Walpknut
This ghoul has seen it all
"this central element felt underdeveloped" the typical Bethesda experience.
This ghoul has seen it all
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
Well the central theme is the Civil War and High Kingship is unimportant. However, I think they're interesting enough for a follow-up. Ditto the Thalmor. Instead, the DLC were about vampires and Solthsteim.
I also fully expect the Thalmor plot to be dropped next game.
SarcasticGoodGuy
*R O T T E N*
pick one
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
Walpknut
This ghoul has seen it all
You don't understand what a CENTRAL THEME means?
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
I'm quite aware of it. The Civil War is meant to provide a contrast between it and Alduin. The petty politics of real life versus legendary heroism of the Dragonborn. Is this a difficult concept? The Civil War was NEVER meant to be a big deal to anyone but the people involved versus the Dragonborn. It's why it's a side mission versus the main quest.
I think they could have developed it more but the Civil War is flavor for the Dragonborn's journey to saving the world versus actually a major part of his story.
Walpknut
This ghoul has seen it all
The Pettiness of people trying to live their lives and their systems of government coming into conflict versus some dude killing a Dragon that just vaguely poses a threat because of a vague generic prophecy....
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
You may recall a series called 'Game of Thrones' or a Song of Ice and Fire which has a similar theme of how the politics of the local humans may appear important but they're actually just bullshit compared to the army of Ice Draugr coming to kill them all.
"Dragons are coming." - House Talos words
Walpknut
This ghoul has seen it all
Haven't read Game of Thrones. But if it's another dumb High Fantasy series then I am not missing much.
D
Deleted member 93956
Guest
Naaw! @Black Angel, don't be mean 
Also, @CT Phipps, Skyrim has won "Test of Time". I mean, its obviously 90% due to modding, but hey, there's that.
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I liked how Gothic 2 handled dragons. Not only were there only very few of them, they were also proper boss enemies that gave you huge rewards. And the game actually progressed along those boss battles, with mercenaries trying their luck hunting dragons.
Speaking of which, why is dragon hunting not a much bigger deal in Skyrim? Sure, the Blades do it, somewhat... But what about the Companions? Nothing from them. There should be more mercenary bands forming just to hunt dragons.
Speaking of which, why is dragon hunting not a much bigger deal in Skyrim? Sure, the Blades do it, somewhat... But what about the Companions? Nothing from them. There should be more mercenary bands forming just to hunt dragons.
Walpknut
This ghoul has seen it all
Well the Companions won't have even heard of you no matter what you have done, it doesn't matter wether you killed Alduin or the leader of the Stormcloaks, they'll always not know who you are. Wouldn't surprise me if they also have never heard of flying lizards.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
That's all right... While working on an add-on mod for Skyrim main quest, I take extra care to ensure compatibility with other mods, including modded in new stories. So sometimes I troll forum users for their improvement ideas, and then go on and implement pretty much something else
therealyesman
commie
So, Skyrim is just a straight rip off from a Game of Thrones? Not making your point any stronger.You may recall a series called 'Game of Thrones' or a Song of Ice and Fire which has a similar theme of how the politics of the local humans may appear important but they're actually just bullshit compared to the army of Ice Draugr coming to kill them all.
"Dragons are coming." - House Talos words
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
I wonder what sort of Expansions would have been included if Skyrim had Fallout 3's devotion to DLC.
Or hell, the Witcher 3's.
How does this relate to the idea the Civil War is about the stupidity of man focusing on power and politics versus a greater existential threat? Not that such a thing would exist in real life. GASP! ALDUIN IS CLIMATE CHANGE!
Or hell, the Witcher 3's.
How does this relate to the idea the Civil War is about the stupidity of man focusing on power and politics versus a greater existential threat? Not that such a thing would exist in real life. GASP! ALDUIN IS CLIMATE CHANGE!
therealyesman
commie
Because it's the same story. Skyrim and Asoiaf are too similar when I think about it, though a Game of Thrones reasoning why they shouldn't focus on the wild ice things are justified. Nothing in Skyrim is justified in any way. Not even the fucking war.
How does this relate to the idea the Civil War is about the stupidity of man focusing on power and politics versus a greater existential threat? Not that such a thing would exist in real life. GASP! ALDUIN IS CLIMATE CHANGE!
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
Eh, I disagree but to each their own.
