Ideas for new Fallout threats

[The Dutch Ghost]

It comes down to "It's a cool aesthetic" it seems. But yeah, the faction itself was underwritten and a poor choice for a main antagonist, just being able to join it wouldn't fix anything

I liked the Enclave in Fallout 2. But they were never meant to be a recurring villain or possible joining faction.
Their main goal is to take control of the wasteland by any means and eliminate all those they consider mutants.

I don't follow.

That Bethesda will perhaps recycle the ideology conflict plotline.
Basically something new works, and Bethesda which is already notorious for milking Fallout 1 and 2 and not being able to come up with their own ideas, they may jump onto this.
Or not.

How would PIP-Boy UI aspects be handled? Just normal menus without justification, I guess.

Yeah, from what I recall the player's stat, item, and map UI was more like a journal.

I think I remember you alluding to the terraforming concept in the past, but this is really fantastic for a lot of reasons. They way it actually gives some meaning to the Enclave space colonization plotline makes me feel like it could have been the plotline to a Black Isle Fallout 4 (which is always something I've wondered about). Like it's a sympathetic antagonist with understandable motives, firmly grounded in the Old World. And it makes really good use of the "Party of protagonists" antagonist. It's a shame that mod didn't get off the ground, but that's mods for you.

I was indeed playing with a different form of terraforming; the Bloom, a mutant jungle that was the result of a failed terraforming experiment, though in some of the current takes on the ideas the jungle does indeed do that; revive the soil.
Problem is that it is carnivorous, it mutates insects and arachnids, and it is developing a consciousness that not only seeks to preserve itself, but also 'cleanse' humans from contamination.

Yep, the plot of this mod would have tied into the Enclave's space program to colonize other planets such as Mars.
The terraform tech was developed for a manned rocket that was being build in Spaceport Sheboygan.
The player of course would have visited the Spaceport.

Glad to hear you would have liked it.

Well the idea is here. Perhaps if someone becomes interested in the future.

 

[Hardboiled Android]

That Bethesda will perhaps recycle the ideology conflict plotline.
Basically something new works, and Bethesda which is already notorious for milking Fallout 1 and 2 and not being able to come up with their own ideas, they may jump onto this.
Or not.

Ohhh, I see. yeah, I think they're probably going to continue that in all their future games more or less. And it will continue to not work, and fans who started on 3 and didn't go back will be confused why it keeps not working even though it worked in New Vegas.

(though to their credit, Bethesda did almost manage to pull it off in Far Harbor. Almost.)

Yeah, from what I recall the player's stat, item, and map UI was more like a journal.

Oh, duh.

I was indeed playing with a different form of terraforming; the Bloom, a mutant jungle that was the result of a failed terraforming experiment, though in some of the current takes on the ideas the jungle does indeed do that; revive the soil.
Problem is that it is carnivorous, it mutates insects and arachnids, and it is developing a consciousness that not only seeks to preserve itself, but also 'cleanse' humans from contamination.

Sort of like the mutant FEV in Tactics 2... or BoS 2... or Extreme... can't keep all those early 2000s projects straight, you know what I mean.

I think this works as a side plot, or as a main threat in a PnP setting, essentially a Fallout side story... but there has to be a 'person' behind it for it to work as a mainline antagonist, I think. Whatever 'person' is formed by this jungle would end up being fundamentally alien from people, Lovecraftian. But it is a cool sort of pulp threat, I've always been big into hive-mind-alien-psychology-assimilatory type stuff.

Glad to hear you would have liked it.

Well the idea is here. Perhaps if someone becomes interested in the future.

Yeah, it's definitely got legs.

 

[Deleted member 98605]

Bit of a necro but it's something I've thought a lot about since this thread; the fundamental threat or conflict in Fallout should not be faction based or ideologically based, at least not in the way that it was in New Vegas. The factional/"high ideology" based threat was something very fundamental to New Vegas. That WAS it's threat, not just the factions as specifically constituted, but factions and 'high ideology' in a more general sense. But I feel like since it was done so well in New Vegas, a lot of people (including Bethesda to disastrous results if Fallout 4 is anything to go on) seem to think that at the core of all Fallout settings should be ideology. This is the exceptional case, factions should in most settings be background - substantive, related to the main plot thematically and substantively, but not at its center.

