Mr Fish
Slippy sloppy, The
Maybe... The loading screens take longer to load 'because' they allow you to rotate the 3D model?
Fallout 4 is not "Skyrim with guns."
- Thread starter Thebakedpotato
- Start date
ZigzagPX4
The Swiftness of the Ranger
Yeah, I'm still annoyed no one has considered this possibility. There's even the ability to tap the VATS key to coat the whole thing in a highlight of your HUD colour. Methinks they didn't really put actual thought into the concept - the thing that's making it more fun to wait is what's making you wait in the first place. Seems like an oversight.
Another possibility is that their engine is just that bad, but Bethesda has invested far too much into the Gamebryo -> Creation line to start moving off and build upon a new engine. At worst, they'll have to switch to an engine they won't have complete mastery of. Considering how much modern Fallout fans (i.e. me) factor physics (ragdolls and moving objects, Half-Life style), and modding capabilities (whether the game is good standalone or not, modding increases lifespan of a game) into what's needed in a Fallout game, that's not a risk they're willing to take. Time and money constraints are a big issue even for AAA companies.
So they could've just went "ah, it's not like we can change engines anyway, might as well give up and ease the loading pain as much as we can".
edit: spelling
Irwin John Finster
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
The loading screens are a feature.
TomJ
Still Mildly Glowing
I personally hated the original Borderlands. I could never figure out how to advance the main quest. At least in TES or Fallout games, what advances the quest is blatantly handed to you. Hell, even Obsidian told me to go to the Strip to advance the quest. In Borderlands, I had like 20 quests and I wasn't even sure which one was even remotely related to the main quest. In Oblivion I knew to go to a monastery, in Fallout 3 go to GNR, Fallout NV go to the Strip, Skyrim go to Whiterun and Fallout 4 go to Diamond City. Then find the one important person and ask them who to talk to.
Mr Fish
Slippy sloppy, The
Well, the missiosn in Borderlands 2 that are main missions got a vault symbol instead of a gear symbol. If it is the same in Borderlands 1 then that's how you tell the missions apart from one another.
Dr Fallout
Centurion
Fair enough. I don't really like Borderlands, but I had more fun with it.
Aaron Burr
First time out of the vault
Borderlands (both 1/2) as single-player games are easily worse than Skyrim/Oblivion. Borderlands 2 as a co-op game, however, is more fun than I ever had in Oblivion or Skyrim, no matter how many mods you pump into them. Borderlands really should have marketed the games as a co-op shooter with a tacked on single-player experience, rather than a single-player open world FPS/RPG.
Dr Fallout
Centurion
Agreed. The single player was shit, but the co-op was great.
Meurzh
Spurs that Jingle Jangle
I hated Skyrim and found it to be the worst Elder Scrolls game ever made. Even ESO was better.
Khannis
Rebuilding America
I had many, many hours of fun in Skyrim. I don't have that much of a problem with Skyrim being Skyrim (I mean, it could be Morrowind, but...), I have a HUGE problem with Fallout being Skyrim. Fallout is not about radiant quests, minute exploration and zero agency. It's not about becoming head of all guilds, the supreme master of everything that's still blamed for stealing an apple despite saving the goddamn world.
Fallout is about great stories, about choice and consequence, about what's your stake in the world, how you affect it and those around you. Radiant quests in Fallout 4 made me sick. Random "magical" weapon/armor prefixes made me sick. The ending, most of all, made me sick.
Fallout is about great stories, about choice and consequence, about what's your stake in the world, how you affect it and those around you. Radiant quests in Fallout 4 made me sick. Random "magical" weapon/armor prefixes made me sick. The ending, most of all, made me sick.
HerveCaen
First time out of the vault
I dont really think Skyrim is all that bad myself. Second best TES game with Morrowind being first in my humble opinion..
Also whats this stuff about it being too easy to be leader of everything? I have been playing through Skyrim again today doing the Winterhold quests off and on and I still have yet to finish them. There may not be that many quests for it but they take some time to do.
Furthermore the questline is pretty substantial in what you do as well.. Learn basic magic > Uncover an ancient artifact > Find out that artifact is extremely dangerous > Look for clues as to where Staff of Magnus may be (big dungeon for this one) > Actually go where the Staff is at to get it (another big dungeon) > Confront Ancano at Winterhold College > Become new Arch-Mage because the previous guy died, you just saved the world and did a stupidly long questline. You can not compare this to "hay wanna be the general of minutemen?".
People doing the comparisons clearly only looked at the number of quests and didnt consider at all what you do in them nor how long they take to complete.
Also whats this stuff about it being too easy to be leader of everything? I have been playing through Skyrim again today doing the Winterhold quests off and on and I still have yet to finish them. There may not be that many quests for it but they take some time to do.
