Bethesda's Lore Recons

I like this discussion. Someguy you raise several valid points, but I think my problem is the practicality of the trip. I guess the trip across the United States was worth it in the end since they managed to scavenge another airship and a walking Death Robot, but I feel it was kind of hamfisted. More information should have been shared about the trip. I like some of the details like them stopping by The Pitt and mentioning the Midwestern BoS, but the lack of supplies, manpower, maintenance issues, fatigue, disease, all come into play. They really needed some armored vehicles, Vertibirds, or another airship for me to totally be on board with the idea. Just sending them on their way with no transport sounds silly. In essence it is really cool imagining the BoS trekking across lands we have not yet seen in the games so I rolled with it. As far as lore is concerned the BoS have made expeditions in the majority of the Fallout games so it is common.
 
TorontRayne said:
Beaushizzle said:
The settlers on the Oregon trail made it in covered wagons without bridges or decent roads under constant threat of native American attacks and disease.
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I bet they didn't encounter Deathclaws, Radioactive tornados, Super Mutants, and a much harsher environment that makes it harder to find food and water. ;)
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They also didn't have power armor, laser and plasma weapons, belt- and magazine-fed firearms, combat experience, stimpacks, radaway, psycho, mini-nukes.
 
TorontRayne said:
I like this discussion. Someguy you raise several valid points, but I think my problem is the practicality of the trip. I guess the trip across the United States was worth it in the end since they managed to scavenge another airship and a walking Death Robot, but I feel it was kind of hamfisted. More information should have been shared about the trip.
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It seems likely the BoS knew about Liberty Prime, considering it's existence widely known and publicized before the war. Though of course, for all they knew some wastelanders could have cannibalized liberty prime for scrap.
 
TorontRayne said:
but I think my problem is the practicality of the trip.
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I wouldn't disagree its impractical. The whole "yeah we heard about some super mutants over in D.C., go check it out and recover any tech you find" story was always sort of... a plausible, but dumb, excuse to get them over there.

As for transport issues, the BoS has never had cars that we know of, outside the Midwestern branch. And when it comes to airships
"Hey you know how we sent those guys east like 50 years ago in airships and we never heard back from them? I bet THAT trip turned out well!"
I doubt anyone was willing to spend that many resources to build another airship, when the last few didn't turn out so well. Walking was probably considered the better long term option and them not dying.
 
Well, with that argument, we could use the glow expedition the same way. The Glow in fact, was the primary reason why the trip was a stretch in the first place.

The BoS, never heard from the glow folks again. Using the same logic, they would never send another group out there by foot again. Even if there was tech to be found. If a short trip like that went bad, what about a cross country deathwish.

Thing is, there were a million things that could have gone wrong, besides the airship idea, which was shitty in the first place.

The maintenance issue is key here. They could have used the natives. They could hunt for food. Their tech however is not easily maintained without parts.

Then you have many environmental factors, like tornados. Rad Away and Rad X isn't abundant in the wastes but radiation is. Comnat damage to armor would be a given.

The whole trip was made a lot more feasible if you take into consideration a large and peaceful, MW brotherhood territory, in which to resupply in.
 
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It is an interesting discussion going on.

I think everyone should consider that people often argue that Fallout should look a lot more alive because its 200 years after the war. But at the same time they argue that the country is a total wasteland that is impossible or impractical to cross.

I don't think it's implausible or impractical for people to make the trip cross country, especially to D.C. The Brotherhood in particular would want to establish themselves on the East Coast - there would be so much potential for expansion and technological advancement from exploration. Staying in the West Coast for 200 years would lead to stagnation and allow people who took the initiative to expand to get the upper hand. In other words, expansion is the name of the game at that point.

Not to mention D.C. was the seat of the pre-war government and there is likely to be a whole host of old government resources on the East Coast. Basically the country is ripe for the taking in that setting and any group willing to expand their territory could end up in charge of the entire country. Considering the Enclave was trying to control the country, it makes sense for the Brotherhood to do the same.
 
Beaushizzle said:
TorontRayne said:
Beaushizzle said:
The settlers on the Oregon trail made it in covered wagons without bridges or decent roads under constant threat of native American attacks and disease.
Click to expand...

I bet they didn't encounter Deathclaws, Radioactive tornados, Super Mutants, and a much harsher environment that makes it harder to find food and water. ;)
Click to expand...
They also didn't have power armor, laser and plasma weapons, belt- and magazine-fed firearms, combat experience, stimpacks, radaway, psycho, mini-nukes.
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All things that can run out during the trip minus the experience points. :grin:
 
Thing is, the brotherhood were never about expanding their numbers or running territory. They are warriors and military technicians/scientists, not economists or politicians.

The elders thought the glow was a bad idea, forget wasting resources for a cross country trek, even for tech. Every BoS retcon, one can thank Bethesda for.

200 years, growth is a given, but the sticking point is how much. Regional power expansion sure. But everything making the Lyons expedition work is predicated on BoS forces. Without Beth logic and Tactics, most of the country is still very dangerous. Its essentially large settlements seperated by the wasteland.
 
TorontRayne said:
Beaushizzle said:
TorontRayne said:
Beaushizzle said:
The settlers on the Oregon trail made it in covered wagons without bridges or decent roads under constant threat of native American attacks and disease.
Click to expand...

