Per, am I wrong if I say that those people should immediately be expelled from their jobs and never be allowed near game journalism again?
Plot-holes and logical inconsistencies of FO3?
- Thread starter Anarchosyn
- Start date
Walpknut
This ghoul has seen it all
If you are going to add Pokemon to the list at least don't put the most basic games of the franchise, the ones full of bugs, limited movesets and unrefined game mechanichs and add one of the newer ones like BW2 or HGSS.
Earth
Vault Senior Citizen
Per said:
I like a number of those games (and hate a few of them...skyrim) but I would never consider most (if any) of those games to be RPGs. Why is it so hard to see the difference between an RPG and JRPG? WHY?typical consoletard's RPG list.
poke' mon? hell...no
I like pokemon but I don't think it's good RPG.
Chrono trigger is good. I admit but I prefer Romancing saga series.
Persona4 is fun but SMT 1,2,3 or persona 1,2 is far better RPG than Persona 3 or 4.
Super mario RPG? I looks pretty good but it's good aspects are close to platformer than RPG. It's fancy game and enjoyable but as a RPG? don't know.
Funny thing is that there are no CRPG at all!
Did he played Fallout 1,2 or TES3 or other Masterpiece RPG?
Makta
The DICKtator
I'm kinda disturbed how no one has mentioned Deus Ex:HR on that list.. That is one of the biggest nono's i could see 
CthuluIsSpy
A Smooth-Skin
Makta said:I'm kinda disturbed how no one has mentioned Deus Ex:HR on that list.. That is one of the biggest nono's i could see
Ai, people need to know the difference between a RPG and a game with RPG elements.
Deus Ex HR falls in the latter category.
The Witcher 2 falls in the former.
Skyrim is less of a RPG than Deus Ex HR, imo. It's closer to an adventure game.
But yeah, in general "Top 10 X of all time" lists are usually erroneous.
Mothership_Zeta said:
Phineas Gage.
Speaking as one of those who DID enjoy Fallout 3 (Yes, even Mothership Zeta) I can generally find handwaves and justifications for a lot of "unrealistic elements of the game but I have a few points in the main quest that I have YET to see decent justifications for. Mainly, why the hell doesn't James just open the goddamn bulkhead and let his child, who ALREADY wiped out more power armored Enclave soldiers then are eve IN that Rotunda (Serious, there are like TWO plus Autumn in that Rotunda and you have to get past at east five, probably more, to actually get there). it's made even worse by the fact that, if you make a B-Line for the Bulkhead you can get there before it closes and get inside! There is literally NO reason for James to die! For that matter he could have also just surrendered and given them the purifier. Not only did Autumn plan to use it for the EXACT SAME PURPOSE! But. even if they didn't, IT DIDN'T FUCKING WORK! Seriously they didn't have the Code OR the GECK! Dad and the scientists could have just given them what they wanted and either taken the purifier back later or, since they had the same goal,, just let Autumn take over the project! OK, next, Lamplight and Vault 87. I can find reasonable justification for a settlement of ids right next to Super Mutant central but as soon as you're kidnapped by the Enclave questions start to be raised. First, it is ENTIRELY possible with sufficient speed to escape the blast radius of the trap. Second of all. HOW THE FUCK DDI THEY GET IN TO VAULT 87? Seriously! the positioning implies that they came in through the heavily irradiated entrance but, even assuming they had a way to negate such high levels of radiation, THE DOOR WAS PERMANENTLY SEALED! Are you telling me that Autumn waded through lethal levels of radiation in his goddamn overcoat and had time to pry the Vault door open? I could live with a just explaining it as them having gone through lamplight and the ids having hidden but the positioning of the ambush heavily implies they came through the front door. Finally, HOW THE FUCK DID AUTUMN AND ANNA HOLT SURVIVE THE ROTUNDA!? I mean, the radiation levels were enough to instantly kill two power armored Enclave soldiers so how did an unprotected scientist and a guy in an overcoat survive that? Now, moving on to Raven Rock. What was Nathan doing in that holding cell? Why can't you rescue him? This is comparatively minor but it still bugs the crap out of me.The next issue is, What was the point of the Encounter with that officer once you exit your cell?I mean, you have to fight/sneak your way through Raven Rock regardless so it just seems redundant. Next item, You manage to gain control of Eden so why is your only option to blow up the potentially VERY useful high tech base with AI technology that can be found in maybe ONE other place in DC not to mention all the robots, power armor, and other useful tech in the place. Movingon from that, why exactly would you WANT to use the modified FEV?It doesn't make sense even for evil characters because, by that point, you KNOW you're not a "pure" human from a vault and even assuming you were the whole plan makes absolutely NO sense from a genetic standpoint. Organisms mutate, it's what they do! Even the"purest"of Vault or Enclave specimens have probably mutated to be significant genetically different from their ancestors and, even assuming this modified FEV is made with current generation Enclave in mind.This still means future generations of Enclave who are susceptible to natural mutation are screwed! And people say the brotherhood are short-sighted. Now, on to Take It Back. Most of my issues here are solved with Broken Steel but some of my reoccurring issues still crop up. Why are we fighting again? Autumn's goals are IDENTICAL! Even assuming that they aren't and that they still want to poison the purifier. How are they going to do that? Raven Rock is effectively gone so they don't have any modified FEV so why not just let them finish what you started? They seem better equipped to deal with distribution and logistics then the understaffed Brotherhood.