Furthermore the questline is pretty substantial in what you do as well.. Learn basic magic > Uncover an ancient artifact > Find out that artifact is extremely dangerous > Look for clues as to where Staff of Magnus may be (big dungeon for this one) > Actually go where the Staff is at to get it (another big dungeon) > Confront Ancano at Winterhold College > Become new Arch-Mage because the previous guy died, you just saved the world and did a stupidly long questline. You can not compare this to "hay wanna be the general of minutemen?".
People doing the comparisons clearly only looked at the number of quests and didnt consider at all what you do in them nor how long they take to complete.
I liked Skyrim until I didn't. I stopped liking it after I started thinking about whether or not it all makes sense. As long as I played it "just for fun" without thinking much, it was rather fun. Though combat mechanics are weeeaaaak, but it was good enough at the time. When I started activating more thought processes in my brain while playing, it all fell apart really quickly and not even the 120 mods I had running helped.
MercenarySnake
Kept you waiting huh?
Most of those quests were short when you can just back and slash your way through everything without much effort and the puzzles were stupidly easy. Way too easy to become the head of that faction when someone older and wiser with more dedication to the art of magic is more deserving. I mean you would think a planned successor would take the role if something ever happened to that person but it would take some good writers to accomplish that. I'm not sure why a rookie off the street would get to become the leader. Hell it looks like they took criticism the wrong way and instead of writing good factions for useful purposes instead of jamming them all into the main quest, they thought "maybe we should have the player slaughter all the factions that they don't join".
Juza The Cloud
Nanto Goshasei
Hell, in Skyrim you could dual weild weapons, can't do that in Fallout 4. Feels like even less to do in Fallout 4 after a certain level. And the amount of perks in crafting and shooting needed to be able to play is a waste of time. Everyone no matter what play style will take a handful of the same perks , bad design indeed.
Mr Fish
Slippy sloppy, The
Nu-uh! You're just not playing it right. It's a "role-playing game", remember? If you want to choose shitty perks for your role then that's a decision 'you' have to make. Not every role is meant to be perfectly balanced. That's not how life is. Some roles are inherently more useful than others.
HerveCaen
First time out of the vault
The occulory puzzle wasnt straight forward nor easy for your first time through. It still takes an hour or two alone just to get through Mzulft, puzzle aside. The only good replacements for Arch-mage are Mirabelle and the scholars. Mirabelle would have been a good replacement but she dies along with the Arch-mage. That leaves the Dragonborn and the rest of the scholars becoming Arch-mage now and honestly I dont think the scholars of Winterhold are all that competent.
Skyrim mages guild questline is in no way at all comparable to Garvey making you the general of the minutemen. People of higher status in the college die or you just surpass/equal them in competence to lead during the quests.
The way how you become archmache or the leader of any faction/guild in Skyrim, if not outright nonsensical, was still prety lackluster though. I won't even go into the fact that it is way to short, as a quest line, but more that your character doesn't even have any affiliation to magic. And yet, no matter what you do, there is no other way but become the leader.
An almost pure warrior or thief has the exact same chance to become the archmage like everyone else, which makes it simply said ... feel like plastic. As like everything was just designed to be there for YOU. And for what reason? Beacuse, hey! You are the chosen one! This secret club of super secret super mages observed YOU, the dragonborn of dragonborns! And decided in their whisdom that you should be the leader of them, even though it has absolutely zero effect on anything. The fact that you murdered everyone who was not immortal in Whiterun or the College of Winterhold? Who fucking cares, you are the chosen one!
. Becoming the super lieutenant of the college, congratulations! Equally meaningfull as if Caligula appointed his horse as consul in the senate.
The idea of a chosen one isn't even so bad, thousands of stories are based on that trope. And it works. If it's well done. Dune, Matrix, Star Wars, thousands of Disney cartoons that people love, use this concept to tell their story. It's as simple as it can get. But it works.
But the big difference between those stories and Beth's approach is, that the world in Skyrim, doesn't know the concept of failure. There is no way the player can fail any quest, outside of simply dieing, or any situation where he has actually to prove his worth. Without choices in a world like Skyrim, the whole thing becomes ultimately meaningless.
An almost pure warrior or thief has the exact same chance to become the archmage like everyone else, which makes it simply said ... feel like plastic. As like everything was just designed to be there for YOU. And for what reason? Beacuse, hey! You are the chosen one! This secret club of super secret super mages observed YOU, the dragonborn of dragonborns! And decided in their whisdom that you should be the leader of them, even though it has absolutely zero effect on anything. The fact that you murdered everyone who was not immortal in Whiterun or the College of Winterhold? Who fucking cares, you are the chosen one!
