V13 tidbit

Tyshalle said:
But when you hear the developers start using words like "raids," and "mid-to-late play," you know you're winding up with something that's looking to fit comfortably between the stack of titles we've seen on the shelves for years, NOT something that's looking to stand out in any particular way.
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I've got to totally agree with you on this. I'd rather see them go with something like guildwars. Towns where Hubs and the only place you saw more then your group, max group was 8 players. And on top of that every missions or wilderness area was instanced so if you went solo, you were solo. This I think is ideal for "my" FOOL.
 
Hmm the Guild Wars/D&D Online model wouldn't be such a bad idea.

Would greatly help the wasteland atsmosphere and coupled with the Eve economy mechanics it would be very interesting indeed.
Bit like SWG before it went tits up.
 
40 man instanced Fallout 'quests' = potentially much more mockable than Fallout 3, guys.

Will there be leet epic gear too?
 
Wait untill you get the LEGENDARY power armour, model T-51b with uber stats and DR bonus. And the "chosen one" Avenger minigun, with OP DMG.

Joking. :P


Hopefully. :?

Not all MMOs are that bad.

Just that most of them lack originality,and have idiot player base at same time
 
Well a MMO where you don't group and only play solo would be a pretty bad MMO
 
Tyshalle said:
you'll get your typical crowd of pimply-faced virgin jobless losers to show up.
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A great player base is a definite positive, but the game itself has to be fun to retain people. Also, those pimply-faced kids are a fabrication of some people's collective imagination. The WoW player base, in my experience, is dominated by people in their mid-twenties to early 30's and looks to break down right in the average "gamer" demographic.

Tyshalle said:
when you hear the developers start using words like "raids," and "mid-to-late play...
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I can't really agree here. "Raids" and any huge group activities are one of the strong points of an MMO. Support for large groups of players trying to band together to achieve something is a good thing IMO. Depending on implementation, a fallout "raid" and a wow raid need have nothing in common.

"mid-to-late play" doesn't pigeonhole the game into any rehashed overdone mechanics. At least I can't see how, care to elaborate?

Also, he wasn't saying anything about FOOL really, just his experience with MMOs to date.
 
1. I never said the pimply-faced jobless virgin losers were a part of any age demographic. I'm saying that pretty much all MMO's except for EVE (a game which I don't have a subscription to) lack any value whatsoever which makes them worthwhile enough to shell out 50 bucks for, let alone a monthly subscription. Say what you will about worthless timesinks, but games like Half-Life 2 at least provide a viscerally exciting experience, and RPG's like Fallout, while not exactly educational, I do think are the kind of substantial entertainment that can make you think, and provide something that isn't just a complete waste of time. MMO's provide none of this. It provides repetition in a way intentionally designed to mimic gambling, like playing the slot machines. The reason for this is that simple actions with small, infrequent rewards that have the potential to pay off in big ways (such as some piece of uberloot) are mentally addicting.

MMO's mimick this extremely fucked up psychological mechanic because your addiction insures that you continue to pay your monthly subscription fee.

And since MMO's provide no actual worthwhile experience, intellectual, visceral or otherwise, what actual use do they have? The answer, whether you disagree or not, is: None. Therefore, the people who play these games have nothing better to do with their time, and even if they don't fall into the pimply-faced virgin unemployed demographic, they almost always fill the title of "loser" quite well.

It's not 100% universally true. But it's true enough that exceptions are exactly that: Exceptions to the rule.


2. What exactly is achieved during a raid, again? In the past it's been a piece of loot or some special kind of XP or something. Is there something new that actually makes this experience interesting and worthwhile, or can it ultimately be summed up by throwing out the "it's the people you play with," argument? To which I typically reply: Why not just have a chat room, if all the fun is from the people? Seriously, I used to text-based role play all the time (and still do, occasionally). The experience you can have with people is far superior on all levels than anything you can have in an MMO. So that's not a valid argument. There needs to be something more.

In EVE, working together actually accomplishes things. And your enemies are almost always other players, and it's almost always for a purpose. That's what your common MMO lacks: Purpose and Reason.


3. "Mid-to-late play" is a term that's only used in MMO's, and it's used for MMO's that have absolutely no point to them whatsoever except to serve as a meaningless timesink. You never hear about Mid-to-Late Play in EVE, for instance. MMO's with their whole existence built around leveling always have an end, which is why there's so much focus on end-game content, because if you "finish" the game, you might quit your subscription. So their solution is to make the world bigger, or give you more loot to find, or give you more levels to level up in, or some other worthlessness.

