in that story, it's pretty bad.
Wow, Brother None really bent that diary entry over and uh...tore dat ass up. That was a good read.
I dunno, on one hand I don't have a problem with Beth putting their own stamp on the series - I don't want everything in FO3 to look exactly as it did in the first two games. On the other hand, they're deviating so much in so many areas that I'm becoming more and more certain that FO3 is hardly going to be recognizable to older fans of the series. But that isn't anything new.
Beth has seriously missed the mark on the BoS. How can you whiff that badly? Suddenly the BoS are knights in shining armor roaming the wasteland and protecting the innocent masses from the vile supermutants. Way to dumb everything down, asswipes. It's as if no one from Beth ever played...oh, wait.
I dunno, on one hand I don't have a problem with Beth putting their own stamp on the series - I don't want everything in FO3 to look exactly as it did in the first two games. On the other hand, they're deviating so much in so many areas that I'm becoming more and more certain that FO3 is hardly going to be recognizable to older fans of the series. But that isn't anything new.
Beth has seriously missed the mark on the BoS. How can you whiff that badly? Suddenly the BoS are knights in shining armor roaming the wasteland and protecting the innocent masses from the vile supermutants. Way to dumb everything down, asswipes. It's as if no one from Beth ever played...oh, wait.
ivpiter
It Wandered In From the Wastes
Glad to see BN give voice to so many of my thoughts on this, and so much more. About halfway through the post I was thinking “Swiss Cheese” and after reading BN’s thoughtful and accurate analysis I now think of it more as "Swiss Cheese" left in the radioactive waste for ten years to be eaten by Todd who regurgitates it to Email and Pete saying, "Here, feed this shit to the lemmings, were main-fucking-stream baby".
BoS had a unique vibe in Fallout. Were almost non-existent in FO2 (as would be expected of a xenophobic technology cult/order) now they... what send huge forces clear across the entire country... which was apparently a COMPLETELY uneventful trip... W...T...F!
I've no idea what they are making but I'm sure at this point it has more to do with a teenage Todd's juvenile and shallow interpretation of Fallout.
Had Beth named it ANYTHING else this wouldn't be a problem; alas they called it Fallout, and they called it wrong!
EDIT: typos
BoS had a unique vibe in Fallout. Were almost non-existent in FO2 (as would be expected of a xenophobic technology cult/order) now they... what send huge forces clear across the entire country... which was apparently a COMPLETELY uneventful trip... W...T...F!
I've no idea what they are making but I'm sure at this point it has more to do with a teenage Todd's juvenile and shallow interpretation of Fallout.
Had Beth named it ANYTHING else this wouldn't be a problem; alas they called it Fallout, and they called it wrong!
EDIT: typos
i dont like the concept art - i expected more modernist designs inspired by the 50s and 60s styles not cyber-steam-punk-medievo-victorian-morrowindish.
ex. the weapons look like something out of Daikatana ? why is the laser rifle resembling a crossbow or the plasma something touched by HR Geiger
What was wrong with the existing designs ? Was it too hard to just update or copy them ?
See ? Looks normal .. functional ... modern with an added wear and a little wiring on the laser rifle ... not a lot of wiring and tubes.
ex. the weapons look like something out of Daikatana ? why is the laser rifle resembling a crossbow or the plasma something touched by HR Geiger
What was wrong with the existing designs ? Was it too hard to just update or copy them ?
See ? Looks normal .. functional ... modern with an added wear and a little wiring on the laser rifle ... not a lot of wiring and tubes.
Hey guys this concept art and change in the brotherhoods actions can all be explained.
Maybe, just maybe, on their flight to DC they were all abducted by... aliens! This is why the scribes were all given futuristic super chastity belts, and why they have alien blasters, and why they have those weird looking mind control helmets on their head, which probably explains the change in their directives, philosophy, objectives, etc.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that sums it all up.
Maybe, just maybe, on their flight to DC they were all abducted by... aliens! This is why the scribes were all given futuristic super chastity belts, and why they have alien blasters, and why they have those weird looking mind control helmets on their head, which probably explains the change in their directives, philosophy, objectives, etc.
