Legion Appreciation Thread

[Izak]

Now that I think about it, what would be non-bullshit strategies for NCR against the Legion?

What I'm about to say is basically fannon but it makes more sense then NV's justification (which was that the entire NCR high command was retarded). Oliver was waiting for Caesar to break himself on Hoover Dam a second time, forcing him to abandon his campaign for Vegas; after all most great Military leaders have one famous defeat, but you're simply not a good General if you repeat the mistake multiple times. (End Fannon)

If you want to fight an entirely defensive war. You need to make the entire region more defensible and not drawn-out. So either you need to protect fewer things or get more forces.

From my understanding most of the NCR's interests in the Mojave were well defended (or at the very least well manned) considering that the vast majority of them were practically undefendable (Helios, Forlorn Hope, Aerotech, Etc.).

Basically you have to lay into House diplomatically and get him to be a more active participant in the war on your behalf. This can be done, it just isn't acceptable to NCR hawks. House has to play ball with you if you threaten to take it home with you. So this means you really would have to negotiate favorable trade terms he can live with without wanting the entire pie to yourself. But of course, NCR wants more, which is why Crocker is the only ambassador to "accept the limits of his position."

House had more or less blocked all NCR influence in Vegas, the Embassy was a joke made specifically to limit NCR influence in Vegas; House was of course satisfied with this, he believes he's the single human being left in the wasteland capable of restoring Vegas and that compromising with the NCR is the same as killing the glittering jewel of the wastes that is Vegas.

Other minor regional powers are Boomers, the Brotherhood and the caravan companies. You can't have caravan companies undermining other traders in the area by literally killing off their competition. The benefits of a military pact with the other two are obvious.

Well the NCR was completely unaware of the Crimson Caravans treachery and they had plans for the Boomers and the Brotherhood that presumably would have gone ahead without the Couriers intervention.

 

[DVL]

Well a great deal depends on good intelligence that's for sure. But exceptional strategy doesn't really depend upon the obvious course of action ala Sun Tzu. The Mojave only is indefensible because the general aims and policy make it that way. Being unconquerable lies with yourself and being conquerable lies with the enemy, yadda yadda yadda.

House needs the NCR, even if he doesn't like it. Dynamite Hoover Dam and pull forces back to much fewer and more well-defensible fortifications. Then just start going scorched earth in Legion territory. That's just one example of an extreme strategy you can take. BUT, you need your leadership on board with this. As I said, "take your ball and go home." If NCR can't have it, but Legion definitely can't have it, then nobody can have it. And when I examine it, there's no way complete non-intervention is wise given the things Caesar tells Courier. Imperialism may be inadvisable, but so is ignoring Caesar.

But House knows that the NCR isn't prepared to go that far because the NCR just isn't interested in kicking Caesar out of the region and keeping to a military alliance.

Intelligence gathering is also two-way. The fact that Legion is a great place to do business also, by its nature, makes it vulnerable to spying. It's silly, but the Legion isn't the only people who should be able to do underhanded subterfuge. Basic fact-finding is not something any power can prevent unless you're behaving like North Korea in terms of how hermetically sealed you are. The Legion can spend dollars and caps in NCR territory, but NCR can also spend denarii and caps in Legion territory.

The problems with Crimson Caravan is basic corruption stuff. When caravans are going up in smoke, it definitely means you're not keeping close enough eye on things that matter to your war effort.

 

[superdude34]

Most of the info about the Legion is slander spread by the NCR. Just one of the reasons I fucking hate them.........it is very much in common with the pre war US, and who got us into the mess in the first place, huh?

Due to a ban on modern medicine, alcohol, and synthetic chems, the legionaries (remember that word. where does it mention civvies huh? nowhere) are provided with medicines derived from the local flora and fauna. Healing powder and bitter drinks are the most common remedies used to heal wounds. In order to restore crippled limbs, the Legion uses a chem called hydra, a potent brew derived from the Mojave Wasteland's wildlife and cave fungus. Legionaries also carry antivenom as a precaution against poisoning from encounters with the venomous creatures of the desert. In addition, many legionaries carry purified water and food gathered from the wasteland for rations. - Fallout wiki

In my opinion, natural medicine is better than stimpak medicine etcetera. I presume the means to manufacture stimpaks was lost in atomic fire (Please do correct me if I am wrong), hence the supply of them is limited. This means they will inevitably run out. In such a scenario, being able to make natural medicines will be extremely useful. One must remember though, in a situation where you are in the desert, and happen to run out of stimpaks, skills and knowledge with natural resources could prove useful.

