Why Robert Edwin House is the best hope for the wasteland and humanity

I feel like the tell tale sign of delusions of grandeur in the fallout universe is the desire to go into space. Only the craziest of crazies have any intention of going there, and its something that even under current constraints is difficult. Who tries to go into space? The Hubologists, the repconn ghouls (Brotherhood of Bright), and Vice President Bird of the enclave. All three groups are insane in the membrane. It is the story of icarus, and thats why I don't trust House. He's arrogant. He thinks he can control everything, including you, which is possibly his greatest folly. He is egotistical and believes he can't be wrong. He could predict a bomb being dropped on him, but thats the realms of computers. When vegas is faced by attackers who aren't hooked up to a screen he isn't well prepared. Not to mention, he is so detatched from the problems of his people. The suffering of freeside is due to him turning a blind eye to others. He's no better than Vault City, except you can rest all blame on him. I think he is a authoritarian force in a place where the greatest virtue is the freedom of man. He has to go. Maybe I'm just anarchist that way.
 
Have you read his eulogy @SiriusShenanigans? The one he wrote himself?! House is completely mental and out of touch with the world and reality. This is alluded to by him being fascinated by snowglobes. Little dioramas that he can't live in but can control from above.

What is House's reaction to the White Glove regressing back to cannibalism? He nonchalantly states that's a "breach of contract" and gives you an open invititation to KILL THEM ALL. Jeez, if that doesn't put House on the same level as Edward on the egomaniacal loony scale I don't know what does.
 
Yeah, I vaguely remember it, and going back to it he was full of himself. I just generally use "If you trying to go to space in fallout, you crazy." He definitely is cold and ruthless in his goals, but that was his give away to me. I don't trust anyone who's ambitious make them turn away from the world around them. When you look up at the sky is when you get shot or bit.
 
There are 3 groups who try to go to space in fallout. All of them fail, and all of them crazy. Hubologists? Absolutely nuts. Jason Bright? Probably got everybody killed. Vice President Bird? Even his own people think he is crazy. Its like a running joke in the franchise. Its the sun and they are all icarus. Its just how it works. I figure its a running joke among the developers.
 
SiriusShenanigans said:
There are 3 groups who try to go to space in fallout. All of them fail, and all of them crazy. Hubologists? Absolutely nuts. Jason Bright? Probably got everybody killed. Vice President Bird? Even his own people think he is crazy. Its like a running joke in the franchise. Its the sun and they are all icarus. Its just how it works. I figure its a running joke among the developers.
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The Shi also thought they would have the means of going into space in a few years.
 
I don't remember the Shi having space plans of any sort. I guess they are commanded by a computer emperor. The act of going to space is this demonstration of hubris. It is thinking you are above the wasteland and that makes it incredibly dangerous. I tend to think of it as akin to suicide.
 
Pwener said:
In one of the endings they return to Novac with their tails between their legs. Cults always end badly.
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Though Novac was a low-priority target for the Legion, many of Novac's citizens died in its defense. In the weeks that followed, several Bright Followers returned to Novac to help restore its defenses, allowing it to remain independent of the NCR.
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During the Legion's attack on Novac, Bright Followers, returning from their long pilgrimage, assisted in its evacuation. Though Novac eventually fell to the Legion, many citizens of Novac were able to escape, alive and intact. *
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*happens if you improve the rockets navigation through the power of SCIENCE!

None of these endings suggested that the Bright Followers 'return to Novac with their tails between their legs', only that their journey is over/completed so presumably they were back because they've heard of the Second Battle for Hoover Dam commencing at the moment, and were worried for the folks at Novac.

SiriusShenanigans said:
I don't remember the Shi having space plans of any sort. I guess they are commanded by a computer emperor. The act of going to space is this demonstration of hubris. It is thinking you are above the wasteland and that makes it incredibly dangerous. I tend to think of it as akin to suicide.
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If in 200 years or so most of the civilization has returned to the way it was before the War, or even better than that, wouldn't it be possible for some groups of people to start thinking of looking up to the stars, especially since most of the surface of Earth were burned to ashes and cinders? Also, don't tell me you've forgotten some of the key plots for Van Buren. A space station suspended in the orbit, still fully functioning after 200 years despite of some minor damage preventing opening mechanism from working properly?

Also, you're completely ignoring that, based the facts of his past achievements and endeavors, House probably is the one person who might just yet pull it off. Keyword: might. I'm not 100% certain of it, but at least I can put all my caps and some in the bag for him.
 