Something i would have liked to see is bethesda sticking to the west coast and pacing the games as a movement from west to east instead of that giant leap they made right to the capital, it kind of killed the fallout franchise that way.
The van buren title was the right idea, having a new adventure with an all new central character and the experiences they have in the post apocolyptic america, introduce a new faction (the legion) and already established factions (NCR and Brotherhood) and you would be able to make future installments go a little faster as to how quickly the capital would have been reached, old tech would be rediscovered and new tech and sources of energy are created as a means to reclaim and get across the continent at an ever faster rate, the DC area could have been an ultimate goal for those factions that had appeared in the aftermath of the war, and only the most powerful factions would be meeting in DC to ultimately square off.
But nope, Beth wanted to do their own thing and remake fallout their way, because "darn it the name is OURS now!" and look what we got with fallout 3. I will always think of fallout 3 as a spinoff and new vegas as the true fallout sucessor to the 2nd game.
The van buren title was the right idea, having a new adventure with an all new central character and the experiences they have in the post apocolyptic america, introduce a new faction (the legion) and already established factions (NCR and Brotherhood) and you would be able to make future installments go a little faster as to how quickly the capital would have been reached, old tech would be rediscovered and new tech and sources of energy are created as a means to reclaim and get across the continent at an ever faster rate, the DC area could have been an ultimate goal for those factions that had appeared in the aftermath of the war, and only the most powerful factions would be meeting in DC to ultimately square off.
But nope, Beth wanted to do their own thing and remake fallout their way, because "darn it the name is OURS now!" and look what we got with fallout 3. I will always think of fallout 3 as a spinoff and new vegas as the true fallout sucessor to the 2nd game.
Censor
Huh?
Actually, I thought that moving to the East Coast, or any place different than the West Coast at least, was a sound decision by Bethesda.
Personally, I was pretty sure they would mess things up anyway so I'm glad they didn't revisit the West. But for Bethesda, moving to the East Coast made sure they could tell their own Fallout story and come up with their own factions and mutants (an oppertunity which Bethesda completely messed up). Since Fallout 1 and 2 were created by a completely different team, trying to recreate their Fallout settings and 'feel' would be very, very difficult for Bethesda. So, making something completely new wasn't a bad thing in my opinion. Too bad the 'good' stopped right after that decision to move to the East Coast, though.
Tiny Tim
Still Mildly Glowing
Gravedigging!
I love finding plot holes and logical inconsistencies in fallout 3 because there's so many of them and they are so wonderfully silly but are sometimes easy to miss. I think it's because the story is character-driven and the protagonists ( amata, dad, li, lyons etc ) don't react to them so you just play along like the good dog you are. Anyway, here's one.
How do the prisoners get into vault 87?
We've pointed this issue many times about the enclave coming in from the front door, but it's much funnier with the captives really. The problem is this :
The mutants exist because they kidnap people, take them to vault 87 and turn them into mutants ( yes yes this is illogical by itself seeing as how they have no plan and aren't intelligent enough to talk, let alone make that kind of experiment ). But how do the captives get in? Not through the front door, surely! The radiation levels there are lethal, as scribe rothschild explains, which is why you can't go through there yourself. Maybe the enclave somehow found a way to ignore the radiation but there's no way random wastelanders would survive it.
