SouthboundSoul
First time out of the vault
I can see why someone would enjoy it, but it didn't deserve all the hype. It was basically Fallout 3 with better graphics and a fantasy theme. Bethesda have been making the same game for 10 years.
Plot-holes and logical inconsistencies of FO3?
- Thread starter Anarchosyn
- Start date
First time out of the vault
WillisPDunlevey said:
Actually, after completing it, I sort of liked the questline. After all, you aren't really promoted to Archmage: you're installed there as a figurehead by the Psijic Order, because you proved yourself to be a controllable, obedient pawn.
chaosapiant
It Wandered In From the Wastes
I've been playing F3 again recently and really enjoying it. Even though New Vegas makes this games flaws MUCH more apparent. However, i've come up with a mental little work around that helps me enjoy Fallout 3 MUCH more when it comes to the story:
The Capital was obviously bombed MUCH more vigorously because it's the Capital, as such life has had a much harder time of springing up, unlike back in the west. Due to the severe radiation, lack of unradiated food and drinking water and constant attacks by insane (literally) raiders and wildlife, MOST citizens of the Capital Wasteland are little more than primitive morons similar to our caveman ancestors. Everytime I talk to an NPC in Fallout 3, I feel like Luke Wilson in "Idiocracy." I feel like an average intelligence guy around a LOT of below average intelligence people who I am constantly wowing with my pedestrian means of handling the simplest of problems. That bomb in Megaton? I just flipped a switch that I read about in the vault. Arefu? "Stop being assholes guys, and they'll give you blood packs." "Amazing solution, you are enlightened, here's how to be a vampire..." I could go on. Fallout 3 is so stupid in parts that it wraps back around itself and actually becomes a very immersive and entertaining game. The ONLY problem with the game, as far as I can tell, is that it was not designed to be this way.
The Capital was obviously bombed MUCH more vigorously because it's the Capital, as such life has had a much harder time of springing up, unlike back in the west. Due to the severe radiation, lack of unradiated food and drinking water and constant attacks by insane (literally) raiders and wildlife, MOST citizens of the Capital Wasteland are little more than primitive morons similar to our caveman ancestors. Everytime I talk to an NPC in Fallout 3, I feel like Luke Wilson in "Idiocracy." I feel like an average intelligence guy around a LOT of below average intelligence people who I am constantly wowing with my pedestrian means of handling the simplest of problems. That bomb in Megaton? I just flipped a switch that I read about in the vault. Arefu? "Stop being assholes guys, and they'll give you blood packs." "Amazing solution, you are enlightened, here's how to be a vampire..." I could go on. Fallout 3 is so stupid in parts that it wraps back around itself and actually becomes a very immersive and entertaining game. The ONLY problem with the game, as far as I can tell, is that it was not designed to be this way.
Joelzania
Look, Ma! Two Heads!
If the east coast was bombed more heavily, then why are almost all buildings still standing? You would walk about in the core region with hardly anything tall standing.
chaosapiant
It Wandered In From the Wastes
Joelzania said:
Because any game designer worth their salt has to emphasize fun over realism sometimes. A completely flat piece of bed rock would not be a fun place to explore.
Languorous_Maiar
A Smooth-Skin
chaosapiant,
Washington wasn't bombed harder than other big cities. Salt Lake City for example was destroyed entirely, leaving only craters. Or how Vegas would end in every nuke will hit it? Los Angeles not without reason was called Boneyard, most people in this arena were those from master's vault.
Actually, Beth just ignored something called "realism within universe".
Washington wasn't bombed harder than other big cities. Salt Lake City for example was destroyed entirely, leaving only craters. Or how Vegas would end in every nuke will hit it? Los Angeles not without reason was called Boneyard, most people in this arena were those from master's vault.
Actually, Beth just ignored something called "realism within universe".
Keep in mind aside from the monuments (and even those are in question) we don't know what the structural system was in DC in 2077. Seeing that the Fallout Universe is different from ours there could be different types of reinforcements since paranoia was high at the time, much like how where I live in CA all buildings new and old must be either constructed or retrofitted to meet a strict seismic code. this picture of Nagasaki shows several buildings (and this was 1930's-40's maybe even earlier construction) still standing, granted Fat Man was only 10Kt vs the 200-750Kt weapons used during the great war.
and a picture of Hiroshima showing a building that is almost untouched
"Blast effect is a volume effect. The blast wave deposits energy in the material it passes through, including air. When the blast wave passes through solid material, the energy left behind causes damage. The more matter the energy travels through, the smaller the effect."
In other words, large office buildings such as those in DC have more matter for the energy to travel through (walls, furniture, etc..) which would dissipate the shock wave causing *gasp* less physical damage. To say DC should be a smoking crater is just being ignorant.... (WAITS FOR THE ANGRY MOB ARMED WITH PITCHFORKS AND TORCHES)
and a picture of Hiroshima showing a building that is almost untouched
"Blast effect is a volume effect. The blast wave deposits energy in the material it passes through, including air. When the blast wave passes through solid material, the energy left behind causes damage. The more matter the energy travels through, the smaller the effect."