Strong disagree.

The ideologies give it something to actually fight over.

Otherwise, what is left? Just fighting fauna and flora with no real purpose but day to day living? Boring. Fallout is the ethics of a post-apoc world, it is post-post apoc.
Even 1 had ideology: Unity and the Master. 2 had the Enclave and its American Racialism and Anti-Mutant ideology. 3 even had that to a point.

In all cases, the ideology should had been strengthened and permeated more than it was, because in all three they come off as weak and barely relevant.

Fallout needs more ideology. Environmentalists in Cascadia, Socialists and Leftists in the more industrial or urban zones, actual medieval kingdoms, Technocracies, something actually viable to drive a conflict, which drives a plot a player can get into and side with. They actually need to be fleshed out and their followers actually believe what they're fighting for.

In 4 it was 'The Minutemen are good cause local self defense plus add whacky 18th century trappings', where is the actual drive to make a New Commonwealth based on 18th century liberalism? The Institute does science for SCIENCE, not for any real practical goal. Not even believing in a synthesis of man and machine to cope with the post-war world. The BOS comes by because they hate another SCIENCE power, but other than some bullshit fear about Synths infiltrating have little justification otherwise, even their core ethos has eroded away. The Railroad exists just because the Institute does, moving away from actual slaves held by raiders and warlords - wasted opportunity.

 

[Hardboiled Android]

Strong disagree.

The ideologies give it something to actually fight over.

Otherwise, what is left? Just fighting fauna and flora with no real purpose but day to day living? Boring. Fallout is the ethics of a post-apoc world, it is post-post apoc.
Even 1 had ideology: Unity and the Master. 2 had the Enclave and its American Racialism and Anti-Mutant ideology. 3 even had that to a point.

In all cases, the ideology should had been strengthened and permeated more than it was, because in all three they come off as weak and barely relevant.

Fallout needs more ideology. Environmentalists in Cascadia, Socialists and Leftists in the more industrial or urban zones, actual medieval kingdoms, Technocracies, something actually viable to drive a conflict, which drives a plot a player can get into and side with. They actually need to be fleshed out and their followers actually believe what they're fighting for.

In 4 it was 'The Minutemen are good cause local self defense plus add whacky 18th century trappings', where is the actual drive to make a New Commonwealth based on 18th century liberalism? The Institute does science for SCIENCE, not for any real practical goal. Not even believing in a synthesis of man and machine to cope with the post-war world. The BOS comes by because they hate another SCIENCE power, but other than some bullshit fear about Synths infiltrating have little justification otherwise, even their core ethos has eroded away. The Railroad exists just because the Institute does, moving away from actual slaves held by raiders and warlords - wasted opportunity.

Of course ideology should be behind mainline threats, not just mutants and aimless tech. But here's the difference: the antagonist needs to be a faction with ideology, but the plot should not be centered around their direct conflict with another explicitly ideological group.

In Fallout 1, the Master of course has an ideology. But he's not really fighting against any given faction with a philosophy in lock-step opposition, he's fighting everyone and everyone in the Wasteland is more or less unaware of the Master as an ideological actor. The other 'faction' conflicts in the game are all in the context of a single town more or less.

Same in Fallout 2. The Enclave is of course ideologically driven, but they're not diametrically opposed in practical terms to any given group - they're against everyone, and everyone is more or less unaware of them. The other faction conflict is more extensive than 1's with the NCR-Reno-Vault City influence war, but again this is all basically removed from the Enclave.

 

[Atomic Postman]

Strong disagree.

The ideologies give it something to actually fight over.

Otherwise, what is left? Just fighting fauna and flora with no real purpose but day to day living? Boring. Fallout is the ethics of a post-apoc world, it is post-post apoc.
Even 1 had ideology: Unity and the Master. 2 had the Enclave and its American Racialism and Anti-Mutant ideology. 3 even had that to a point.

In all cases, the ideology should had been strengthened and permeated more than it was, because in all three they come off as weak and barely relevant.

