0wing
Все умрут, а я волномут
The point is, BIS stopped at this quest and washed their hands of that part of post-nuclear world.
Repairing Fallout's story from Bethesda
- Thread starter Bloodway
- Start date
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
Well, I was just pointing out that we know stimpacks can be manufactured since we can craft them in-game and that the Followers can be given manufactured chems. There could be a lot of stimpacks on the East Coast simply because of the following factors:
1. Population density on the East Coast is much-much smaller due to the lack of civilization
2. The Commonwealth is a region covered in flowers and vegetation so manufacturing isn't that hard.
3. Perversely, while the West Coast was utterly flattened in Fallout 3, large numbers of building and infrastructure is intact on the East Coast.
If the United States was preparing for a ground invasion, they may have manufactured millions if not billions of stimpacks.
SarcasticGoodGuy
*R O T T E N*
Keyword being "if"
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
True. Albeit, they did prepare in a lot of other ways like the Enclave's retreats and fortifying Washington D.C. so it was apparently remade of super-crete which can take direct nuclear explosions.
SarcasticGoodGuy
*R O T T E N*
You don't have to do Bethesda's job for them is all I'm saying. If this was the case they should've said it themselves. The point made was that there is an abundance of stimpacks but no reason given- it's good to come up with your own reasons, but you shouldn't have to. I don't have to put the missing pieces together in other Fallout games. I like when a game makes you think, I don't like it when the developers make you do their job for them.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
I actually liked Fallout 3 in large part because they did throw in details like this. That the reason the Washington Monument and other buildings were standing up was because they'd been fortified. That the reason computers and other things were still working was automated underground power plants. I feel like this level of attention to detail wasn't DEEP but it was THERE and even if it was a handwave as to why things were like this, it showed they cared.
SarcasticGoodGuy
*R O T T E N*
Yeah, I can tell Bethesda tried with Fallout 3. A lot of its flaws are inoffensive, others are not *Mothershit Zeta*. Fallout 4 they made 4 dungeons, copied and pasted them across the map and called it a day.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
If I were to make a list of the various things I would love Bethesda to have a Fallout 3 "Bible" on it would be the following. I've thrown in some hypothetical examples I'd like to see made canon.
1. How did the Enclave get to Raven Rock?
Dick Richardson had been in touch with John Henry Eden for some time and had planned to establish an Enclave base at Raven Rock well before the Mariposa incident. As such, they had long-distance Vertibirds established with a refueling point in Chicago. The evauation plan moved all of the Enclave's children and a large portion of its surviving soldiers and scientists to Raven's Rock. A few chose to stay behind and fight NCR's forces like Arcade's guardians.
2. How is Jet a Pre-War Drug?
Myron was a gifted chemist but not a particularly workaholic one. Myron modified a pre-existing form of Jet to become the impossibly addictive version found in Fallout 2. It is notable the Pre-War version is not as addictive in the same way Myron's was. It is also not nearly as dangerous or lethal.
3. Are Zetans canon?
The Lone Wanderers encounter with the Zetans is a legend which has sprung up in the aftermath of the events of Broken Steel. While Alien Blasters and other devices have shown up, no one has ever been able to confirm if it happened or if the gigantic blast which hit Canada was anything other than a comet. Perhaps there are aliens in the Fallout universe, perhaps its another Vault tech experiment, or perhaps it's just a dream.
4. Why does the Institute have FEV and so many others?
The Institute cultivated FEV after the events of the nuclear war from the environment. FEV was also brought with the Enclave from Raven's Rock. Any surviving scientists from the Enclave have brought their knowledge of the material to other parts of the world. This includes Enclave survivors from the West Coast as well as the East.
5. Enclave armor and Vertibirds in the Pre-War Era?
Vertbirds are a classification of nuclear helicopter used by the US military prior to the Great War. The Enclave manufactured their own unique brand but similar devices were used ubiquotously until the nuclear bombs fell. As for Enclave armor, while some previous suits of armor resembled the kind used by them, the suits found in Fallout 4 are gameplay mechanics. It's possible some survivors of the Capital Wasteland Enclave reached the Commonwealth only to be forced to abandon their armor.