In other words, large office buildings such as those in DC have more matter for the energy to travel through (walls, furniture, etc..) which would dissipate the shock wave causing *gasp* less physical damage. To say DC should be a smoking crater is just being ignorant.... (WAITS FOR THE ANGRY MOB ARMED WITH PITCHFORKS AND TORCHES)
One more note, the bombs used in the war were most likely neutron bombs which have far more bite than bark. That is to say they produce far more destructive fallout at the expense of less damage. The problem with this however, is that we ope the door to another inconsistency that would reach across ALL FO games whic his the radiation blast from a neutron bomb is capable of penetrating underground bunkers I/E vaults.
What makes it great? I can't find any good point from skyrim.CaveJohnson said:
All the stuffs are looking great. But it isn't good. For quest, it is degenerated. Lots of quests are reminds me daggerfall: Lots of quests but same things to do-> go to dungeon get some POS.
Making looks great, making some potion, making some sword. but it ruins game not enhance the game.
Dungeons are looks awsome but Skyrims dungeon is just passage to kill some monster and get some POS.
Joelzania
Look, Ma! Two Heads!
woo1108 said:
You can mod your waifu into it? Um...
good point.
Alesia, while your reasoning is good you should look at it from an artistic point of view.
Does a major metropolis like Washington DC still mostly standing after a nuclear war give you the impression that the United States was hit hard during a nuclear war two hundred years ago, giving the feeling that it was a very destructive conflict?
Or does a location barely resembling a city, more like a large collection of craters with some twisted iron 'skeletons' and half the part of a structure at best invoke 'nuclear war' in your mind?
Some of the ways why Washington DC felt so stupid was because most of the buildings were rather boarded than destroyed, and most of the major roads closed of by rubble you can not climb over.
Does a major metropolis like Washington DC still mostly standing after a nuclear war give you the impression that the United States was hit hard during a nuclear war two hundred years ago, giving the feeling that it was a very destructive conflict?
Or does a location barely resembling a city, more like a large collection of craters with some twisted iron 'skeletons' and half the part of a structure at best invoke 'nuclear war' in your mind?
Some of the ways why Washington DC felt so stupid was because most of the buildings were rather boarded than destroyed, and most of the major roads closed of by rubble you can not climb over.
Reinforced concrete blown to bits but still mostly standing is fine. The 200 year old wood framed houses up the road is what bothered me.
Random interesting gameplay mechanic just popped into my head:
Some sort of chance for old ass building to collapse on top of you while scavenging. You might walk in and hear lots of creaking of wood or crumbling of supports. Then by disturbing area X, the entire structure starts to collapse. (walking into walls/supports, running around upstairs, things like that)
Random interesting gameplay mechanic just popped into my head:
Some sort of chance for old ass building to collapse on top of you while scavenging. You might walk in and hear lots of creaking of wood or crumbling of supports. Then by disturbing area X, the entire structure starts to collapse. (walking into walls/supports, running around upstairs, things like that)
Wood framed houses are a tricky thing. Springvale for all intents and purposes SHOULD just be the concrete/brick foundations. The fact that there's a river means there's still a water cycle I/E rain/snow/fog which would rot the frames within two decades, probably sooner. Homes such as those in Minefield though (depends on FO universe technology) if they had metal siding and asphalt shingles would last so long as termites/moisture were kept to a minimum which are the two big killers of wood. Take excessive moisture out of the picture and a wood house has the possibility of lasting 600 years or more. The houses you mention just up the road from concrete buildings are a victim of the shrunken game map. Possibly they were outside the main blast zone where they would just receive minor structural damage and broken windows.
"Does a major metropolis like Washington DC still mostly standing after a nuclear war give you the impression that the United States was hit hard during a nuclear war two hundred years ago, giving the feeling that it was a very destructive conflict? "
My artistic vision is low at best. Again depends what type of bombs were used. As I stated, if China/USSR were using low yield neutron bombs the damage would not be as severe as high yield A bombs which would leave no traces of city behind. Neutron bombs also explain how some areas, especially direct hit zones still have high levels of radiation. If you want to get really technical, take a look at those pussy warheads you detonate during Lonesome Road. What's their blast radius? A few feet? Maybe a football field? If that was the power of the great war no wonder stuff is still standing.
What DOES bother me is:
A.) If you detonate Megaton, why is Springvale, the school, Silver's house, and the Super Duper mart still standing?
B.) Why is there so many newspapers and other papers all over, they should have rotted away long ago. Yes we do find 2,000 year old scrolls from The Bible intact but they are fragile and will crumble if not handled properly.
C.) Cigarettes. How are they still good and what are they being lit with? Benny has a lighter but where does the butane come from?
D.) Food. Sugar Bombs are still edible? My company was contracted to clean out a home that had been abandoned for two years and a box of Frosted Flakes was more like moldy cereal dust. Cram & beans not being riddled with botulism or whatever is inside isn't just a deteriorated mess? And don't get me started on the apparent TV dinners left unfrozen for 200 years that are somehow edible. Even the non pre war food is iffy. Iguana? How does a non native species last two centuries after nuclear holocaust?