Fallout needs more ideology. Environmentalists in Cascadia, Socialists and Leftists in the more industrial or urban zones, actual medieval kingdoms, Technocracies, something actually viable to drive a conflict, which drives a plot a player can get into and side with. They actually need to be fleshed out and their followers actually believe what they're fighting for.

In 4 it was 'The Minutemen are good cause local self defense plus add whacky 18th century trappings', where is the actual drive to make a New Commonwealth based on 18th century liberalism? The Institute does science for SCIENCE, not for any real practical goal. Not even believing in a synthesis of man and machine to cope with the post-war world. The BOS comes by because they hate another SCIENCE power, but other than some bullshit fear about Synths infiltrating have little justification otherwise, even their core ethos has eroded away. The Railroad exists just because the Institute does, moving away from actual slaves held by raiders and warlords - wasted opportunity.

I'd say of the many things F4 gets wrong, BoS hating synths isn't one. They pose an existential risk to humanity in the same fashion as the Super Mutants. Replacement, enslavement, whatever, and they're created by a group that isn't them quite literally playing God with technology. That's their ethos to it's core.

Where they go wrong is the absolutely retarded Luddite approach of destroying the institute rather than securing it for themselves and having their hatred for synths be them not being human rather than appealing to ethos of their codex, which is an appallingly clumsy bit of writing.

I think you're misunderstanding the argument a bit though. You can still have strong ideologies without it being New Vegas style factional conflict. E.g environmentalists with compelling ideology trying to spread Dutch Ghosts Bloom, et cetera. You even agree yourself with saying that the outright villainous Unity and Enclave were ideologically motivated, they just needed further fleshing out (although I think the Unity is pretty decent as is)

 

[StopSigntheVendingMachine]

Back in April while at work, I pieced together a villain by ripping off others' ideas; including some from this thread and from Wasteland 3's cutting room floor. I discovered that No Mutants Allowed didn't save progress on my post so that put me off from finishing it. I won't even bother trying to write it out in paragraphs now.

Spoiler: So here it is. My pitch for antagonists for a Fallout mod or game set in Washington are:

Wendigos

- Tall, skeletal, mutant deer-people
- "Inspirations":
at 13:58 -20:40

Vampires. Kinda...

Mexican half-human, half-bats. Unlike super mutants or ghouls these guys can and do breed. Also they feed on human blood, so they could remain humanoid.

Biology:
The creatures are originally human that have some bat DNA inside. Their DNA is unstable for reasons unknown, and after a certain age they must gather new human DNA once a month or two. The longer the creatures lack Human DNA samples, the more feral and animalistic they turn. They could breed, though they often choose not to due to lack of food. Some look human (though extremely rare), some look bat, but most are somewhere in between.

Origin:
The whole thing started pre-war in South America. A scientist from unknown origin, experimented with bats. He found a species that was more resistant to radiation than most animals. He then made a experimental vaccine, that would alter human DNA, making humans almost immune to high levels of radiation. Side effects were minor -mostly changes in skin pigmentation and improved sound perseption.
What exactly happend is not known. Did the scientist release the drug? How many people were vaccinised? Those things are a mistery, since around the time the drug was ready, the bombs start falling. we can be sure about one thing - something survived.

Culture:
Well, they live in small deserted towns, slowly moving north year after year, decade after decade in search for humans. They are mostly nocturnal. Their DNA is f**ked up, to they are not very nice. Some can talk, most are inteligent. Children are rather rare. Some use guns, some don't - depending on the level of Mutation.
They are not evil, but they almost always need human blood to survive, making them very dangerous. Every year they selebrate the Calavera Carnival, a vicious ritural with human sacrifices and live music.

- They still have their human intellect and remember their past lives. They can use guns, wear armor and clothes and can strategize ... but can't talk. They communicate with sign language, but mostly basic hand gestures ( thumbs up, middle finger, etc.), vocal noises, and reading each others' body language.

- Communicating with them is hard, but reasoning with them is the real challenge.

