What's Trump up to now?

[TorontoReign]

@Vergil You are in such a rush to respond angrily to my post and block every single harmless jab that you completely missed the point. I realize it is easier to lump every person that doesn't agree with you as a retard or liberal, but it makes you look bad. I did mention serving in the US Army, love my country, and find it hilarious that a juvenile delinquent who has a fetish for Hitler can doubt my patriotism. Loving your country and advocating every fucked up thing it does is different. I love how as soon as Trump gets to be president we all start trusting politicians. I brought up a few things that the US does that are just as draconian as the shit Cuba does to prove a point. Just because the US isn't gassing people in the street doesn't mean shit isn't messed up here to. If anything I have even more a right to criticize the US than you do. I'm not sure you have even paid taxes yet.

 

[zegh8578]

@Vergil You are in such a rush to respond angrily to my post and block every single harmless jab that you completely missed the point. I realize it is easier to lump every person that doesn't agree with you as a retard or liberal, but it makes you look bad. I did mention serving in the US Army, love my country, and find it hilarious that a juvenile delinquent who has a fetish for Hitler can doubt my patriotism. Loving your country and advocating every fucked up thing it does is different. I love how as soon as Trump gets to be president we all start trusting politicians. I brought up a few things that the US does that are just as draconian as the shit Cuba does to prove a point. Just because the US isn't gassing people in the street doesn't mean shit isn't messed up here to. If anything I have even more a right to criticize the US than you do. I'm not sure you have even paid taxes yet.

You're doing it wrong. You have to yield to Vergil.
Yield!

 

[CT Phipps]

To end my participation in this line of conversation, the Soviet Union was an Evil Empire but it saw itself as the Rebel Alliance. Castro and the other Soviets had the wonderful idea (heavy sarcasm) that if the People (capital P) were too stupid to be liberated from oppression then they should be forcibly liberated. I.e. conquered and made part of the Soviet oligarchy. The fact the poor and impoverished had no say in this was the major hypocrisy of the communist movement that continues to this day.

BE THAT AS IT MAY, I'm aware the US handling of Cuba was idiotic and heavy handed and imperialistic as well.

Castro may have been scum and a legitimate military target but the US plunging it into poverty and irrelevance only made sure Castro retained power.

@Vergil people defend Castro because he openly did shit that we do in private. No nation is above corruption. He was a bad man by all indications, but he kept Cuba independent and free from outside control for the most part, which some people respect. Not everyone likes to be a member of the Empire.

Eh, that's kind of the thing. Castro chose a side in the Cold War and outlived his side. It's just Russia in its present state isn't one which could have served as a valuable partner for Cuba and the other Big DogTM he could have allied with is the USA's loan shark.

He was very much a part of the Evil Empire and had a very cushy position in it.

 

[Vergil]

I realize it is easier to lump every person that doesn't agree with you as a retard or liberal, but it makes you look bad.

Not only are you a self confessed liberal you make it very clear you have liberals viewpoints in this thread and many others so it's not just a random label I've attached to you for no reason. I don't lump you in with retarded liberals because I disagree with you, I'm lumping you in with retarded liberals because you're acting and talking like one.

I did mention serving in the US Army, love my country,

Then why did you jump to randomly talk shit about America when all people were doing was talk about Cuba? You literally went OUT OF YOUR WAY to make this an America vs. Cuba argument whilst making excuses for Cuba.
You saw people saying things about Cuba doing things wrong and your first reaction was to get fanny frustrated and go on a tirade against America

a juvenile delinquent who has a fetish for Hitler

Thanks person who has never met me for telling me who I am.

can doubt my patriotism.

You don't make it hard to.

Loving your country and advocating every fucked up thing it does is different.

Hey look it's a thing no one ITT ever did.

I love how as soon as Trump gets to be president we all start trusting politicians.

hey look it's a thing on one ITT ever did.

I brought up a few things that the US does that are just as draconian as the shit Cuba does

Does America put you in jail for disagreeing with the government? Does the US Government jail homosexuals? Do they kill political rivals? Do they kill anyone they want without any sort of due process?
Stop trying to act like the Comparison to the shit Cuba does and what America has done is even close to equal to try and sound smart.

Just because the US isn't gassing people in the street doesn't mean shit isn't messed up here to.

No one ever said America was perfect but you don't get shot in the back of the head for having the wrong opinions.

If anything I have even more a right to criticize the US than you do.

That's not how America works.

I'm not sure you have even paid taxes yet.