Honestly, I think they did an amazing amount of groundwork justifying the Skyrim Civil War. The issue of Talos in the White Gold Concordact, the history of Ulfric Stormcloak, how Ulfric Stormcloak eradicated the Forsaken only to be betrayed to the Thalmor by Markath's Jarls, and how numerous other groups like the Blades as well as Greybeards tie-in.
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therealyesman
commie
Which would be a good point, if it wasn't for all the nonsense.
For a war to make sense, we need to go all the way back. Why did the Thalmor attack? To get more land? That's strange, because they did, (or would) win. Why didn't they finish the Empire off when they could?
And it's strange that betraying your king and killing him is now an honorable thing, if it's done in one on one. Not even the most brutal of brutes has such a strange law. Ulfric betrayed HIS king and killed him. There is no way the nords in any way can see that as justifiable, no matter of how cowardish the king was.
And also, is the Empire now Thalmor's bitch? I don't think the Empire's vassals would want that, and they could alliance themselves with Morrowind or the other large empires against the Thalmor. They are a common enemy.
CT Phipps
Carbon Dated and Proud
I normally would be pretty much behind you but all of that's explained. The Thalmor rose to power in the aftermath of the Oblivion Crisis and they went to war because of the Blades doing wetwork in Thalmor lands because the Blades (correctly) believed the Thalmor were planning attacks against the Empire.
The Thalmor have an ideology of antihumanism but also a legitimate grievance against the Empire since the Atmer were conquered by Tiber Septum. Their name, Thalmor, is an invocation of the ancient Pre-Talos elven government system. They had cassus belli because of the Blades but wanted to destroy the Empire for revanchist and racist reasons--fitting since they're Nazi EXPYs but better than most due to the fact they actually have many similarities to the Nazis beyond "they're bad and wear black."
Also, The Thalmor "won" the war but they were not winning the war conclusively. Unlike virtually every video game where the victors get to dictate all terms, the Thalmor had suffered a crushing defeat at the hands of Titus Meade II right before the White Gold Concodact. The Emperor forced them to terms but it was at highly unfavorable terms since they'd expended all of their military force in their latter victories. Unfortunately, what he won on the battlefield, he lost at the negotiating table since he ceded Hammerfell and Talos' worship.
It's the most realistic depiction of actual negotiation and how wars usually go as it's only rare that countries and organizations are obliterated by war versus simply come to terms.
Ulfric killed High King Torygg in a honor duel which both accepted beforehand. It goes over like a lead balloon in Solitude where the Old WaysTM are barely remembered and they've been Imperialized but it goes over fine in places like Windhelm where he's not only the ruler but a more fundamentalist streak toward traditions is practiced. It's also a reason why the land is roughly evenly divided as Ulfric's actions are viewed controversally.
The Imperials believe Ulfric murdered Torygg while the Skyrim people, being an earthier sort, believe it was a fair fight over a legitimate grievance. Indeed, as Ulfric mentions, by the old law, he is now the Jarl of Solitude since he won their duel.
He's not the High King, though, because that requires a Kingsmoot.
Morrowind no longer exists because it was destroyed by the fall of a certain rock as well as the resulting volcano explosion. They were promptly conquered by the Argonians in revenge for centuries of being treated like animals and enslaved or killed at the Dunmer's leisure. That's why there's so many Dunmer in Windhelm due to the fact they fled as refugees to both there as well as Solstheim.
As for the Empire's vassals, the Khajit joined with the Thalmor due to the latter claiming credit for restoring the second moon as well as ending the oblivion crisis (believing them over the ludicrous story the Emperor's bastard became a dragon and saved the universe). Likewise, the Bosmer have been conquered by the Thalmor and enslaved so they don't add their forces to them.
Hammerfell no longer will ally with the Empire due to being traded to the Thalmor and driving them away with guerilla tactics. Thus, the empire is left to be Skyrim and High Rock and Cyrodiil. It's a vestigal remnant of its former size and power.
Byzantium rather than the Roman Empire.
Even so, the Thalmor have no influence on Imperial affairs except for the fact they've been given the "right" to investigate and eliminate Skyrim citizens who are practicing Talos worship. Which they're abusing to create their secret prison and randomly murdering citizens there who they find guilty of worshiping Talos. Their interest in that is part of an esoteric desire to weaken Talos the GodTM so they can destroy him and Shor (who Talos is a reincarnation of) so they can eradicate physical reality and ascend to become Gods.
Which will require humanity to not only be exterminated but never exist due to being retroactively eradicated. Shor/Talos/Lorkhan being the God of EvilTm to Elves both Dark and LightTM.
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