- They eat humans, specifically hunt humans like animals. Common traps are supply caches out in the open. Others are like the intro to this video, with the broadcast being the genuine fear from a past victim:

When their meat supply runs dry, the Wendigos will begin their "hunting season" with individual hunters targeting travelers out in the wastes. When enough time passes, people will start noticing the mass disappearances and stop venturing outside. The Wendigos will then be forced to assault entire towns and villages; not implying they weren't going to do that anyways. They will first target the radio station; to keep settlements in the dark and to keep them from communicating with each other. They'll go on to systematically; and nearly, purge The Overgrowth (Washington Wasteland) of human life, but leave just enough alive so they can repopulate. Because of this, the Wendigos are hesitant to kill women and children. Once they've harvested all the meat they can, they'll move on to the next region and start all over again.

- Wendigos find other types of meat nasty or not-as-good. They explicitly eat human flesh.

- The big twists in the story are their existence and the fact they aren't from Washington. They came from Alaska (referencing real life mythology and the main reason they're chosen for the setting).

- Some Wendigo lore versions say you become one by committing cannibalism in a forest cursed with the Wendigo spirit. For Fallout, the Wendigos give their own flesh to a select few. Methods are either tricking a human prisoner into eating it by mixing bits of it in their food, or just force feeding. For the latter, a Wendigo would enter your cell, slice off a chunk of skin off their arm, leg, or chest in front of you and then cram it down your throat. Sometimes they'll try growing their numbers "the normal way", but Wendigo birth is too extreme. One of the sub-endings are the player becoming a Wendigo themselves, which would affect the main endings because of everyone's reaction to it.

- Surface level: deer hunting people instead of people hunting deer. Cannibals with a scarier coat of paint

- Plot and theme level: The Wendigos are "innocent" in a sense that their only motivation is survival. Not malice or sadism and certainly not greed. Everyone needs to eat; simple as that.

- Wendigos Vs. The Raider (Player moniker)

1. The Wendigos only take what they need so their food source isn't depleted. Raiders in general take as much of whatever they want from who ever they want.

2. The Raider came to The Overgrowth to pillage it's over abundant resources, like everyone else who isn't local. The Wendigos came to The Overgrowth for it's dense human population, because of said abundance.

Reasons why the Wendigos may be well received (at least on NMA):
1. A new race of sub-human
2. A non-ideologically driven faction, though they'll be used to compare morality with the general wasteland and the player (to an extent)
3. A relatively small-scale threat
4. Body horror and monster movie based (personal reason why I choose them to be the main antagonists)

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

I think this works as a side plot, or as a main threat in a PnP setting, essentially a Fallout side story... but there has to be a 'person' behind it for it to work as a mainline antagonist, I think. Whatever 'person' is formed by this jungle would end up being fundamentally alien from people, Lovecraftian. But it is a cool sort of pulp threat, I've always been big into hive-mind-alien-psychology-assimilatory type stuff.

It would be/would have been a side plot in my Fallout Texas setting.
There would not be a person behind it though, rather its the people who worship it and that seek to make it spread around the Texas wasteland that... well are the active players.
They believe that the Bloom represents nature reclaiming its dominion over the world after humanity nearly wiped it out.

The jungle itself would have a very alien mindset, one humans can not comprehend. But it on its turn can not really comprehend humanity.

The Bloom and its worshipers represent the ideology that humanity should return to nature and live in harmony with it, becoming part of it by becoming human-plant hybrids by being 'cleansed'.

They are the opposite group to a group of technology worshipers who believe that humanity should embrace technology and merge with it. Overcoming human limitations such as emotions, instinct by embracing machine style logic.


Ideologies would have played an important role in my setting.
Politics, but what also would be the best future for humanity to follow?
Rebuild the world in any image of the old one? (unlimited free market but little concern about human lives and values, bring back empire, live free or die) Embrace nature and abandon technology? (become one with nature?) Embrace technology and free humanity from its ties to nature? (become one with technology) Abandon materialism and pursue spirituality/religion?

 

[Walpknut]

Fallout spin off where the 80's challenge all the big factions of the setting to a cross country race around familiar lcoations from previous game for the access to nuclear launch codes.
You can control The Courier, The Lone Wanderer, the Fuckwad from 111, The 100 years old Chosen One, the ghost of the Vault Dweller, all the companions and factions leaders. The pwoers are obviously based around perks, skills and notorious weapons like the Euclid C finder.

