The Trailer for The Pitt
- Thread starter Morbus
- Start date
Oh I get that you don’t have to be in the industry to criticize, I mean I write criticism for games, restaurants, movies and beer and I’ve only done a little bit in each of those industries (line chef, mod maker, homebrewing, student film). Of course I usually write constructive criticism but there’s no point making too much of a differentiation, especially since that’s not the game that is being played on this thread. If anything it is pointless for to try to convince you guy’s that Fallout 3 is not the worse game ever made (in fact real critics gave it a A’s and 10’s) since in the end all I’m probably just interrupting the fun of a bunch of people who come here just to outdo each other with complaints about Fallout 3. So just pretend I didn’t turn the lights on and you guy’s keep doing whatever it is you do…
whirlingdervish
Brahmin Cavalry Commander
lugaru said:
Real Critics?
Please name a few of them.
I cannot think of one A or 10 review for this game that wasn't a complete load of crap that stated that the game was the best thing since sliced bread while simultaneously overlooking the game's many glaring faults and flaws and parroting Pete-speak.
lugaru said:
I won't have to pretend anything, because you aren't as important, or illuminating, as you think you are.
No one here has ever said Fallout 3 was the worst game ever. A few of us go as far as to say it's not necessarily a horrible game, it's just an awful sequel to Fallout.
As to the "real critics", you mean the ones that Bethesda buys air fare for, and sequesters in hotel rooms, so they can do a quid pro quo for a good review? Sorry, I'd rather hear from people that are actually fans of Fallout 1 and 2.
whirlingdervish said:
Wouldn’t that be like a creationist asking for signs that evolution is real? I can show you reviews, both glowing and mild, adding up to an aggregate of 92, but you will still say they are wrong because the hive mind here thinks otherwise. That’s why I’m just not going to bother trying to convince you guy’s that the rest of the world is not wrong, it is in fact selfish of me to want to take away the fun of unfounded griping and ultimately pointless.
iridium_ionizer
Mildly Dipped
The funny thing is how bad the Fallout 3 animation is when considering how good the animation in Fallout 1 / 2 was. Sure they were sprites but they were incredibly life-like when they walked, ran, got knocked down, or ran. The only complaints you could make would be about the lack of variety - it would be great to have a couple more dodge animations to mix things up for each character and there could have been a transition frame when the characters change direction when walking / running on the hex. With Fallout 3 the characters look stiff while walking, standing, or changing direction.Beelzebud said:
whirlingdervish
Brahmin Cavalry Commander
lugaru said:
perhaps you didn't get the point of my post:
1: The game has huge flaws that are incredibly obvious even to the uninitiated:
Horrible animations, A retarded sory, lack of consistency, bugs
2: A 10 of 10 or A score is meant to denote a game that is well designed, enjoyable to all, contains a reasonably coherent plot, and one that looks very nice by current graphical standards.
Fallout 3 was made on a dated engine (and it looks it. go play crysis) it was designed by people who have absolutely no understanding of how to design a game intelligently, and it's plot is a weak ripoff of other games done poorly.
It's only fun for people who have very low expectations from a computer game and who are willing to ignore all of it's flaws.
3: If any reviewer gave it a 10 out of 10 or an A rating, when it obviously does not warrant one based on the very obvious negative factors above, then they were NOT very professional game critics.
I assume that by "Real critics" you were trying to insinuate that they do it for a living and thus are professional game critics and somehow better at criticizing or describing a game than anyone else who doesn't.
That would be an idiotic attempt to appeal to their authority on the subject of gaming criticism, and it really doesn't fly here since it is obvious that very few if any of the reviewers and critics that wrote about Fallout 3 had any idea what the hell they were talking about when compared to the collective of Fallout officianados that reside here (some of whom ARE pro gaming reviewers)
for the record getting paid to say X or Y doesn't automatically make you any better at saying it than the next guy nor does it make you instantly more informed about the subject.
So again, you guy's are right, the people who diagree are wrong. The vast majority out there disagrees, so almost everyone outside of a small group on forum are wrong. I get you, what I dont get is where this mystical sense of authority and ownership that people here comes from. You played the games, so did I, big deal...
You do know that "this" place isnt just about such kind of people?lugaru said:
Mind you there are here in the NMA community more registered then just people you see posting all the time some which are professional game journalists (not just BN ...), modders, game developers from programmers, designers to modelers and even professional software developers or at least people with experience in such a fields which have as well in a more or less (either way) constructive way raised criticism about Bethesda as company the quality of their games or how they attempt to make games in general at least the recently released ones like Oblivion and now Fallout 3.
Many times when people try to be constructive you hear a few "catchwords" or "general phraze" from some like a try to club those with criticsm to death with this heavy words. Things like "success proves them [Bethesda] right" or "you have to be a game developer to criticize the quality of the visuals" as like this kind of things make you a better person in general.