6. Fusion Cores and Power Armor
The original Power Armor was apocalypse-proofed for 200 years. The Fusion Cores have thus deteriorated to the point they are now suffering massive failures throughout. Fusion Cores can, however, be recharged and reinserted but the days of continuous operation without maintainance are a thing of the past. Among other things, this has dramatically weakened the mobility of the Brotherhood of Steel and is a reason why they now need the Prydwen.
7. The Brotherhood of Steel's communication between the East and West Coast
The Brotherhood of Steel at Lost Hills hasn't been wiped out by the NCR but has been forced underground. The events of the Mojave War between NCR and Caesar's Legion resulted in the pressure on the defeated, under-siege Brotherhood being lifted. It's also possible that the treaty between the Mojave Chapter and NCR resulted in a larger peace treaty with the Brotherhood.
This allowed them to name Arthur Maxson as the Elder of the East Coast and reintegrate the Brotherhood Outcasts. The Brotherhood on the West Coast was dramatically weakened and the Eastern Coast ascendant but the latter remains subordinate to the former due to Arthur's need for approval from his Elders. Still, some West Coasters worship Arthur out of the belief his army will return to the West Coast and liberate them from NCR's oppression--a dangerous idea.
8. Why are Super Mutants Stupid?
The only Super-Mutants who maintain their intelligence are those who were not affected by radiation beforehand. This is why the Master wanted to get at the people found in Vaults. As a result, the majority of Super Mutants who are going to be made from Wastelanders are going to be dumb as a post. It also explains why Fawkes and others from the Capital Wasteland who are the oldest of Super Mutants are intelligent versus their fellows. The majority of the modern Super Mutants both in the CW and Commonwealth are made from captured wastelanders.
9. T-60 armor
T-60 armor was a newly designed suit of armor which never actually saw deployment in the Great War but was being manufactured in the Commonwealth. The Brotherhood of Steel recovered many of these in their initial deployment into the Commonwealth. It is part of the reason they are inside the region.
10. Why does the Brotherhood want to blow up the Institute?
Arthur Maxson would normally be very interested in looting the Institute of technology but he has combined Elder Lyon's militant belief in the need for the destruction of "evil" technology-born creatures like Feral Ghouls and Super Mutants with the Brotherhood's traditional stance against machinery not under their control. Many more conservative Brothers of Steel would be shocked and horrified by his causal destruction of technology. The destruction of the Institute also, notably, prevents any inconveinant questions being asked about the danger of Synths.
1. How did the Enclave get to Raven Rock?
Dick Richardson had been in touch with John Henry Eden for some time and had planned to establish an Enclave base at Raven Rock well before the Mariposa incident. As such, they had long-distance Vertibirds established with a refueling point in Chicago. The evauation plan moved all of the Enclave's children and a large portion of its surviving soldiers and scientists to Raven's Rock. A few chose to stay behind and fight NCR's forces like Arcade's guardians.
2. How is Jet a Pre-War Drug?
Myron was a gifted chemist but not a particularly workaholic one. Myron modified a pre-existing form of Jet to become the impossibly addictive version found in Fallout 2. It is notable the Pre-War version is not as addictive in the same way Myron's was. It is also not nearly as dangerous or lethal.
3. Are Zetans canon?
The Lone Wanderers encounter with the Zetans is a legend which has sprung up in the aftermath of the events of Broken Steel. While Alien Blasters and other devices have shown up, no one has ever been able to confirm if it happened or if the gigantic blast which hit Canada was anything other than a comet. Perhaps there are aliens in the Fallout universe, perhaps its another Vault tech experiment, or perhaps it's just a dream.
4. Why does the Institute have FEV and so many others?
The Institute cultivated FEV after the events of the nuclear war from the environment. FEV was also brought with the Enclave from Raven's Rock. Any surviving scientists from the Enclave have brought their knowledge of the material to other parts of the world. This includes Enclave survivors from the West Coast as well as the East.
5. Enclave armor and Vertibirds in the Pre-War Era?
Vertbirds are a classification of nuclear helicopter used by the US military prior to the Great War. The Enclave manufactured their own unique brand but similar devices were used ubiquotously until the nuclear bombs fell. As for Enclave armor, while some previous suits of armor resembled the kind used by them, the suits found in Fallout 4 are gameplay mechanics. It's possible some survivors of the Capital Wasteland Enclave reached the Commonwealth only to be forced to abandon their armor.