"Now that I think about it, what would be non-bullshit strategies for NCR against the Legion?

If you want to fight an entirely defensive war. You need to make the entire region more defensible and not drawn-out. So either you need to protect fewer things or get more forces.

Basically you have to lay into House diplomatically and get him to be a more active participant in the war on your behalf. This can be done, it just isn't acceptable to NCR hawks. House has to play ball with you if you threaten to take it home with you. So this means you really would have to negotiate favorable trade terms he can live with without wanting the entire pie to yourself. But of course, NCR wants more, which is why Crocker is the only ambassador to "accept the limits of his position."

Other minor regional powers are Boomers, the Brotherhood and the caravan companies. You can't have caravan companies undermining other traders in the area by literally killing off their competition. The benefits of a military pact with the other two are obvious.

The other alternative is a war of aggression against the Legion, because they cannot be ignored. Caesar is insistent on fighting the NCR. And you can't permit him to have a position of strength on your doorstep or a means of mounting an attack. Which suggests just a very total war approach to undermining him. Attack *his* supply lines and settlements. But I can't think of the necessary requirements you'd have to get in line to do this."
- DVL

NCR is a diverse range of people, where everyone has a say including the congress. In the legion, Caesar gets a say. perhaps some of the praetorians, Vulpes and Lanius. the legion is a more effective decision making body than NCR, who have disagreements and debates. all a waste of time. There is a time for talking and a time for making war. Caesar gets this. NCR does not, democracy and debate is a waste of time, when wars are fought, more concrete, abrupt and brutal decision making is needed. In NCR interests of brahmin barons are put above the people, yet all the cretins (Cassandra Moore, Crocker, Entire NCR population) believe the fucking bullshit about the NCR being the saviour of the wasteland and all that trashy hollow rhetoric. They cant see the corruption because they have their heads so far up their arses obsessing over their sacred democratic republic. Congress today in the USA rarely gets fuck all done, just sit there arguing like self obsessed narcissistic prats (what they are) in a senate, same model in NCR.
They cannot see that their Commanders in chiefs are fools. General Oliver is a block headed idiot. Yet the NCR wont get rid of him, dunno why. Because they are softies, or perhaps they foolishly believe he actually knows what he is doing. Caesar would see through all this, and have his incompetent commander executed, and replaced with someone who understands tactics and defence.

House needs to go, immediately because he is extremely intelligent, and if the NCR managed to make a deal with him he would find a way to fuck them over, because he is very good at stuff like that.

"civillian experts such as the gun runners" that sure is all well and good. they pay the gun runners to do this. Caesar would force them to do this, by threat of execution. No money would be exchanged. They would do as he said.

"Except that the NCR and Brotherhood and House are all capable of it. That's the problem. There's nothing that physically keeps NCR from tightening their perimeter and patrolling their roads better. And the OSI actively looks into stuff like the Vault 22 agricultural project. Hell, the Followers were once a part of the NCR.

The Brotherhood can easily pursue stuff other than armor and weapons, except as Veronica reveals, they're too dogmatic to do so.
The Boomers are all about sustainability and killing stuff with artillery fire.

As stated above, it's apparent that Caesar wants to "settle" down, but can't given his current military needs. He's got this weird social engineering project that's very callously manipulative and uses humans as instrumental tools towards an end, rather than treating people as an end in themselves. So he doesn't really care about the long term consequences his culture will have so long as it achieves his grandiose goals."

I concur with Dr Fallout here, what you are saying does not make sense at all.
Legion is all about the collective. "There's nothing that physically keeps NCR from tightening their perimeter and patrolling their roads better". NCR is a farce. They cannot do piss all to protect roads, because they have no money, because they believe in all sorts of failed systems.

