Why Fo4 fucked Fallout lore

Discussion in 'Fallout 4' started by 0wing, Apr 30, 2016.

  1. Bethesdaretconman

    Bethesdaretconman First time out of the vault

    Nov 28, 2018
    No scientific backing, huh? Neither is people turning to ghouls when exposed to too much radiation or them able to survive without food or water. It's fiction, not everything needs to be realistic, it does however need to be consistent. You edited that article beyond belief with tons of bias, I read the dialogue for how he made it and it's no more unbelievable than ghouls, super mutants, etc. "Radioactivity did it" is the trope that defines the entire fallout franchise, buddy. Myron has shown that he knows his shit, he discovered it quickly partially by coincidence when he saw the the slaves getting toxicated from the fumes of the dung, and civilisation has just started a new after the bombs dropped, so it's not too far of stretch to have people just discovering something that has been under all their noses after a 100 years, and not many book smart people probably work around Brahmin crap or even care about it. People have been too busy trying to survive. Oh, and OP never said anything about Mordino knowing all about drugs and just because he advertised it as the New Reno experience, doesn't mean he doesn't know anything about drugs, peyote fucks you up, it just lasts too long to get a profit, he probably knew that, he just wanted something quick to attract more customers, and I'm sure someone could tell him that Myron didn't invent jet, someone who knows it's prewar.
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2018
  2. R.Graves

    R.Graves Confirmed Retard

    Apr 21, 2016

    it was originally intended to be strictly FEV. FEV in its original government form seemed to just do whatever it wanted before the master got his hands on it. the original explanation was that a nuke or something or other hit an FEV tank at mariposa and it adversley affected the surrounding area. later games changed it to radiation because all FEV research was moved to mariposa (according to fallout 1, 3/4 dont count) so it was the later games (fallout 3/4) that went with the "it was rads" explanation. for all of bethesda's skullfuckery with the franchise this was admittedly an absolutely necessary retcon. however its made all the more baffling with there incessant inclusion of FEV in later titles.
    this is actually straight up in the game. myron says they used to peddle peyote but it wasn't garnering enough profit because it lasts too long. oh also naw fam i don't buy it. myron is too much of an arrogant cunt to lie and say he invented something he didn't. he'd see it as beneath him. and if someone else did invent it he'd be the first to let you know he perfected it. also if vault tec was gonna try and send drugs to a vault i'd have hard time believing they'd such a low tech shit drug as jet. far more likely it'd be pharmaceutical and not a literal street drug.
    also its a main plot point in 1 that ghouls need water. and is further confirmed in 2 and new vegas that they need food and water. 4 just didn't give shit. altho in the complete interest of fairness Necropolis did have a legit water supply but didn't seem to have any reliable food source whatsoever. that coupled with the fact that necropolis is isolated from and feared by the outside world (no trade) means we arrive at the classic fallout 3 criticism "what do they eat".
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2018
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  3. Bethesdaretconman

    Bethesdaretconman First time out of the vault

    Nov 28, 2018
    Oh, I misinterpreted Tagziel, I thought he was arguing that the reason why he doesn't like the original jet lore was because of that trope. I didn't know about the FEV and rad stuff. Yes, ghouls do need water and food. Tagizel supports the official bethesda canon so i was using his argument against him.
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2018
  4. Norzan

    Norzan Vault Senior Citizen

    Apr 7, 2017
    I know he won't respond since he hasn't been on for a while but oh boy, it's that shitty argument to defend the Kid in the Fridge.

    We don't even know how long Coffin Willie was buried, while we know how much time that kid was in the fridge.

    And reading Tagz posts really shows how clueless he is. So much braindead defense for Fallout 4, it's the "let's trash an older game while defending the new game because it's the new game in the series" thing.
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2018
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  5. R.Graves

    R.Graves Confirmed Retard

    Apr 21, 2016
    well to be completely fair the striclty FEV thing was never confirmed in game as far as i know, its only ever stated in the fallout bible. which is a roughly 200 page document that adds to and repairs the original canon. that said betheda clearly thinks of the fallout bible as canon because vault 106 appears in fallout 3 as it was described in the bible. they read a 200 page document outlining canon and still managed to fuck it up this badly in just 2 games. what fucking spastics.
  6. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    Naw, Tagz is a fine guy. I just do not know what in gods name fried his brain so much that he defends F4 - and even more so F3.