These are all concepts a Fallout MMO should not put into existence. It should be different, and have as much purpose and meaning and innovation as the original did.
 
the real problem with mmorpg's isn't that they are massively multiplayer online games - that's not what makes them feel like a chore and not what makes them suck.

developers put all this neverending grinding and slow advancement with constant rewards in the form of money and items in to make the players spend enough time and get addicted enough to keep paying them. which has to be done in order to maintain the game.

this leads to mmorpg's being simple and allow everyone to play, especially kids who don't have anything better to do and tend to get addicted to building a badass character. and thus leads to the games being full of idiots who couldn't care less about the roleplaying aspect.

that's how these games work, with a very few exceptions. and like I've said multiple times before, with Interplay's current situation and Bethesda on their back, they're not going to risk creating something out of the norm that they're unsure people will play. they're gonna take the safe road and try to get the money flowing in.
 
Brother None said:
aenemic said:
WoW wasn't the first mmorpg
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No, but WoW did in fact copy a lot of its gameplay mechanics from other MMOs. In that sense, it's just silly to call something a WoW clone for simply having MMO mechanics that predate WoW. Criticize it for not being innovative all you like, but keep WoW out of it.
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Quite correct. WoW was not the first MMORPG and Blizzard have copied mechanics from many games that preceded it ... and even copied mechanics that have come out subsequently, and incorporated them into the WoW expansions ... however Blizzard also have a knack of polishing those mechanics and weaving them together to make something the really works well.

Love it or hate it, WoW is the biggest kid on the block for a reason and comparisons are inevitable. You can't leave it out of any discussion regarding MMORPGs.
 
"lv 25 raider LFG to raid The Glow"

Wow... that's really capturing the "spirit" of Fallout. Nice to see that not only Beth can shit all over Fallout's memory.

I'm forced to remember Yeats...

HAD I the heavens’ embroidered cloths,
Enwrought with golden and silver light,
The blue and the dim and the dark cloths
Of night and light and the half light,
I would spread the cloths under your feet:
But I, being poor, have only my dreams;
I have spread my dreams under your feet;
Tread softly because you tread on my dreams.

W.B. Yeats (1865–1939)
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I'm looking at you Interplay. You're treading on my dreams...
 
Chris Taylor in another thread:

Chris Taylor said:
Show me a MMO developer that says they haven't played WOW, and I'll show you one that's lying. (Okay, I'm sure there are some developers that truly, honestly haven't played WOW, but they would be few and far between.)

WOW is the current industry standard. I'm not saying a developer should make their game based on WOW, but they should, at the very least, be familiar with WOW's content and mechanics. For any genre of game, it's important that game developers are familiar with the current crop of titles. I used to get reimbursed for my gaming purchases as a producer just so I could keep up with the competition. Neat.

Personally, I play all the new MMOs that come out, just so I can see what other games are doing. Most of the time, it's just for a few months, but I've played EQ, WOW, and COH to the elder game. Just for the fun of it. I've played AoC, WAR, EQ2, Vanguard, Wizard 101, E&B, DAoC, AO, SWG, AC2, EQOA, Shadowbane, and UO. I tried EVE for about 1 hour and couldn't hack it.

V13 isn't going to be a clone of any specific game with different graphics, but we're not going to make changes from what we think is best for the game just to be different. Let me put in another way -- we're going to make the best game we can that we would want to play. I'm sure that there will be similarities to other MMOs, the same way that CRPGs can be similar, but there will naturally be differences as well.

It is not our intention to just make a clone of game X. Our intention is to make a great game that stays true to source material while at the same time updating it properly for a great online experience.
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I want to mine FEV for 4.54 hours in the ruins of the Mariposa base while grinding off Supermutants so my Deathclaw character can absorb enough intelligence points from the FEV ore in order to speak to Human characters.
 
I heard that Herve Caen is pushing for a race of intelligent mutant foxes in FOOL. Their leader will be called Titus.
 
Say, what if they made it free, a la guild wars? Would you play it then? I might, considering the main thing stopping me from playing MMOs (other than most of them being bad) is cost. City of Heroes is the only MMO that interested me and the price was just too much.
 
Ausir said:
I heard that Herve Caen is pushing for a race of intelligent mutant foxes in FOOL. Their leader will be called Titus.
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Hahahahahahahahaha!

Zing!

I want to see how this game turns out, it may very well be the first MMO that I'll show any interest in.

Provided it's well-made and features quests like the ending of Road Warrior, that would be fun.
 
im going for SGW in 2009, while fool may be good, it will depend on how that turns out before i look to another mmo


unless of course SGW fails/sucks
 
Chris Taylor said:
Personally, I play all the new MMOs that come out, just so I can see what other games are doing. Most of the time, it's just for a few months, but I've played EQ, WOW, and COH to the elder game. Just for the fun of it. I've played AoC, WAR, EQ2, Vanguard, Wizard 101, E&B, DAoC, AO, SWG, AC2, EQOA, Shadowbane, and UO. I tried EVE for about 1 hour and couldn't hack it.
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Well, that shatters my dreams and hopes. Time to go play with the Russians.
 
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