So, through lamplight? Highly unlikely.
This is somewhat important because if captives have no way to get in alive, how do the muties continue existing?
I love finding plot holes and logical inconsistencies in fallout 3 because there's so many of them and they are so wonderfully silly but are sometimes easy to miss. I think it's because the story is character-driven and the protagonists ( amata, dad, li, lyons etc ) don't react to them so you just play along like the good dog you are. Anyway, here's one.
How do the prisoners get into vault 87?
We've pointed this issue many times about the enclave coming in from the front door, but it's much funnier with the captives really. The problem is this :
The mutants exist because they kidnap people, take them to vault 87 and turn them into mutants ( yes yes this is illogical by itself seeing as how they have no plan and aren't intelligent enough to talk, let alone make that kind of experiment ). But how do the captives get in? Not through the front door, surely! The radiation levels there are lethal, as scribe rothschild explains, which is why you can't go through there yourself. Maybe the enclave somehow found a way to ignore the radiation but there's no way random wastelanders would survive it.
So, through lamplight? Highly unlikely.
This is somewhat important because if captives have no way to get in alive, how do the muties continue existing?
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Prone Squanderer
A bit of a Sillius Soddus.
D'y'know I have never thought of that before. Erm.....secret tunnel in the Overseer's office?
I don't know. @CT Phipps will have an answer for you.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
I have a few ideas on the subject.
They take the prisoners at Big Town to the police station so I imagine the transformation is actually done on site. Elder Lyons and company would probably not have nearly the same level of trouble finding the base of the Super Mutants if they were constantly dragging people back to the place. No, they don't have any FEV pits but these are a different kind of Super Mutant than the Master's anyway.
D
Deleted member 93956
Guest
Why would be the same, look near the same (shitpuke yellow!), and be SUPER MUTANTS if they aren't? They are transformed into super soldiers becouse of radiation or looking at them funny?
And if these mutants are as stupid as they are, why would they mask their base so well (Nevermind secret passageways, apparently).
Tiny Tim
Still Mildly Glowing
But there are captives in vault 87, raiders and such. Even some alive dudes, and failed experiments too. The mutants don't have FEV pits but they do talk about the "green stuff" ( lol, that was hilarious by the way. It's like they were too stupid to know what FEV is and called it "green stuff" but were somehow intelligent enough to turn people into mutants with it! You can't make that shit up) and i think it was clear that the transformation took place in those chambers in Vault's 87 Lab and not in germantown police station or anywhere else.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
They're still people dipped in FEV but the Master refined his process while this is the result of the scientists at Vault-Tech, possibly working in conjunction with West-Tek (test subjects?) some decades years earlier and not possessed of a superhuman shoggoth's brilliance.
Also, the Super Mutants are violent and crude but not stupid. You can be all three. Fawkes and others shows the Yellow Lemon Super Mutants are capable of being intellectuals while still murderously dangerous.
Certainly, they've dug in (literally) and used military tactics and organization to drive the East Coast BOS to the brink of extinction.
True, I suppose there has to be another entrance. You have proven the more knowledgeable.
Prone Squanderer
A bit of a Sillius Soddus.
The game shows the FEV chambers people are mutated in. Also how would the Super Mutants transport the little FEV they have left to the police station and why?
EDIT:
Fallout 3's Super Mutants are not stupid...ok I'm done.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
They don't speak English very well and are extremely aggressive cannibals but that's not, in itself, a sign of stupidity. Certainly, they've got a nice set up going on where they're farming humans from Little Lamplight to Big Town and harvesting them as new Super Mutants. They've also got an organized campaign for the extermination of the BoS. They've also managed to keep their Vault operating for two centuries.
Tiny Tim
Still Mildly Glowing
I read that in the voice of elder lyons
Prone Squanderer
A bit of a Sillius Soddus.
They're clearly not that bright.
Aside from Red and that other guy kidnapped from Big Town, there's no indication they're regularly kidnapping folks going from Lamplight to Big Town.
As for an organized campaign to exterminate the BoS, they aren't doing a good job of it considering they're too spread out D.C.
All the Vaults in the game are functioning in one way or another. Even 92, with nothing but Bloatflies and Mirelurks in it still has power and water running in it.