. Becoming the super lieutenant of the college, congratulations! Equally meaningfull as if Caligula appointed his horse as consul in the senate. The idea of a chosen one isn't even so bad, thousands of stories are based on that trope. And it works. If it's well done. Dune, Matrix, Star Wars, thousands of Disney cartoons that people love, use this concept to tell their story. It's as simple as it can get. But it works.
But the big difference between those stories and Beth's approach is, that the world in Skyrim, doesn't know the concept of failure. There is no way the player can fail any quest, outside of simply dieing, or any situation where he has actually to prove his worth. Without choices in a world like Skyrim, the whole thing becomes ultimately meaningless.
HerveCaen
First time out of the vault
I would really like for you to actually do that. Do a 'Lets play' even I am curious just how fast you can get through this 'short' questline without using TGM, with a mage character, and at a level most people would do them at.
An almost pure warrior or thief has the exact same chance to become the archmage like everyone else, which makes it simply said ... feel like plastic. As like everything was just designed to be there for YOU. And for what reason? Beacuse, hey! You are the chosen one! This secret club of super secret super mages observed YOU, the dragonborn of dragonborns! And decided in their whisdom that you should be the leader of them, even though it has absolutely zero effect on anything. The fact that you murdered everyone who was not immortal in Whiterun or the College of Winterhold? Who fucking cares, you are the chosen one!
You neglect to consider you learn many things on the way to completing the questline. To enter the College you only need to know a basic Fear spell so it is basically open to anyone with an ounce of magical skill. But once inside you do have access to learn mostly everything because there are trainers for all magic skills in the college.
Are you telling me that it is unheard of that:
> someone with barely any magic knowledge goes to attend college to become wiser of the arts
> becomes wiser by training with all the various NPCs there
> does fairly large questline for the college involving deadly magical artifact
> becomes leader when it is you that saves the college/world and the previous heads die?
Because it isnt to me. This isnt comparable at all to helping a guy fighting raiders that after decides you should be general.
Completely irrelevant, and I am not sure what you are getting at here. Skyrim is the story of the Dragonborn. I dont remember choice ever being a big thing in the TES series. I dont remember being able to side with Dagoth Ur or take control of the Numidium myself? Choice was in older Fallout games, rarely ever in TES. Different games, should not be compared.
Irwin John Finster
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
I think this sums up why Skyrim was lacking compared to previous Elder Scrolls quite nicely:
I would really like for you to actually do that. Do a 'Lets play' even I am curious just how fast you can get through this 'short' questline without using TGM, with a mage character, and at a level most people would do them at.
An almost pure warrior or thief has the exact same chance to become the archmage like everyone else, which makes it simply said ... feel like plastic. As like everything was just designed to be there for YOU. And for what reason? Beacuse, hey! You are the chosen one! This secret club of super secret super mages observed YOU, the dragonborn of dragonborns! And decided in their whisdom that you should be the leader of them, even though it has absolutely zero effect on anything. The fact that you murdered everyone who was not immortal in Whiterun or the College of Winterhold? Who fucking cares, you are the chosen one!
You neglect to consider you learn many things on the way to completing the questline. To enter the College you only need to know a basic Fear spell so it is basically open to anyone with an ounce of magical skill. But once inside you do have access to learn mostly everything because there are trainers for all magic skills in the college.
Are you telling me that it is unheard of that:
> someone with barely any magic knowledge goes to attend college to become wiser of the arts
> becomes wiser by training with all the various NPCs there
> does fairly large questline for the college involving deadly magical artifact
> becomes leader when it is you that saves the college/world and the previous heads die?
Because it isnt to me. This isnt comparable at all to helping a guy fighting raiders that after decides you should be general.
Completely irrelevant, and I am not sure what you are getting at here. Skyrim is the story of the Dragonborn. I dont remember choice ever being a big thing in the TES series. I dont remember being able to side with Dagoth Ur or take control of the Numidium myself? Choice was in older Fallout games, rarely ever in TES. Different games, should not be compared.
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HerveCaen
First time out of the vault
Skyrim lacking compared to previous TES games isnt the point here. Any TES fan already knows that it is lacking compared to Morrowind. Fact is lots of game franchises reach their peak and never achieve that same goodness again. Final Fantasy had its with VI and VII. TES with Morrowind. Fallout with Fallout 2. Zelda with Ocarina of Time. Chrono with.. Chrono Trigger.. yeah it jumped the shark right at the first sequel. Like it or not, that is just how it is with video games.
What is the point is saying becoming general of the minutemen in literally 10~20 mintues is equivalent to becoming Arch-mage of the Winterhold College in a questline that's going to take you 6~10hours+ to complete when you are not rushing it. This is by no means an accurate nor a fair comparison.
What is the point is saying becoming general of the minutemen in literally 10~20 mintues is equivalent to becoming Arch-mage of the Winterhold College in a questline that's going to take you 6~10hours+ to complete when you are not rushing it. This is by no means an accurate nor a fair comparison.