If they genuinely believed in their naive principles, the fucking roads would be safe. End of.

I was talking about the Nipton treatment. Most likely, you will be strung up for pimping or prostitution which drastically reduces the chances of contracting HIV/AIDS, the Clap Etcetera and dying. simple things like this become important.

House just doesn't care about anything other than his personal plaything Vegas.

The wasteland is a crazy, psychotic crazy 100 mile an hour hell pit, and you cant pussyfoot around with unrealistic and unachievable goals. a firm hand is needed. Crocker is a pussy, he does not understand what is needed to succeed as a lasting and imposing presence in a nuclear wasteland. Rest of the NCR is the same.

Thanks for your reply.

 

[DVL]

In my opinion, natural medicine is better than stimpak medicine etcetera. I presume the means to manufacture stimpaks was lost in atomic fire (Please do correct me if I am wrong), hence the supply of them is limited. This means they will inevitably run out. In such a scenario, being able to make natural medicines will be extremely useful. One must remember though, in a situation where you are in the desert, and happen to run out of stimpaks, skills and knowledge with natural resources could prove useful.

Appeal to nature by the way. I already leveled my accusation of Luddism at them. Having remedies is not the same as understanding how it works or an ongoing interest in learning why. I will grant that Caesar is probably putting that off for more short-term goals. I'm not blind. I can see their remedies, but I reject their attitude. They're ridiculous on the matter, relegating the formulation of healing powder to half-educated would-be doctors made slaves.

In-game stimpacks are craftable by a character with high enough Science. But whether or not that's canon is beside the point, technology isn't actually that hard as portrayed. It's actually rather easy in some respects compared to the real world, given the pulp atomic age angle they're going for. Not, "science," but "SCIENCE!"

As you pointed out, natural resource are abundant enough to produce substitutes. The trouble is that the Legion is authoritarian, and by that token, incurious. And as I'm tired of repeating, the people who have all the status are Legionaries. Barton has to live at the whim of people like Lanius. It's a militaristic police state. Let's not pretend that it isn't. What some legionary meathead thinks matters more than what Barton does. In the long run, those guys become the police and governors of your budding little civilization.

You're half-pretending that slavery isn't a thing the Legion does as anything other than exception at the speartip. No, sorry, that's not who they are. Like I don't get how you seem to think that anybody might regard that as an acceptable spoil of war and then pretend that they don't practice slavery.

If they genuinely believed in their naive principles, the fucking roads would be safe. End of.

I mean to say that they could. It's easy to see that NCR is a parody of a bloated and corrupt Republic. But if you don't think imperial dictatorships don't also become bloated and corrupt, that's laughable. That's almost the entire theme of the game, something Marcus wryly attests to. What Caesar unintentionally leaves behind is way more important than what he intends. If he left behind a somewhat savage but otherwise ethical monarchy behind, that'd be one thing. But no, that's not at all what he's interested in.

The wasteland is a crazy, psychotic crazy 100 mile an hour hell pit, and you cant pussyfoot around with unrealistic and unachievable goals. a firm hand is needed. Crocker is a pussy, he does not understand what is needed to succeed as a lasting and imposing presence in a nuclear wasteland. Rest of the NCR is the same.

No, that's a self-justification and an excuse. When I look at it, Caesar isn't attacking New Vegas because it's any sort of long-term strategic threat to his empire. But he's just enough of an egoist that he wants to be imperialistic, he's just more honest about it. He very well could've just set about the business of consolidating his conquests and building a civilization.

As I've stated, Caesar is contemptuous because he sees people as a means to an end, little caring about what he is making them in the process. People are tools to him. When I really think about the things he says, he's only doing what he does because he's a megalomaniac. He cares more about playing Roman Emperor and being remembered as such than what his legacy will actually do to people. If this is for the good of the people under his rule . . . well it isn't. He already has that half-accomplished but is just going to leave it up in the air on the off-chance he gets bumped-off.

It's the difference between making money to make a living and making money to make money.
Caesar is very much in the latter category. He's greedy. But he'll innocuously pretend, like so many contemptible parasites, that he's really doing the former.