6. Fusion Cores and Power Armor
The original Power Armor was apocalypse-proofed for 200 years. The Fusion Cores have thus deteriorated to the point they are now suffering massive failures throughout. Fusion Cores can, however, be recharged and reinserted but the days of continuous operation without maintainance are a thing of the past. Among other things, this has dramatically weakened the mobility of the Brotherhood of Steel and is a reason why they now need the Prydwen.
7. The Brotherhood of Steel's communication between the East and West Coast
The Brotherhood of Steel at Lost Hills hasn't been wiped out by the NCR but has been forced underground. The events of the Mojave War between NCR and Caesar's Legion resulted in the pressure on the defeated, under-siege Brotherhood being lifted. It's also possible that the treaty between the Mojave Chapter and NCR resulted in a larger peace treaty with the Brotherhood.
This allowed them to name Arthur Maxson as the Elder of the East Coast and reintegrate the Brotherhood Outcasts. The Brotherhood on the West Coast was dramatically weakened and the Eastern Coast ascendant but the latter remains subordinate to the former due to Arthur's need for approval from his Elders. Still, some West Coasters worship Arthur out of the belief his army will return to the West Coast and liberate them from NCR's oppression--a dangerous idea.
8. Why are Super Mutants Stupid?
The only Super-Mutants who maintain their intelligence are those who were not affected by radiation beforehand. This is why the Master wanted to get at the people found in Vaults. As a result, the majority of Super Mutants who are going to be made from Wastelanders are going to be dumb as a post. It also explains why Fawkes and others from the Capital Wasteland who are the oldest of Super Mutants are intelligent versus their fellows. The majority of the modern Super Mutants both in the CW and Commonwealth are made from captured wastelanders.
9. T-60 armor
T-60 armor was a newly designed suit of armor which never actually saw deployment in the Great War but was being manufactured in the Commonwealth. The Brotherhood of Steel recovered many of these in their initial deployment into the Commonwealth. It is part of the reason they are inside the region.
10. Why does the Brotherhood want to blow up the Institute?
Arthur Maxson would normally be very interested in looting the Institute of technology but he has combined Elder Lyon's militant belief in the need for the destruction of "evil" technology-born creatures like Feral Ghouls and Super Mutants with the Brotherhood's traditional stance against machinery not under their control. Many more conservative Brothers of Steel would be shocked and horrified by his causal destruction of technology. The destruction of the Institute also, notably, prevents any inconveinant questions being asked about the danger of Synths.
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Dr Fallout
Centurion
That was done merely for game balance, as the Follower suggest that medical chems are running out (the Khans can be persuaded to make Stimpacks for the followers, but they're extremely limited in production). They can create fixer and drugs that help against alcohol but that's it, there's no evidence of chem manufacturing on a medical scale. Also, who makes these chems? Remember, the majority of medical drugs come from scavenged hospitals.
1. Isn't it the other way of around?
2. Again, it's implied that Stimpacks aren't just made with simple materials. Or what, is VATS a real thing in the Fallout universe?
3. Which makes no sense, as the East Coast is much more important and full of legitimate targets.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
One of the things which is very abundant in the Fallout world is large-scale scientific equipment from the Retro-Sci Fi future of the Pre-War era. Chemistry stations are very common and the knowledge of how to make Chems is something which not at all lost due to the Followers of the Apocalypse and the fact drugs are very much a thing which is abused commonly. If a group of "bikers without bikes" like the Great Khans can make stimpacks then NCR and the Followers certainly can.
The NV quest with the "NCR Science Division" explains NCR's population has grown to the point they're actually going to run out of food soon unless they learn how to expand their production capabilities. Which is part of the reason they've already started farming outside of New Vegas.
I don't think Stim packs are meant to be exceptionally super-advanced either. I think they're literally just a shot which causes natural healing to accelerate. Which is AMAZING science which would be revolutionary in our world but it's not a bunch of nanomachines either. It seems like an actual chemical mixture in a electric machine.
Well, there is the small matter of China being, you know....on the Western side of things. ICBMs certainly reached the East Coast but the West Coast is much closer. Also, while ICBMs existed in the Fallout universe, the vast majority of nukes appear to have been designed around plane dropping and personal weaponry.