Yeah, I'm pretty sure that sums it all up.
13pm
Water Chip? Been There, Done That
okay. they thought that putting existing 'factions' into Fallout 3 would be be a good stunt for an actionee game. so they needed a story to do it. hence we get this shit. it's not the worst story, but it is so cheesy. they wanted BoS to be noble neo-knights - here goes this 'exiled' BoS elder. they needed more factions against each other - there go those 'Outcasts'.
As I said before, it appears to me that Bethesda says they are ignoring Fallout:Tactics just to create another one.
I wonder what's the story behind these 'other' supermutants. Damn, it's completely idiotic to put creatures named Super Mutants that have another background into game. Maybe it's because of that they are not those SMs that we all know, they are wearing helmets and using AKs? I assume that's an another way for Bethesda to justify their shitty artwork: "Our mutants and BoS are not those from the original games. They are SPECIAL east-coast versions. So shut the fuck up".
Edit:
and concept art is shit. why those people look like they came from the Matrix movie? what's up with guns? why are they so steampunkish?
As I said before, it appears to me that Bethesda says they are ignoring Fallout:Tactics just to create another one.
I wonder what's the story behind these 'other' supermutants. Damn, it's completely idiotic to put creatures named Super Mutants that have another background into game. Maybe it's because of that they are not those SMs that we all know, they are wearing helmets and using AKs? I assume that's an another way for Bethesda to justify their shitty artwork: "Our mutants and BoS are not those from the original games. They are SPECIAL east-coast versions. So shut the fuck up".
Edit:
and concept art is shit. why those people look like they came from the Matrix movie? what's up with guns? why are they so steampunkish?
Brother None said:
They had a 7-year-old-sized suit of power armour that was just lying about, so they figured, what the heck.
Mord_Sith
Mildly Dipped
As if Tactics' method wasn't bad enough, now we got aliens running amok, the only thing that's missing is a stainless steel Delorian that can only go 87 miles per hour, Chevy Chase, and attacks that show in big bold letters and starbursts behind the words Piff, Pow, Blam, or Smack.
D
Deleted member 53669
Guest
.....
I think BN's rant just stirred up something cathartic inside my soul.
The story also, in hindsight, sounds like the backstory to the creation of the BOS, with the Migration from the SAD to the compound. Who the fuck knows. The hypothesis that the Dev is making could be alot better, but I do understand where He's going with this... The correct assumption would be that a Small Recon party of BOS Paladins trekked toward DC, and then Rebeled against BOS authority, BOS labeled them as such, and then they set up their own authority.
Anyways, Indeed. I produced a better backstory about Nazi Bowlers in 5 Minutes than this guy did in... wait... 4 months?
I hope this isn't final...
Back to Jews in Space.... I'm going to make a Mel Brooks Character in Mass Effect now.
I think BN's rant just stirred up something cathartic inside my soul.
The story also, in hindsight, sounds like the backstory to the creation of the BOS, with the Migration from the SAD to the compound. Who the fuck knows. The hypothesis that the Dev is making could be alot better, but I do understand where He's going with this... The correct assumption would be that a Small Recon party of BOS Paladins trekked toward DC, and then Rebeled against BOS authority, BOS labeled them as such, and then they set up their own authority.
Anyways, Indeed. I produced a better backstory about Nazi Bowlers in 5 Minutes than this guy did in... wait... 4 months?
I hope this isn't final...
Back to Jews in Space.... I'm going to make a Mel Brooks Character in Mass Effect now.
DarkCorp
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
More and more like bethesda needs to retcon stories to fit their way of doing fallout3, aka apocalypse morrowind.
PaladinHeart
Mildly Dipped
MrBumble said:
They kinda hint that they might not actually be super mutants, but something else...
They're called the Brotherhood of Steel, except they're not like the Brotherhood of Steel.
They're called supermutants, except they're not like supermutants.
It's called Fallout, except it's not like Fallout.