"Does a major metropolis like Washington DC still mostly standing after a nuclear war give you the impression that the United States was hit hard during a nuclear war two hundred years ago, giving the feeling that it was a very destructive conflict? "
My artistic vision is low at best. Again depends what type of bombs were used. As I stated, if China/USSR were using low yield neutron bombs the damage would not be as severe as high yield A bombs which would leave no traces of city behind. Neutron bombs also explain how some areas, especially direct hit zones still have high levels of radiation. If you want to get really technical, take a look at those pussy warheads you detonate during Lonesome Road. What's their blast radius? A few feet? Maybe a football field? If that was the power of the great war no wonder stuff is still standing.
What DOES bother me is:
A.) If you detonate Megaton, why is Springvale, the school, Silver's house, and the Super Duper mart still standing?
B.) Why is there so many newspapers and other papers all over, they should have rotted away long ago. Yes we do find 2,000 year old scrolls from The Bible intact but they are fragile and will crumble if not handled properly.
C.) Cigarettes. How are they still good and what are they being lit with? Benny has a lighter but where does the butane come from?
D.) Food. Sugar Bombs are still edible? My company was contracted to clean out a home that had been abandoned for two years and a box of Frosted Flakes was more like moldy cereal dust. Cram & beans not being riddled with botulism or whatever is inside isn't just a deteriorated mess? And don't get me started on the apparent TV dinners left unfrozen for 200 years that are somehow edible. Even the non pre war food is iffy. Iguana? How does a non native species last two centuries after nuclear holocaust?
I also dont understand the argument that because people on the west coast have their shit together in the fallout universe that means the east coast should be doing alot better than depicted in FO3
Its like saying Somalia or Haiti should be sending astronauts into space because others have done it
Its like saying Somalia or Haiti should be sending astronauts into space because others have done it
We argue about this because Fo3 lore ruins lots of things of west coast.Beavis said:
I'd want to say to Fo3's fanboy "I dont understand the argument that because people on the east coast have their shit itself in the fallout universe that means the west coast should be doing same things depicted in FO3
Its like saying USA or japan should be eat worse because Somalia have done it."
Just because one region on the OTHER SIDE of the country is different doesn't ruin the lore. Hell where I live things are different just driving 50mi east in to Nevada and we haven't even had a nuclear apocalypse. Radiation levels, reliable food/water sources, and so on can all hinder the development of human civilization all together or alter the way in which it forms.
I'd want to say to Fo3's fanboy "I dont understand the argument that because people on the east coast have their shit itself in the fallout universe that means the west coast should be doing same things depicted in FO3
Its like saying USA or japan should be eat worse because Somalia have done it."
Nobody said the west had to be in the shit because the east is nor emulate FO:3 in any way. Referring back to my initial paragraph it would be utterly ridiculous to say that the entirety of civilization should develop at the exact same pace lacking a national infrastructure and reliable coast to coast communication.
I'd want to say to Fo3's fanboy "I dont understand the argument that because people on the east coast have their shit itself in the fallout universe that means the west coast should be doing same things depicted in FO3
Its like saying USA or japan should be eat worse because Somalia have done it."
Nobody said the west had to be in the shit because the east is nor emulate FO:3 in any way. Referring back to my initial paragraph it would be utterly ridiculous to say that the entirety of civilization should develop at the exact same pace lacking a national infrastructure and reliable coast to coast communication.
Oppen
FIXT n°1 fan
You can live no more than a few days without water. Water in the east coast is radiactive, with almost no exception. Radiactivity from the water should kill almost any human in less than three years (according to game mechanics, since drinking radiactive water will probably give you at least 1 rad, and you need to drink a little bit everyday, and 1000 rads means either certain death or ghoulification), but you see several settlements and lots of people. Yes, it's true, the west coast having their shit together doesn't imply the east coast having it, but there are some things where you have a hard deadline to put it together. Obtaining water is one of them. Of course, there will always be outliers, there will be SOME people living, but not several settlements. You could argue there will always be radaway. But it's not true, if you didn't even manage to get clean water, I wouldn't expect you get to manufacture radaway (a hint, since it looks liquid, there is a high chance you need water to produce it anyway), and prewar supplies are limited, since prewar factories are not working. And, after 200 years, it's pretty likely it will be scarce. You could say the cave fungus might solve it, then, but it's considered something novel, and probably only the kids in that cave know about them. So, that means a single settlement, maybe the nearest towns, will have access to a natural radiation cure in the area.
For reference, in Fallout 1 you have 150 days without a reliable source of clean water until your vault is considered doomed. And that's how it fucks up the lore for the west coast, how is it that there you have 150 days when the east coast survived 200 damned years?
For reference, in Fallout 1 you have 150 days without a reliable source of clean water until your vault is considered doomed. And that's how it fucks up the lore for the west coast, how is it that there you have 150 days when the east coast survived 200 damned years?