    Hopefully Fallout 76 opened his eyes a bit on how shit Bethesda is and how little they care about the franchise. But I guess denial is a very strong emotion.
  7. CT Phipps

    CT Phipps Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Sep 17, 2016
    I found the abandoning of caps to be incredibly lame and whenever I do New Vegas, I act like being offered NCR cash or Legion gold is awful.

    "ewwwww. Fake money."

  8. mef

    mef Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?

    Dec 29, 2014
    necropolis traded with the hub
  9. Black Angel

    Black Angel Grand Inquisitor of the Ordo Hereticus

    Mar 21, 2016
  10. Cobra Commander

    Cobra Commander Water Chip? Been There, Done That

    Dec 6, 2016
    Summon this guy back by making a "Why Fo76 fucked Fallout lore"

    It should be interesting to see how far the Bethesda defense force can go.
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  11. CerberusGate

    CerberusGate I should save my game in a whole new slot

    Jun 6, 2016
    From Tagz's posts here when he came back, he may try to defend the 'lore' retcons as he did on the Fallout subreddit but I don't think he'd defend 76.

    Popular sentiment is against 76 so if he is in the game development industry (I recall reading that somewhere), he'd probably try to save face by also trashing 76 publically.
  12. Norzan

    Norzan Vault Senior Citizen

    Apr 7, 2017
    He seems to have an hate boner for Fallout 2 because mention anything about the newer games in a negative light and he'll say Fallout 2 also did stupid shit. Happens in this same thread.
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2018
  13. CT Phipps

    CT Phipps Venerable Relic of the Wastes

    Sep 17, 2016
    I love Fallout 2 because it's the closest game to Fallout 3.

  14. Rheios

    Rheios Mr. House's Employee of the Apocalypse

    Oct 22, 2018
    The whole "Kid in the Fridge" thing is a massive failure, but it's a failure because it's a repetition of a problem that's already solved. In Fallout 2, when Black Isles were trying to be humorous they threw in very obviously ridiculous joke encounters. It worked but it worked because they were so apparently not a part of the real story. Still, it was off-putting to some fans, and so instead of just resting on their ass and continuing to piss off fans, when Obsidian made New Vegas later, they had an adult discussion and solved the problem with Wild Wasteland. Bam, now you could toggle that real vs fake humor and *everyone* got to be happy and it doubled the replay value of the game with that choice alone. Then Fallout 4 came out and they fucked up because they learned *nothing*. It wasn't that The Kid is hated for being just a goofy lore fuck, it's not just that the kid's absurdity isn't as obvious as something like Godzilla footprints or the Tardis, it's that it's a perfect crystallization of how little a fuck they actually give about even the smallest problem in their games. A crystallization in the same way as a kidney stone. How, in hindsight, that was such a small kidney stone compared to the kidney-stone diamond mine of fuck-ups that is 76. (Not that it was the sole kidney stone in Fallout 4. There were plenty in that game, enough to turn the toilet red, but 76 is like trying to pass a quarter inch diameter dowel rod of kidney-stones by comparison. I am an artist with words.)
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  15. mithrap

    mithrap Ring a ding-ding, baby

    May 17, 2016
    Guy who wrote the whole thing here, I answer to your summoning. Unfortunately, I don't intend to play Fallout 76, so I might have some trouble writing about it.
    As for Tagaziel, I had some very heated debates with him, that went for actual weeks. In the end, he added me as friend and said he was humbled by how I held my ground without insulting him whenever he contradicted me. So yes, from what I know of him, we don't agree but if you are polite and ready for a debate, he's a cool guy. He knows his lore too, actually, even if he defends titles that butcher it at every occasion.
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  16. Einhanderc7

    Einhanderc7 Vat dipped, grown and still oozing with perfection

    Apr 22, 2016
    I have had my run ins in the past with Tagaziel, we did debate some.
    One thing I learned from debating with Tagaziel is that he is clearly passionate about the topic, biased, and unwilling to explore another perspective unless it agrees with his. Bear in mind I hold no ill will against him, however I would rather not engage with him because it's like debating with a Ferbi.

    Tagaziel has shown in the past that he has no qualms talking smack about NMA and those that frequent the forums. Plus I have experienced him ignoring points/counter points in the past which didn't sit well with me when he then opted to lean towards insulting rather than civil.

    From my perspective discussing anything with Tagaziel is fruitless, you can provide reasonably rational input, but all he'll hear is "Grump grump grump your idea of Fallout sucks, Bethesda Sucks, grump grump."
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