*sigh* ...I'm beginning to see a pattern here. I'd rather not, though.
They're called supermutants, except they're not like supermutants.
It's called Fallout, except it's not like Fallout.
*sigh* ...I'm beginning to see a pattern here. I'd rather not, though.
For some reason, the thing that scared me the most in reading that was the "technological marvel" they found. I hope it's not some "mystical magical device" like the GECK, that can bring life to the wasteland and blablabla.
Wonder if we can explore the ruins of the Pentagon though.
The biggest problem I have with the article all in all is simply the inclusion of the BoS and Super Mutants. Thing is for me, that even if the backstory was well written, it'd still feel forced that the BoS and Muties are around and kicking on the East Coast. It feels like they're shoehorning them to make it Fallout.
The sad thing is that I actually wanted to see what new stuff could invent for the East Coast. Instead, they're inventing new stuff in terms of gameplay (which I don't like at all) and seems to keep the "story related" material from the older Fallouts despite it being on the East Coast. I would've liked it to be the other way around.
I actually like the basic idea of the squadron being "cut off" from the rest of the faction, I think there is some good potential there definetely. But the circumstances are all wrong. Even though it takes place some timeafter Fallout 2 (which I think could definetely justify a change of attitude, even in the case of the BoS, possibly brought on by certain events that could've happened in the wasteland), it still doesn't click. And THEN you bring on the fact that the Super Mutants are there as well, and... yeah.
Wonder if we can explore the ruins of the Pentagon though.
The biggest problem I have with the article all in all is simply the inclusion of the BoS and Super Mutants. Thing is for me, that even if the backstory was well written, it'd still feel forced that the BoS and Muties are around and kicking on the East Coast. It feels like they're shoehorning them to make it Fallout.
The sad thing is that I actually wanted to see what new stuff could invent for the East Coast. Instead, they're inventing new stuff in terms of gameplay (which I don't like at all) and seems to keep the "story related" material from the older Fallouts despite it being on the East Coast. I would've liked it to be the other way around.
I actually like the basic idea of the squadron being "cut off" from the rest of the faction, I think there is some good potential there definetely. But the circumstances are all wrong. Even though it takes place some timeafter Fallout 2 (which I think could definetely justify a change of attitude, even in the case of the BoS, possibly brought on by certain events that could've happened in the wasteland), it still doesn't click. And THEN you bring on the fact that the Super Mutants are there as well, and... yeah.
PaladinHeart
Mildly Dipped
Yeah. I think it's just an excuse for the mutants to look the way they do, and so they won't have to remake them to look more like the original Super Mutants from Fallout.
As for the BoS thing.. Maybe they should change it. I remember Markus talked about himself and that paladin fighting a long time. Why would they do that if the brotherhood wasn't interested in hunting down the Super Mutants? Anyway, we don't really know ALL of the BoS's attitudes toward outsiders. Did you know that the non-talking head guy outside there gives you some anti-rad medicine if you're an idiot when you're sent to the glow? Yeah... So there's at least 2 BoS members that care about outsiders.
I think it could be likely they would send a patrol out to DC. Then again, it is a long way. It's on the other side of the country, yes? It would be years before the BoS would even consider expanding that far. Not to mention there are probably hundreds if not thousands of equally interesting places they would be more interested in scouting, before even thinking of DC.
They should just change it. Make up a new name for their group and leave the BoS alone... They can always have the BoS in another game set closer to California.
Why not say this new group is part of a different military sect that has always been interested in trying to keep the various towns safe? I'm sure they could even have similar ideals to the original BoS, but their name would be different. They would know little to nothing of the west coast's happenings. Heck I don't even think the super mutants could have made it to the eastern coast. Those should be something else too. Bethesda needs some people who can think up something more creative I guess.