 

[Hardboiled Android]

It would be/would have been a side plot in my Fallout Texas setting.
There would not be a person behind it though, rather its the people who worship it and that seek to make it spread around the Texas wasteland that... well are the active players.
They believe that the Bloom represents nature reclaiming its dominion over the world after humanity nearly wiped it out.

The jungle itself would have a very alien mindset, one humans can not comprehend. But it on its turn can not really comprehend humanity.

The Bloom and its worshipers represent the ideology that humanity should return to nature and live in harmony with it, becoming part of it by becoming human-plant hybrids by being 'cleansed'.

They are the opposite group to a group of technology worshipers who believe that humanity should embrace technology and merge with it. Overcoming human limitations such as emotions, instinct by embracing machine style logic.


Ideologies would have played an important role in my setting.
Politics, but what also would be the best future for humanity to follow?
Rebuild the world in any image of the old one? (unlimited free market but little concern about human lives and values, bring back empire, live free or die) Embrace nature and abandon technology? (become one with nature?) Embrace technology and free humanity from its ties to nature? (become one with technology) Abandon materialism and pursue spirituality/religion?

Are tehse guys like at one location, a threat but not some big power on par with the Unity? Or are they one of the big powers? I like the idea, though for me (considering my prior statements) I think this wouldw ork better as a side-group rather than the main plot.

 

[Walpknut]

Gonna use some stupid Bethesda new lore for this one and mostly just writing it by ear, it's a formless idea I have had for a bit:

The Vault Tec plague

50 to 70 years prior to wherever the story takes place, one of the control Vaults opened up and they sent out their best warrior and leader out there to explore and acquire intel on what was going outside.
This Vault Dweller formed a brave party of misfits and uncovered a scheme by a pre war Zax and a doomsday cult to take over a robot manufacturing facility to take over the region with an army of mechanical terrors using mysterious blueprints that a pre war scientist had developed but where encrypted using some kinda Vault tec algorythm and thus they had started targeting vaults to find a way to unlock it. The Vault Dweller stopped by pointing out the blueprints were for farming robots, they wouldn't actually be useful for waging war in any capacity. The Zax shut down and reset to avoid facing failure and the doomsday cult was captured or surrendered by the vault residents and the inhabitants of settlements the Vault Dweller had helped.

It was when the Vault inhabitants took over the robot producing plant to make use of it's facilities for something productive that the Vault Dweller had an epiphany. The robots fro mthe blueprints could actually be integrated with the technology found in GECKs to terraform the land en masse. Soon the Vault started production on the robots, moving their entire operation to work out of the factory, but they needed raw materials, thankfully the Vault Dweller had found a mine in his travels.... and thankfully they also had an available work force to work there, the Doomsday cult.

Soon the Vault created their troop of terraforming robits and started reforming the land.... unfortunatelly the energy needed for the operation was too great. Thankfully the Vault Dweller had also found an old Uranium mine from before the war, and he had helped the mayor of a town to take power away from the corrupt mob boss that ruled them, so they had the members of his gang and citizens who weren't fans of the new adminsitration to work there.

Soon the small troop of terraforming robots turned into a small army, they made the land green.... for the allies of the Vault Dweller and his people. Anyone who had opposed him in his travels were quickly made slaves to work on the factory or the mines, or their settlements were wiped out with the power of the in built Gecks to corce them into working on the mines or you know..... move away. The new terraformed land wasn't for everyone, and because of the resources and power of the community they had no incentive to "negotiate" with anyone, people either kneeled or got out of the way or they would be quickly dispatched. The Factory was also expanded to now create the army the ZAX and the Doomsday cult dreamed of. The society forming around it grew more and more reliant on their technology and robots that nobody has ever actually managed to speak to any member of this advancing force, there is no diplomacy to attempt and very little chance of out gunning them.

The legendary Vault Dweller of old is now a reclusive tyrant coordinating the expansion and their grand plan with his close circle of followers.

 

[Ugly Kid]

Earlier in the thread people were talking about factions at war and how they should just be events in the background rather than the main conflict. I agree with this but it got me thinking, could it be a good idea for a future game to not just have tensions in the background but full blown battles which you could spectate or participate in?