A different philosophy of war dominated the 2050 world. Why the tanks have merged with infantry. It's why the Chinese invaded Alaska despite the fact that makes no damned sense.
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Dr Fallout
Centurion
You're mixing up assumptions and flawed logic with facts. Firstly, there are very little chem stations. Secondly, the Followers do not create chems and rely on donations. The chems they do make are limited to fixer and trade with others for the rest, such as the Atomic Wrangler. Do they make Chems? Not shown, it's more likely they trade for them. Thirdly, you're mixing up drug abuse with mass manufacturing, as the abused drugs are often illegal and hence would not be made by the NCR or Followers. So who makes them? Apart from the Khans it's most likely they're scavenged and sold through a chain of retailers and suppliers. Thirdly, the Khans rely on the proceeds of drug manufacture and hence rely on it meaning that they invest a lot on drug manufacture. The Followers are shown to have limited production (they're running out, they rely on donations, chems are running out, etc) and the NCR has limited reason to do so.
Oh I thought you meant Pre-War population, however keep in mind that the West Coast has been hit by more nukes (according to you) and are drier then the east already, meaning that famine due to a high population does not signify massive amounts of people as there is a lower famine threshold.
We're both working off assumptions here. I'm using the mention of MEDICAL chems running out by Arcade meaning that the easy creation of stimpacks is most likely a game based thing like VATS.
1. The idea of nukes being dropped by bombs was a gimmicky thing added by Bethesda in Fallout 3 to justify Megaton. NV gets rid of this and only mentions missiles, as you can find missiles in military bases, Mr House confirms it by stating that missiles were launched against Vegas and the US and generally missiles make logical and military sense.
2. Also, that logic is retarded because it means that LONG RANGE MISSILES hit the west coast while SHORT RANGE BOMBS hit the east. Major fuck up with the Chinese? Or maybe... it's just Bethesda being retarded.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
Well, we know they physically invaded the East Coast since the Chinese sword is prevalent, we meet survivors of the invasion, and so on. As such, it's entirely possible the Chinese used short range bombs from their attacks on the East coast in a desire to capture the leadership of the United States to prevent a retaliation.
That, obviously, failed miserably.
That, obviously, failed miserably.
Dr Fallout
Centurion
Yes, let's invade the East Coast even though it's on the opposite side of us, while ignoring the much more believable and workable West Coast invasion. While we magic in there (because logistics doesn't exist for us) , lets also use outdated atomic weaponry to 'capture' the enemy's leaders.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
Yes, let's invade the East Coast even though it's on the opposite side of us, while ignoring the much more believable and workable West Coast invasion. While we magic in there (because logistics doesn't exist for us) , lets also use outdated atomic weaponry to 'capture' the enemy's leaders.
And it almost worked. I prefer plane dropped bombs and giant robots and mecha soldiers versus ICBMS personally.
Dr Fallout
Centurion
Yeah, explain that. Because last time I checked, magic has no place in Fallout.
Strategically and tactically most military leaders wouldn't.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
Magic is not in Fallout save with the Kribeckna.
However, Radiation doesn't work like stupid real life.
Dr Fallout
Centurion
Exactly. So please explain the logistics and possibility of an East Coast invasion, with the technology that both countries have.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
We know submarines and other vessels proceeded around to the East Coast, which they proceeded to launch missiles from and also operatives.
DirtyOldShoe
Some kind of lucky
@SarcasticGoodGuy originally accused you of being Pete Hines. He was close. You are Emil Pagliarulo. Stop trying to justify your dogshit writing (apologies to dog shit) Don't you have anything better to do? No new shitty Fallout to fuck up? I thought that maybe the only two people to set you right would be @Crni Vuk or the glorious @Mr Fish But you are beyond that. You were here before.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
You see, I have this problem. It's an illness really. I can't get myself bent out of shape over a video game where you shoot giant radioactive ants and America is a perpetually 1950s Fascist State.
Is it silly the Chinese attacked the East coast too? Yes.
Does it need to be realistic?
No.
Is it silly the Chinese attacked the East coast too? Yes.
Does it need to be realistic?
No.