Black Angel said:
*happens if you improve the rockets navigation through the power of SCIENCE!

None of these endings suggested that the Bright Followers 'return to Novac with their tails between their legs', only that their journey is over/completed so presumably they were back because they've heard of the Second Battle for Hoover Dam commencing at the moment, and were worried for the folks at Novac.
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So let me undertand your logic here. You're telling me that this group of legit cultists who want to escape humanity's bigotry go through the superhuman effort to get three rockets to fly to some irradiated paradise where ghouls can live peacefully forever... BUT... not a year has passed and some are already back? And you don't find this fishy at all?

Point is that nowhere is it stated that the trip was a temporary one but instead they say they are ESCAPING the wasteland and humanity. Why would they be back? And since when do the endings of New Vegas have to spell everything out? This isn't Fallout 3 bruh.
 
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There are no groups capable of going to space. I didn't do much diving into van Buren lore but I don't think it was ever finished. I have no doubts that any efforts to take things into space would end in tragedy. And he isn't all that brilliant. For all his efforts he never managed colour video. His robots are clunky looking and it's hard to believe they were designed with a lock on weaponry that he couldn't undo or hard crack. I never got the impression he was a true genius, just a lucky nerd who though he was god. I wouldn't be surprised if he had access to Chinese intel because he sold his computers and robots to the Chinese so he could more easily access their networks. House is not a man I'd trust the future of the world to.
 
I don't think he is half the genius he makes himself out to be.nobdy gets to the top without help, be he only ever talks about himself. He's egotistical. And even if he is half that good, I don't think it's the sort of genius that will save the wasteland. Like the enclave he is a ghost of the insane past, and he does not care for the new emerging wasteland.
 
SiriusShenanigans said:
I don't think he is half the genius he makes himself out to be.nobdy gets to the top without help, be he only ever talks about himself. He's egotistical. And even if he is half that good, I don't think it's the sort of genius that will save the wasteland. Like the enclave he is a ghost of the insane past, and he does not care for the new emerging wasteland.
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Also, having a huge ego is not mutually exclusive to being a genius.

And you know what? Let's say he ISN'T a "genius". He's still got more of a plan for the future of humanity than most anyone else out there. He has shrewdly maneuvered to keep from being steamrolled by the NCR and Legion thus far, he predicted the Great War within a DAY of its actual occurrence and even with hardware that wasn't quite up to the task he managed to save a little shred of the old world from utter annihilation.
 
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Pwener said:
So let me undertand your logic here. You're telling me that this group of legit cultists who want to escape humanity's bigotry go through the superhuman effort to get three rockets to fly to some irradiated paradise where ghouls can live peacefully forever... BUT... not a year has passed and some are already back? And you don't find this fishy at all? THE WHOLE POINT WAS TO ESCAPE HUMANITY WHY THE HELL WOULD THEY BE BACK IF SOMETHING DIDN'T GO WRONG???

Oh my, you'll have to excuse that little outburst. Point is that nowhere is it stated that the trip was a temporary one but instead they say they are ESCAPING the wasteland and humanity. Why would they be back? And since when do the endings of New Vegas have to spell everything out? This isn't Fallout 3 bruh.
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The first ending slide where the rocket's navigation weren't improved suggested that only several of the Bright Followers, not all of them, returned to Novac to help them rebuild. The second ending slide where the rocket's navigation were improved could be taken as that, thanks to the navigation's improvement, the Bright Followers managed to settle much, much faster that they were able to spare a lot more resources to help Novac evacuated completely.

Neither ending slides implied the time frame when they came back, but it could be true that they returned much more immediately if we improved the rocket's navigation, hence them returning to Novac upon Second Battle's imminent coming. It could also be seen as a gesture of gratitude specifically towards folks at Novac for not interfering with their operation at REPCONN's Test Site, especially since it was the folks at Novac who sent the Courier to help them solve their problems. Not to mention Chris Haversam, who helped them greatly, settled at Novac, and most of the stuff needed for them to begin their journey were around Novac, so there's that.

SiriusShenanigans said:
There are no groups capable of going to space.
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So you would prefer for the series to stay with people sitting with their thumbs up their asses despite of it being 200- nay, 300- years passed? No technological advancement at all? We can have supercomputer AIs, a terraforming device capable of transforming a chunk of nuclear-blasted region into a form of the Earth it was, a fucking Platinum Chip capable of activating Mark II OS of an army of Securitrons, but going to space or even any effort to achieve it is a nay-nay?