For example: the Khans and Legion remnants are warring over a region and you could watch a victor arise or tip the balance a little in the favor one of the sides. You could hear about the battle as it's happening through the radio or spy on some military figures to hear about it before it happens. Etc etc.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Are tehse guys like at one location, a threat but not some big power on par with the Unity? Or are they one of the big powers? I like the idea, though for me (considering my prior statements) I think this wouldw ork better as a side-group rather than the main plot.

They are indeed a side group, as are the opposite party to them.
Both in their own way seeking to win 'hearts and minds'.

This cult, the Bloom Cultists have knowledge not only on how to extract food and medicine from the Bloom without harming it. But also have knowledge, possibly tech that allows them to revive soil and make it suitable for farming again.
Their philosophy is about harmony with nature.

Some of the Bloom Cultists that have been 'embraced' or cleansed by the Bloom, have been transformed into human-plant hybrid mutants that have increased resistance and regenerative abilities as well as being to take on nourishment like a plant does. A state or condition the Bloom Tenders believe is something desirable.


Their opposites; the Followers of the ATLANTIS, a 'cult' led by a self aware computer, offer knowledge and technology to people in the wasteland.
They invest knowledge and technology into communities and groups that could help the Followers with their own goals of creating a new industrial infrastructure and start a new era of science and technology.
They advocate post-humanism/transcendence; that humanity must abandon its last ties to its organic nature and fully embrace the machine.

They practice cybernetic modification and genetic engineering on themselves to become Man Plus.


There are also other groups with almost religious like philosophies.

The Clone Masters of Clone Station seek to preserve pure human DNA so that one day pure humanity can reclaim the Earth. (no they are not genocidal maniacs)

The Angels of the Lord/Kingdom believe humanity must turn back to God and abandon its obsession with materialism.
They see it as their goal to bring law, order, and the word of God to the ignorant masses. Aid the weak, poor, and sick. And wipe out anarchy and other dangers to humanity.

The Signal Listeners believe there are aliens out there who can help or save humanity. And that they must seek to establish contact with the aliens (a delusion but the sense of community and pursuing a greater goal is real, and they know a lot about communication technology and computers).

The Children of the Unity preach that humans who willing serve the Super Mutants may one day become Super Mutants as well (a lie, there is no FEV2 any more).

 

[Hardboiled Android]

They are indeed a side group, as are the opposite party to them.
Both in their own way seeking to win 'hearts and minds'.

This cult, the Bloom Cultists have knowledge not only on how to extract food and medicine from the Bloom without harming it. But also have knowledge, possibly tech that allows them to revive soil and make it suitable for farming again.
Their philosophy is about harmony with nature.

Some of the Bloom Cultists that have been 'embraced' or cleansed by the Bloom, have been transformed into human-plant hybrid mutants that have increased resistance and regenerative abilities as well as being to take on nourishment like a plant does. A state or condition the Bloom Tenders believe is something desirable.


Their opposites; the Followers of the ATLANTIS, a 'cult' led by a self aware computer, offer knowledge and technology to people in the wasteland.
They invest knowledge and technology into communities and groups that could help the Followers with their own goals of creating a new industrial infrastructure and start a new era of science and technology.
They advocate post-humanism/transcendence; that humanity must abandon its last ties to its organic nature and fully embrace the machine.

They practice cybernetic modification and genetic engineering on themselves to become Man Plus.


There are also other groups with almost religious like philosophies.

The Clone Masters of Clone Station seek to preserve pure human DNA so that one day pure humanity can reclaim the Earth. (no they are not genocidal maniacs)

The Angels of the Lord/Kingdom believe humanity must turn back to God and abandon its obsession with materialism.
They see it as their goal to bring law, order, and the word of God to the ignorant masses. Aid the weak, poor, and sick. And wipe out anarchy and other dangers to humanity.

The Signal Listeners believe there are aliens out there who can help or save humanity. And that they must seek to establish contact with the aliens (a delusion but the sense of community and pursuing a greater goal is real, and they know a lot about communication technology and computers).