I wish I could make up things about people I was arguing with to try and invalidate their arguments. Must be nice.
I'm gonna say you're an 43 year old black lesbian named Sharleen who lives off of welfare and this will invalidate all you say because the baseless assumptions of random dudes on the internet is really important when it comes to discussions.

You're doing it wrong. You have to yield to Vergil.
Yield!

I'm guessing that's a "no" on this then?

Are you gonna have any actual arguments against mine this time or are you gonna throw a hissy fit, call me a fascist a couple of times and then storm out of the thread again?

 

[zegh8578]

I'm guessing that's a "no" on this then?

Let's compete who gets the last word!
Okay, GO!

 

[CT Phipps]

Cuba is notably the only pseudo-Soviet State which would have actually wanted to stay in the Soviet Union when it dissolved. Which was kind of all that needed to be said about the Soviet Union when they let everyone who wanted out, out, and everyone left.

 

[Ragemage]

Let's compete who gets the last word!
Okay, GO!

This thread is meant to be a serious discussion revolving around what Trump is doing right now (although at the moment it's, for some reason, devolved into talking about Castro and the Cuban Missile Crisis). What are you doing to contribute to the topic?

 

[zegh8578]

This thread is meant to be a serious discussion revolving around what Trump is doing right now (although at the moment it's, for some reason, devolved into talking about Castro and the Cuban Missile Crisis). What are you doing to contribute to the topic?

As much as you are, right now. Pull your pants back up, Vergil is busy raging at non-fascists.

 

[CT Phipps]

How Trump will handle Cuba is actually an interesting question, though my suspicion is he plans to just ignore it unless they agree to build a Trump Tower there.

 

[Ragemage]

How Trump will handle Cuba is actually an interesting question, though my suspicion is he plans to just ignore it unless they agree to build a Trump Tower there.

First of all, that last bit is the equivalent of me saying "Lol Obama won't do anything about Syria until they build a new golf course there."

Second of all, I doubt Trump will simply "ignore" Cuba. Obama has unfortunately set a precedent that we might be able to become "friends" with Cuba now (he sent a delegate to Fidel's funeral ffs http://www.latimes.com/nation/polit...o-funeral-but-sends-1480443668-htmlstory.html ). I highly doubt relations will change while a Castro is in charge however, no matter how much Obama seems to want to rub shoulders with them. Raul's getting up there in years too though, perhaps if he kicks the bucket early then we can see some actual change in that country.

At the very least it will certainly be a happy day. I go to Florida every year with my family (I have cousins there) specificaly to Destin and Panama City. You should have seen the celebrating when Castro kicked the bucket, it was glorious to behold.

 

[TorontoReign]

@Vergil I did notice you didn't deny the fetish for Hitler. My reason for criticizing America (not just us either) was to show how hypocritical people are when it comes to shit like this. Clearly America is better than Cuba. We do more good overall despite all the bad. I shouldn't have to ejaculate red-white-and-blue every single time we are called out on bullshit though. Can you criticize both? Every leader has their pros and cons. Even the really bad ones. Castro's only redeemable quality was keeping Cuba independent. Some people value that more than life itself.

One thing I find amusing is if you don't condemn people for a certain unrelated action, but defend them on something else, then you automatically are on their side. Cuba is a hell of a lot better than North Korea I wager, so as far as dictators go - he wasn't the worst in the world. I realize people don't like to hear things like these fucking dictators have some positive traits, but it is actually possible. To bring that back home...yes Trump is the same way.

 

[Vergil]

@Vergil I did notice you didn't deny the fetish for Hitler.

*notices your lack of basic reading comprehension*
0w0 wats dis?

Thanks person who has never met me for telling me who I am.

I wish I could make up things about people I was arguing with to try and invalidate their arguments. Must be nice.

My reason for criticizing America (not just us either) was to show how hypocritical people are when it comes to shit like this.

... except you didn't show anything because you brought up a bunch of stuff no one voiced any support for. It was totally irrelevant both to the discussion and the people involved. You didn't prove anything.

I shouldn't have to ejaculate red-white-and-blue every single time we are called out on bullshit though.

No body "called us out on" anything though until you showed up and why does criticism of Cuba mean he have to also start talking about America as well? What's the point?

Can you criticize both?.

Yes but that doesn't mean every time someone says something bad about Cuba we need someone to come in and tell us that everyone else has done bad things to. We know, what is the point of doing this? It just looks like you looking for an excuse to complain about America. It's telling that your first response to criticism of Cuba is to make excuses for Castro and to start listing off everything the US has done.