I say that everyone who is playing many games is capable of just simply comparing even without the knowledge of every hardware and system behind it or technology at least the quality of the visuals and gameplay. I mean even you at one point, if you like the graphic of Fallout 3 bought it based on your own oppinion and liking. What gave you (or anyone in that matter) now the expertise to guess the quality of Fallout 3s visuals as good enough to be bought? Your own belief of course! But neither you or many of the costumers are game developers or skilled professionals. But again that doesnt mean anything particularly not that one can not form and say his oppinion. Sometimes people compare with the eye and the mind not sloley with knowledge. And if it is someone that knows what hes talking about it has some value. I can only point to the review of VD for example which is by the way the official NMA review about Fallout 3. And hes also a game developer by the way.
A usual person or gamer though can still have a definition of a game or raise criticism. Just like as one that has tasted a good few dozen different steaks (different in the sense of prepared differently) can probably tell at least for him self and explain his oppinion to others why the one steak tastes better then the other one. He does not always inherently need the profesionality of a cook or I would have to ask my self with what expertise all this people criticising the od cousin of different nations base their kwocklegde on.
lugaru said:
Apparently, in Lugaru's world, any opposition to a homogeneous opinion of the aggregates of reviews, the world's majority, the Borg Collective, the Ministry of Truth and the Roman Catholic Inquisition is immidiately regarded as a typical symptom of a hive mind mentality. Why, how moronically ironic...
Ranne said:
Thank god political systems in (most) parts of the US and Europe are not working that way. Thx god Bethesda are not rulers of any country
at least on the paper a minority or oppisition have still their rights!
TheRatKing
Vault Dweller
I'd just like to point out that most of the professional critics have never played Fallout 1 or 2 before. They compare Fallout 3 to Oblivion, not its true predecessors. Because I like Fallout 1 and 2, and Fallout 3 is nothing like them, I am saddened, and therefore dislike Fallout 3.
But then again nobody explains where this sense of authority comes from that brands all those outside of a small insular and cultish forum as incorrect. If you guy’s made the first games I salute you and please finish Van Burren, otherwise claiming some sense of ownership is odd. At the end of the day it's not so much about Bethesda or Fallout 3 or any other silly computer game (which in the end they all are) but about safety in numbers and enjoying an in joke with an in crowd. That's why I said it is pointless that I argue the point, in the end I’m just detracting enjoyment from those who are a bit too emotionally invested in a game, and they need any comfort they can get.
lugaru said:
So you're posting to explain to us how it's pointless to post?
Anyway, I suggest with some emphasis that you guys turn away from this nonsense.
As for you, lugaru. If you want to argue about a game, argue about the game, using arguments. If your only real point is "you guys are insular", which indeed seems to be it, then you might want to step back and realise that this is not a relevant argument to make. Who cares if people here have a sense of entitlement or authority? Does pointing that out make us any more right or wrong? If you have strong arguments to make, make them, a bunch of logical fallacies aren't going to convince anyone. If you want to continue with the circular reasoning and argument-avoiding statements, go talk to a wall or start a blog. This is not the place.
Heck...do you seriously believe you are making any kind of strong statement or point by desperately trying to group all opinions here present together and then dismiss them as irrational without offering any solid counter-argument? Aren't we a bit too old for that?
Also, stop pointing out you're an amateur reviewer on the internet. I mean, you and a million others, buddy, no one is going to be impressed.
Look, lugaru, you're obviously a smart enough cookie, and seem well capable of rational debate. Seems to me you're letting the fact that people here disagree with you get under your skin. My advice: don't, it's not worth it. So not everyone loves Fallout 3. Is that really worth getting worked up about? Does it infringe on your perfect world order?
Slaughter Manslaught
Vault Senior Citizen
Before Fallout 3 was launched, NMA had fierce arguments about Fallout 3 happening at all times. It was a time of doubt and fierce debate. Then Fallout 3 was launched. Nowdays, even the people who defended Fallout 3 mostly hated Fallout 3.
And we're not saying we right and people who disagree with us are wrong. We are just saying what we think.
And NMA is not a hivemind.
And we're not saying we right and people who disagree with us are wrong. We are just saying what we think.
And NMA is not a hivemind.
Morbus
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
Psychologically speaking, the problem there COULD start with the love for Fallout 3 itself. Because there is no reason to love a game.Brother None said:
Or at least there is no objective reason to love a game.
Or... well... At least there is no objective reason to love Fallout 3, no reason you can expose and argue about, and that's where the problem starts: when people start arguing objectively why they don't love Fallout 3, those who love it just because get infuriated, because they hold their love as a legitimate logical feeling, and not as something personal that's just about themselves.
The worldwide media hype orgies around Bethesda's games are so overwhelmingly influential on peoples opinions about the game that, even though they don't change the actual nature of their love for Fallout 3, they actually make them react differently to rationalizations of the object.
Because, after all, everybody loves Fallout 3.
Which isn't true. At all. Most people actually don't like Fallout 3. Maybe most people who played it found it fun, at least for a while, but that doesn't mean everybody likes it.
There are plenty of people complaining about objective simple things like the combat system or the world or other things. And while Fallout 3 lovers don't agree with them, at least they can understand their reasoning.
Which possibly doesn't apply when we talk about deeper issues.
Heh. Always ready with some zany extremist theory, eh, Morbus?