 

[superdude34]

I saw a most interesting thing on Reddit "One question I had is what happens to Legion soldiers if they become too old to effectively remain in the military or become injured? They're not executed or put into slavery after their service to the legion are they? They must go on to have some sort of life."
stable, consistent flow of electricity and water, a steady and ample food supply. I presume most ex legion soldiers return back to their homeland and have access to all of this. I am not saying there will be a veterans society and department for vets, but they wont live awful lives.
In addition, when a Legion soldier is maimed, they are usually left behind. It presses legion troops to work harder at killing the enemy before they kill you. Survival of the fittest. This is why they are so effective, when compared to the NCR military.

You said: "No, that's a self-justification and an excuse. When I look at it, Caesar isn't attacking New Vegas because it's any sort of long-term strategic threat to his empire. But he's just enough of an egoist that he wants to be imperialistic, he's just more honest about it. He very well could've just set about the business of consolidating his conquests and building a civilization. Because Jesus, have you seen his map? "

self justification and an excuse? preposterous.

Super mutants kill and kidnap people on daily basis, raiders cavort around raping and pillaging, feral ghouls beat people to death, deathclaws shred people.
lets use talon company as an example. Even if you commit the offence of being around when they are around, they will shoot you in the head. In cut content, a fucked up guy kills children on radio. If you are having a bad day, and wanna let off steam, you are able to stab someone or beat someone to death without repercussions. Chaos. The definition of absolute anarchy, no rules, no guideline. people do what the fuck they want.

Caesar brings order to all of this. To bring order to such a murderous farce, one MUST be hardcore and nasty. NCR tries, but as I said earlier they are too fundamentally flawed to be able to. They must make examples, violent examples. Because the NCR would never do a what the legion did at Nipton, nobody actually takes them seriously. Maybe half time criminals do, but people who are the real deal exploit this.

Caesar is attacking New Vegas to expand his empire. there you go. Real Rome did this, Britain did this. NCR does this. It is as simple as that. I can't stand people in new Vegas, on their cap soaked pedestal. smashing them will do good. They are inherently opposed to the legion, with their promiscuous, gamblers society and all .

He is building a nation. A nation which is a secure and orderly society, not affected by vice, sin and all of the aforementioned chaos.

Your arguments are flawed. allow me to explain why

"people are tools to him". people are tools to the NCR. House uses you as a tool to further his goals. maybe he gives you caps and a penthouse, but you are obviously still his tool. He uses you as a means to an end. people use people as a tools in real life too. Other people are not exempt. Its not just Caesar

"megalomaniac". this is untrue. A person who has an obsessive desire for power. People who have large amounts of power are always called megalomaniacs. A employee could call his boss at work a megalomaniac. Pupils call their teacher megalomaniacs. Kimball could be called a megalomaniac. Mr House has the honour of being called megalomaniac.
You must understand, just because he is immensely powerful does not mean he is a megalomaniac.

"an egotist". nearly all powerful people are. Presidents and prime ministers are. Workplace bosses are.They are all egotists. Its not just Caesar. one cannot establish a huge empire with one at its head by not believing in oneself.

 

[DVL]

No, all that is pretty much all wrong.

First off, appealing to outside threats doesn't fucking mean anything. Every civilization has had them. You're doing what authoritarians always do and it pisses me off. (There is an outside threat, therefore what I do is justified. I am a necessary evil.) It's a far gone rightwing mentality and I'm sick to death of it. That and the vague contempt for humanity that requires that we crack down on all personal freedom, as if that's any real solution.

It's not a trade-off between freedom for security. You can have both. It's a false dichotomy.

Incidentally, Talon company has nothing to do with anything. They're more a part of the East Coast Bethesda canon.

Secondly stop deflecting from Caesar. Anybody else being bad does not make him not bad. In a lot of ways he's worse.
He is a megalomaniac. Actually listen to the things he says and ask, "Why the fuck is he in the Mojave."
Because he wants to play dress-up as a Roman Emperor.
It's meant to be ridiculous and over-the-top because you, the audience, are supposed actually know what the fuck the Roman Empire was. The average wastelander and Legionary just isn't in on the joke.