Every leader has their pros and cons.

And Castro's cons far, far, far outweigh the pros.
Cuba was far worse because of him both socially, culturally and economically.

Even the really bad ones. Castro's only redeemable quality was keeping Cuba independent. Some people value that more than life itself.

Yea Castro kept Cuba real independent. That's why there was a Soviet missile base and Guantanamo both still on the island and it was pretty much powerless in the actually struggle that was between the USA and the USSR.

One thing I find amusing is if you don't condemn people for a certain unrelated action, but defend them on something else, then you automatically are on their side.

Uh.. yea. If you never say anything negative about someone and only defend them... kinda makes you look like you're on their side lol.
I'll say it again, your first response to insults to Cuba was insults to it's greatest enemy.

Cuba is a hell of a lot better than North Korea I wager, so as far as dictators go - he wasn't the worst in the world.

So? That doesn't mean he doesn't deserve the criticism he's getting.

I realize people don't like to hear things like these fucking dictators have some positive traits, but it is actually possible. To bring that back home...yes Trump is the same way.

>comparing Trump's pros and cons to those of the absolute dictators of third world communist dictatorships

 

[CT Phipps]

First of all, that last bit is the equivalent of me saying "Lol Obama won't do anything about Syria until they build a new golf course there."

If that's what you believe, Ragemage, you should say it.

Freedom of speech is what this country should always protect.

Disagreement or not.

 

[Dr Fallout]

Cuba is notably the only pseudo-Soviet State which would have actually wanted to stay in the Soviet Union when it dissolved. Which was kind of all that needed to be said about the Soviet Union when they let everyone who wanted out, out, and everyone left.

What about Transnistria which fought a war to stay with the USSR? Or Abkhazia? Or South Ossetia? They also fought wars to stay in the USSR. The Soviet Referendum of 1991 had an overwhelming vote for staying. Didn't stop the USSR from collapsing sadly.

The thing is, the USSR didn't 'let' them out. The USSR collapsed and so they had no choice but to leave.

 

[TorontoReign]

@Vergil you misconstrued my arguments again unsurprisingly. Why should Cuba/Castro be bashed any more than the USA? Should they be treated the same as China or the Philippines or worse?

I compared Trump to the dictators saying he is the same (noticed it read that way but didn't edit it because I figured that would be apparent), as in whether he does good or bad things, there will be positive aspects to him being president. Saddam was a prick but he kept Iraq relatively stable. Stalin "saved" Russia. Hitler revitalized Germany into one of the strongest countries in the world.

I won't derail further so don't bother with any Cuba responses.

 

[Vergil]

Why should Cuba/Castro be bashed any more than the USA?

Because America doesn't fucking send people to gulags for having opinions contrary to those of the US Government perhaps? Or maybe because they don't jail homosexuals? Don't execute political rivals? Theres quite a few reasons why Cuba is worth just a wee bit more scrutiny than the USA lol.

 

[Dr Fallout]

Because America doesn't fucking send people to gulags for having opinions contrary to those of the US Government perhaps? Or maybe because they don't jail homosexuals? Don't execute political rivals? Theres quite a few reasons why Cuba is worth just a wee bit more scrutiny than the USA lol.

The US doesn't. Instead they allow their allies to do so.

 

[TorontoReign]

Because America doesn't fucking send people to gulags for having opinions contrary to those of the US Government perhaps? Or maybe because they don't jail homosexuals? Don't execute political rivals? Theres quite a few reasons why Cuba is worth just a wee bit more scrutiny than the USA lol.

Why does one country deserve any more scrutiny than another though? Is there not enough to go around?

 

[Vergil]

The US doesn't. Instead they allow their allies to do so.

Oh damn well then I guess we should just never criticize anyone ever then because somewhere someone else is doing that too.
Like seriously you're all getting pissed because people dared to say mean things about Cuba without also going on an irrelevant rant against America as well.

Why does one country deserve any more scrutiny than another though?/QUOTE]

Because America doesn't fucking send people to gulags for having opinions contrary to those of the US Government perhaps? Or maybe because they don't jail homosexuals? Don't execute political rivals?

Stop trying to pretend America and Cuba are equal at all.

 

[TorontoReign]

Oh damn well then I guess we should just never criticize anyone ever then because somewhere someone else is doing that too.
Like seriously you're all getting pissed because people dared to say mean things about Cuba without also going on an irrelevant rant against America as well.

Stop trying to pretend America and Cuba are equal at all.

I never claimed they were equal. No country is immune from scrutiny.