If they need ideas, then how about (to replace the BoS name):
The Watchmen
DC Overlords (or just Overlords)
The Steel Order (or Order of Steel)
Silver Guardians
Well that's just some random stuff off the top of my head, but it's better than saying they're BoS and risking BN's verbal wrath. xD
As for the Super Mutants. They don't really look like Super Mutants. Just call them mutants and have their origins different. In the game the locals could refer to them as demons, death, or umm.. whatever. Maybe someone sees something like looks like them in a comic or magazine and refers to them as yellow hulks or orcs.. haha... hah.. ha.. >.>
As for the BoS thing.. Maybe they should change it. I remember Markus talked about himself and that paladin fighting a long time. Why would they do that if the brotherhood wasn't interested in hunting down the Super Mutants? Anyway, we don't really know ALL of the BoS's attitudes toward outsiders. Did you know that the non-talking head guy outside there gives you some anti-rad medicine if you're an idiot when you're sent to the glow? Yeah... So there's at least 2 BoS members that care about outsiders.
I think it could be likely they would send a patrol out to DC. Then again, it is a long way. It's on the other side of the country, yes? It would be years before the BoS would even consider expanding that far. Not to mention there are probably hundreds if not thousands of equally interesting places they would be more interested in scouting, before even thinking of DC.
They should just change it. Make up a new name for their group and leave the BoS alone... They can always have the BoS in another game set closer to California.
Why not say this new group is part of a different military sect that has always been interested in trying to keep the various towns safe? I'm sure they could even have similar ideals to the original BoS, but their name would be different. They would know little to nothing of the west coast's happenings. Heck I don't even think the super mutants could have made it to the eastern coast. Those should be something else too. Bethesda needs some people who can think up something more creative I guess.
If they need ideas, then how about (to replace the BoS name):
The Watchmen
DC Overlords (or just Overlords)
The Steel Order (or Order of Steel)
Silver Guardians
Well that's just some random stuff off the top of my head, but it's better than saying they're BoS and risking BN's verbal wrath. xD
As for the Super Mutants. They don't really look like Super Mutants. Just call them mutants and have their origins different. In the game the locals could refer to them as demons, death, or umm.. whatever. Maybe someone sees something like looks like them in a comic or magazine and refers to them as yellow hulks or orcs.. haha... hah.. ha.. >.>
It's not that the concept art is bad (I actually rather like some the designs)... it's that it's totally not Fallout. As has been pointed at many times already, it's much, much more steampunk-ish or HR Giger than retro-50's. I like steampunk, but Fallout isn't steampunk. C'mon Beth.
And that story for the BoS trekking across the entire friggin' country is ridiculous. Plus, they're obsessed with preserving technology and keeping it to themselves so that others don't misuse it. They do not, as a whole, make a point of, or even feign interest in, being the noble protectors of the wasteland, or risk splintering and possibly losing a huge number of their forces to aquire more (especially 3500 freakin' miles away). Now I love the BoS, I really do. One of my favorite parts of FO1. Heck, if I were doing a story for a new FO game, I might include a renegade Brotherhood knight or whatever who's decided to try and use the BoS's power to help others. But I wouldn't make such an absurd reach as has been done here, and I would barely consider myself an amateur writer.
And, I think Brother None is slowly metamorphosing into Brother Rosh. o_o
And that story for the BoS trekking across the entire friggin' country is ridiculous. Plus, they're obsessed with preserving technology and keeping it to themselves so that others don't misuse it. They do not, as a whole, make a point of, or even feign interest in, being the noble protectors of the wasteland, or risk splintering and possibly losing a huge number of their forces to aquire more (especially 3500 freakin' miles away). Now I love the BoS, I really do. One of my favorite parts of FO1. Heck, if I were doing a story for a new FO game, I might include a renegade Brotherhood knight or whatever who's decided to try and use the BoS's power to help others. But I wouldn't make such an absurd reach as has been done here, and I would barely consider myself an amateur writer.
And, I think Brother None is slowly metamorphosing into Brother Rosh. o_o
DOOMHAMMER
First time out of the vault
I don't feel the 50s in their designs
And as for their Brotherhood of Steel? Its Fallout Tactics all over again
And as for their Brotherhood of Steel? Its Fallout Tactics all over again