The Children of the Unity preach that humans who willing serve the Super Mutants may one day become Super Mutants as well (a lie, there is no FEV2 any more).

What’s the main plot? Or better even, link me the thread?

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

What’s the main plot? Or better even, link me the thread?

I have not updated the page I have for this project in ages, and I would not know where to start as there is a lot to cover.
I have been writing on and off on googledocs and worddocs.

There is no main plot.
I felt the one I had was too much of a repeat of Van Buren, so I dropped it for the time to focus on thinking out the setting, the places, and the factions in it.

Most likely I would use the Black Hats, Desert Ranger exiles from the West that have been driven to Texas by Caesar's Legion in any main plot.
They are a force that is working in the shadows, and has connections to some of the factions such as the Followers of the ATLANTIS, the Clone Masters, the Lone Star traders, the prospectors of the Drowned City which they use to acquire weaponry and other means to build an army.

Though I would like to give the player a personal nemesis as well.

 

[Hardboiled Android]

I have not updated the page I have for this project in ages, and I would not know where to start as there is a lot to cover.
I have been writing on and off on googledocs and worddocs.

There is no main plot.
I felt the one I had was too much of a repeat of Van Buren, so I dropped it for the time to focus on thinking out the setting, the places, and the factions in it.

Most likely I would use the Black Hats, Desert Ranger exiles from the West that have been driven to Texas by Caesar's Legion in any main plot.
They are a force that is working in the shadows, and has connections to some of the factions such as the Followers of the ATLANTIS, the Clone Masters, the Lone Star traders, the prospectors of the Drowned City which they use to acquire weaponry and other means to build an army.

Though I would like to give the player a personal nemesis as well.

Well if you're ever looking to bounce ideas off of someone or want suggestions, feel free to DM me.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

It's kind of funny. When I first made up the Black Hats, they were just another random small faction, not that dissimilar to the Outcasts of Bethesda's Fallout 3.
Just a bunch of militia guys with a lot of weaponry and power armor, holed up in some place, not doing much really.

Only later I thought of making them a more significant group that really has an ideology and an agenda of their own, and that is plotting, planning, and scheming in the background.

Think of them sort of like a... well not an evil version of the Desert Rangers, a more amoral or extremist version.
One that for example rather than blowing up Cochise in Wasteland 1, would instead have it reprogrammed to serve them and produce robots, weapons, and technology for their plans of reuniting the wasteland and creating a new America under their leadership.

Their intentions are not necessarily evil or immoral, but the way they seek to accomplish their goals is questionable.

Still they do have some good sides. For one, they absolutely hate slavers.
They would oppose the Caesar's Legion, but also the Cartel and their Manhunters who supply them with slaves for the uranium mines and uranium refining/enrichment plant.

Think the NCR, but if it was led by the military (not a military junta, but a stratocracy, sort of a government like in Starship Troopers). More determined to reunite the wasteland, diplomatically or though military means.

 

[Hardboiled Android]

It's kind of funny. When I first made up the Black Hats, they were just another random small faction, not that dissimilar to the Outcasts of Bethesda's Fallout 3.
Just a bunch of militia guys with a lot of weaponry and power armor, holed up in some place, not doing much really.

Only later I thought of making them a more significant group that really has an ideology and an agenda of their own, and that is plotting, planning, and scheming in the background.

Think of them sort of like a... well not an evil version of the Desert Rangers, a more amoral or extremist version.
One that for example rather than blowing up Cochise in Wasteland 1, would instead have it reprogrammed to serve them and produce robots, weapons, and technology for their plans of reuniting the wasteland and creating a new America under their leadership.

Their intentions are not necessarily evil or immoral, but the way they seek to accomplish their goals is questionable.

Still they do have some good sides. For one, they absolutely hate slavers.
They would oppose the Caesar's Legion, but also the Cartel and their Manhunters who supply them with slaves for the uranium mines and uranium refining/enrichment plant.

Think the NCR, but if it was led by the military (not a military junta, but a stratocracy, sort of a government like in Starship Troopers). More determined to reunite the wasteland, diplomatically or though military means.

I'd avoid explicit desires to rebuild America, just to avoid a direct NCR comparison. Moreso just "Justice and order - no matter the cost."