I bet they didn't encounter Deathclaws, Radioactive tornados, Super Mutants, and a much harsher environment that makes it harder to find food and water. ;)
Click to expand...
They also didn't have power armor, laser and plasma weapons, belt- and magazine-fed firearms, combat experience, stimpacks, radaway, psycho, mini-nukes.
Click to expand...

All things that can run out during the trip minus the experience points. :grin:
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True, but let's be honest, even back the original games the world of Fallout was never stingy with its conveniently placed supplies. The seeting always had an overabundance of weapons, ammo and stimpack considering the whole ''apocalypse'' thing.
 
I guess you are right. Something of note is there was apparently no faction worth mentioning in their travels aside from those already mentioned. I should replay Fallout 3 to brush up on some of the dialog describing the whole ordeal.
 
The only time I found ammo and weapons were from merchants or vanquished foes. Othereise, they are found in lockers of pre-war military bases and research facilities.

I got my first set of leather armor and weapons from Killian. Found some ammo and weapons in the nearby vault filled with raiders. Its not like I found a plasma rifle in some dresser drawer in a random abandoned building.
 
TorontRayne said:
I guess you are right. Something of note is there was apparently no faction worth mentioning in their travels aside from those already mentioned. I should replay Fallout 3 to brush up on some of the dialog describing the whole ordeal.
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That's one of my peeves with the Fallout canon as a whole, actually. The West Coast has spawned the BoS, various major cities like the Hub and New Reno, the NCR, the Legion, the Master's army, and a motley crew of minor factions but still relatively advanced factions such as the Shi, the Followers and Broken Hills. But apparently the entire territory occupied by the Legion prior to its arrival was solely settled by 86 easily conquerable, random tribes? There are no significant settlements we ever hear about beyond the Core Regions save for New Canaan? No major power has sprang up between the West Coast and East Coast in 200 years? I get that we didn't spend much time outside the West or East coast, but it seems that the rest of the US is pretty empty.

The Commonwealth being underdevelopped is actually a plot point in FO4, because of the Institute's interference and the decline of the Minutemen. But otherwise it feels as if only NCR and the Legion have managed to become major powers over two centuries across all of the US. And I guess the Midwest/Maxson BoS, but the former is only sorta canon and the later is conditional on the player's actions.
 
Oh and btw the Mysterious Stranger is canon. I always thought he was some goofy Wild Wasteland type thing but apparently he has traveled across the US and is immortal or some shit.
 
TorontRayne said:
Oh and btw the Mysterious Stranger is canon. I always thought he was some goofy Wild Wasteland type thing but apparently he has traveled across the US and is immortal or some shit.
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Isn't that still conjecture/easter-eggy? Like, it's hinted to be the father of the guitar-dude in NV, but obviously... I mean, wtf does he do, teleport? Is he some kind of summonable cowboy demon? :D

Sometimes these in-game facts are taken very seriously, especially in associated wikis, I like to take some of these things with a big bag of salt... :D
 
TorontRayne said:
Oh and btw the Mysterious Stranger is canon. I always thought he was some goofy Wild Wasteland type thing but apparently he has traveled across the US and is immortal or some shit.
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I'd say that's more of an easter egg than anythng, really, given that only Nick seems to even see him. Nothing to worry about unless bethesda starts doing a Mysterious Stranger DLC or something.
 
The Institute has no real motives or goals that make sense. Teleportation is kinda dumb and a lazy plot device

The Cabot and Ghoul child quests were the dumbest and most insulting quests in the franchises history.

Momma Murpheys "sight" gives us a prophecy (Bethesda this isn't elder scrolls)

Brotherhood of Steel act like a pre-war military and use similar jargon. For example When you reach CIT with Liberty Prime a Knight is scripted to yell "Godless Freaks! Die!". Didn't know the Brotherhood were the religious types.

Brotherhood of Steel wants to destroy institute and synths instead of capturing and studying tech and keeping it locked away in their database.

Brotherhood wants to kill all ghouls where before there was only indifference.

Jet is found in pre-war containers and mentioned on pre-war terminals, Pete Hinds was called out on this and responded with "Fuck you, don't care"

Power Armor is abundant and has limited fuel that runs out quickly.

Many weapons now have different designed and use different ammo from previous games. (Bethesda, if you paid attention people excused this from the leap from Fallout 2 to 3 citing how much more detailed it had to be) You don't get a free pass to do this again.

"T-60"

Pre-war Vertibirds

X-01 found in pre-war military checkpoints despite the loading screen tip itself explaining its a post-war armor made by the Enclave. Despite the Enclave having no apparent presence in the Commonwealth at any point. (Ten bucks enclave are going to be in dlc)

I'm sure there's more but that's all I could think of at the moment.
 
Plzstandbuy said:
Momma Murpheys "sight" gives us a prophecy (Bethesda this isn't elder scrolls)
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Unfortunately Mama Murphy and her sight are nothing new. In New Vegas we had the Forecaster who was very similar to her. In Fallout 2 we had Hakunin who could communicate telepathically and the Master from Fallout 1 who could project harmful hallucinations in to the minds of his enemies. I think even Fallout 3 had a Psyker too in Point Lookout but I didn't play it too much to be honest.
 
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