SiriusShenanigans said:
I didn't do much diving into van Buren lore but I don't think it was ever finished.
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But it was there. The fact that we have House elaborating on his long-term plans showed us that the developers (former Interplay-Black Isle at Obsidian) were keeping that path as a possible direction for the series to go.

SiriusShenanigans said:
I have no doubts that any efforts to take things into space would end in tragedy.
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You don't know that. Aside from the Hubologists who were mostly made up of the deranged, the series were quite vague about anything related to space travel in the series.

SiriusShenanigans said:
And he isn't all that brilliant. For all his efforts he never managed colour video. His robots are clunky looking and it's hard to believe they were designed with a lock on weaponry that he couldn't undo or hard crack. I never got the impression he was a true genius, just a lucky nerd who though he was god. I wouldn't be surprised if he had access to Chinese intel because he sold his computers and robots to the Chinese so he could more easily access their networks. House is not a man I'd trust the future of the world to.
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SiriusShenanigans said:
I don't think he is half the genius he makes himself out to be.nobdy gets to the top without help, be he only ever talks about himself. He's egotistical. And even if he is half that good, I don't think it's the sort of genius that will save the wasteland. Like the enclave he is a ghost of the insane past, and he does not care for the new emerging wasteland.
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Did you even try playing his route if only once? If you did, did you truly paid attention to his dialogue and his achievements? I'm actually tired having to repeat myself, so I suggest you reread my previous posts or, fuck, try reading all the way from page 1 instead of repeating exact same inane bullshit because that leads me to repeat my shit.
 
SiriusShenanigans said:
Like the enclave he is a ghost of the insane past, and he does not care for the new emerging wasteland.
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Pro Tip: Regurgitating Ulysses' philosophy does not give your argument automatic heft.

Black Angel said:
The first ending slide where the rocket's navigation weren't improved suggested that only several of the Bright Followers, not all of them, returned to Novac to help them rebuild. The second ending slide where the rocket's navigation were improved could be taken as that, thanks to the navigation's improvement, the Bright Followers managed to settle much, much faster that they were able to spare a lot more resources to help Novac evacuated completely.

Neither ending slides implied the time frame when they came back, but it could be true that they returned much more immediately if we improved the rocket's navigation, hence them returning to Novac upon Second Battle's imminent coming. It could also be seen as a gesture of gratitude specifically towards folks at Novac for not interfering with their operation at REPCONN's Test Site, especially since it was the folks at Novac who sent the Courier to help them solve their problems. Not to mention Chris Haversam, who helped them greatly, settled at Novac, and most of the stuff needed for them to begin their journey were around Novac, so there's that.
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There's no evidence to support any of this. It's all just your fancyful headcanon. Admit it.

If this "Far Beyond" was within walking distance then why the hell build the rockets to begin with? The simplest conclusion tends to be the correct one and the simplest answer is that they crashed in the middle of Arizona and had to huff it back to the Mojave or this "Far Beyond" was complete bunk and after crucifying Jason they went back to the only civilization they knew.

Hey, no point in returning. If you reach Heaven, you wouldn't go back just to help the very people you were escaping from. That makes no logical sense. The whole trip went wrong or the "Far Beyond" was not what they thought it was.
 
Pwener said:
Pro Tip: Regurgitating Ulysses' philosophy does not give your argument automatic heft.
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I was saying this shit way before I played lonesome road. The entire theme of fallout 2 is that the old world is crazy and not to be trusted.

Anyway I'm about to leave so it will be a while until I give a full response.
 
SiriusShenanigans said:
I was saying this shit way before I played lonesome road. The entire theme of fallout 2 is that the old world is crazy and not to be trusted.

Anyway I'm about to leave so it will be a while until I give a full response.
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Yea, right. Well pardon my skepticism at you having had any real substantial insight into the world of Fallout before the release of New Vegas. So far all you've expressed are inane opinions with no real point to them.

No-Bark makes more sense than you my friend.
 
Well that's just rude as hell. It's not that hard to observe themes and tropes on fallout. That's what makes it interesting. Is it that hard to imagine that fallout would make a parralel to Greek myths of Icarus and Daedalus? Is having skepticism towards a man who you mostly ever hear about from his own mouth and things built by him just me being crazy? That shit is uncalled for. This is a discussion. You don't need to use ad hominem. Sorry if I follow my instincts.
 
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