 

[Dayglow Drifter]

I always thought it would be kinda cool to have a Fallout bad guy who is hanging out in some kind of underwater sea base

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

I'd avoid explicit desires to rebuild America, just to avoid a direct NCR comparison. Moreso just "Justice and order - no matter the cost."

I understand your viewpoint on that, and the Blacks Hats may also come over as a more 'modern armed' version of Caesar's Legion, seeking to create a state run by the military.
But I still need something a little bit more 'solid' that just law and order. The Black Hats really see it as their duty to civilize the wasteland (which may also sound a little NCR/Legion) and teach people law, order, and discipline, to make them behave.


I thought about using that plot I told you about in another thread, the one that I made up for Surf Solar's Fallout TC years ago. (the one with an antagonist Vault Dweller party)

The 'threat' would be fitting, Vault Dwellers seek to turn Texas from a radioactive dustbowl back into a habitable land through pre war developed experimental terraform technology (I actually want to introduce climate altering technology in the Texas wasteland) and organisms (perhaps the Bloom which I mentioned before is this organism), but the process is going to kill almost everyone in the region.

The Vault Dwellers don't really care or think that everyone on the surface is a barbarian, currently occupying good real estate the Vault Dwellers can develop better.
Or perhaps the majority of them does not even know that civilization has been rebuilding on the surface.

Still I have the feeling it is not so up to pair with the Master and his Unity, the Enclave, or Dr Presper and his plan to reset the South West.

I always thought it would be kinda cool to have a Fallout bad guy who is hanging out in some kind of underwater sea base

Many years ago before the release of Fallout 3 or even Van Buren, fans were making their own RPG modules based on content from Fallout 1 and 2.
One writer did his or her own expanded take on the Enclave, coming up with the idea that the oil rig was merely a surface installation that led to a greater underwater colony called Hydropolis, which survived the destruction of the rig.

Personally I was not completely sold on the idea as I felt that the Enclave having access to a massive underwater colony stretched things a little too far.
That they had the oil rig which contained next to living quarters also R&D and manufacturing facilities, along with bases on the mainland was sufficient in my opinion.

The same writer also came up with Astropolis, a massive space colony that had been created by robots sent into space by rockets to the asteroid belt to use the available material there to build the colony.
And once the colony had been finished, it set a course for Earth where it went into orbit.

That was also a little too advanced for my taste. I could imagine the US have space stations and perhaps an outpost on the moon, but not the capacity yet to construct settlements in other parts of the Solar System.

 

[Hardboiled Android]

I understand your viewpoint on that, and the Blacks Hats may also come over as a more 'modern armed' version of Caesar's Legion, seeking to create a state run by the military.
But I still need something a little bit more 'solid' that just law and order. The Black Hats really see it as their duty to civilize the wasteland (which may also sound a little NCR/Legion) and teach people law, order, and discipline, to make them behave.

This is fine, I just don't think they should explicitly be yearning towards the Old World, just a Cowboy-mythology influenced vision of what constitute's "civilization," filtered through the lens of the various civilized towns of the West, in New California and the various civilized oases in the Four Corners.

I thought about using that plot I told you about in another thread, the one that I made up for Surf Solar's Fallout TC years ago. (the one with an antagonist Vault Dweller party)

The 'threat' would be fitting, Vault Dwellers seek to turn Texas from a radioactive dustbowl back into a habitable land through pre war developed experimental terraform technology (I actually want to introduce climate altering technology in the Texas wasteland) and organisms (perhaps the Bloom which I mentioned before is this organism), but the process is going to kill almost everyone in the region.

The Vault Dwellers don't really care or think that everyone on the surface is a barbarian, currently occupying good real estate the Vault Dwellers can develop better.
Or perhaps the majority of them does not even know that civilization has been rebuilding on the surface.

Still I have the feeling it is not so up to pair with the Master and his Unity, the Enclave, or Dr Presper and his plan to reset the South West.

Yeah, I think it would work really well to repurpose the Surf Solar concepts. And I absolutely disagree that it's not up to par, the concept really does feel like it could have been the plot of a Black Isle Fallout 4. It's really quite good.