I find the Legion interesting, sure. But anybody pretending they're the good guys and making apologia for them are seriously just out of it. Pointing to the obvious faults of the other factions doesn't really change that. I can actually understand why Boone wants to murder all of them. Because when you really get down to it, their policies are senselessly evil and regressive.

 

[Spacemunkey]

I saw a most interesting thing on Reddit "One question I had is what happens to Legion soldiers if they become too old to effectively remain in the military or become injured? They're not executed or put into slavery after their service to the legion are they? They must go on to have some sort of life."
stable, consistent flow of electricity and water, a steady and ample food supply. I presume most ex legion soldiers return back to their homeland and have access to all of this. I am not saying there will be a veterans society and department for vets, but they wont live awful lives.

Pure speculation from a fan of the Legion. For all we know they are shipped back to Arizona and forced to fight gladiator style in an arena similar to the Thorn, and as far as I can tell would be a lot closer to what Caesar would do as opposed to building a retirement village outside of Scottsdale.

Super mutants kill and kidnap people on daily basis, raiders cavort around raping and pillaging, feral ghouls beat people to death, deathclaws shred people.
lets use talon company as an example. Even if you commit the offence of being around when they are around, they will shoot you in the head. In cut content, a fucked up guy kills children on radio. If you are having a bad day, and wanna let off steam, you are able to stab someone or beat someone to death without repercussions. Chaos. The definition of absolute anarchy, no rules, no guideline. people do what the fuck they want.

Caesar brings order to all of this. To bring order to such a murderous farce, one MUST be hardcore and nasty. NCR tries, but as I said earlier they are too fundamentally flawed to be able to. They must make examples, violent examples. Because the NCR would never do a what the legion did at Nipton, nobody actually takes them seriously. Maybe half time criminals do, but people who are the real deal exploit this.

You're crossing FNV with FO3 in an attempt to suit your argument. I refuse to use a Bethesda Fallout as any type of example or justification for anything a faction in FNV will or will not do. At the end of the day I would rather die in a free corrupt society than live in a dictatorship.

 

[Vergil]

Pure speculation from a fan of the Legion. For all we know they are shipped back to Arizona and forced to fight gladiator style in an arena similar to the Thorn, and as far as I can tell would be a lot closer to what Caesar would do as opposed to building a retirement village outside of Scottsdale.


You're crossing FNV with FO3 in an attempt to suit your argument. I refuse to use a Bethesda Fallout as any type of example or justification for anything a faction in FNV will or will not do. At the end of the day I would rather die in a free corrupt society than live in a dictatorship.

Actually thats not totally baseless speculation. Real life Roman soldiers were guranteed land upon retirement. Its more rediculous to think that the whole of Legion land are all either slaves or combatants.

 

[Spacemunkey]

Actually thats not totally baseless speculation. Real life Roman soldiers were guranteed land upon retirement. Its more rediculous to think that the whole of Legion land are all either slaves or combatants.

We aren't talking about the real Romans, but one mans interpretation of what they were, and we don't even know exactly how much information the Followers have on the subject beyond Arcade referencing a few holotapes. I don't think all of the Legion are either slaves or soldiers, but if Ceasar is willing to discard an awesome officer like Joshua Graham simply to prove a point, what worth do life long rank and file soldiers offer who can't soldier anymore to the legion?

 

[superdude34]

Please try not to be too anti Bethesda. I dont like what they did with Fallout 4, just try to move on from Bethesda, because there is nothing anyone can do about it. they control the canon. Some of the stuff they have done is cool, and some of it is dumb.

"Incidentally, Talon company has nothing to do with anything. They're more a part of the East Coast Bethesda canon."

In the end it is the same wasteland. Perhaps in Arizona there was a talon company style organisation destroyed by the Legion? Perhaps Arizona was as farcical as the Capital Wasteland. (Yes I will reference Fallout 3. It has things wrong with it but it is not awful)

"Pure speculation from a fan of the Legion. For all we know they are shipped back to Arizona and forced to fight gladiator style in an arena similar to the Thorn, and as far as I can tell would be a lot closer to what Caesar would do as opposed to building a retirement village outside of Scottsdale."

pure speculation from a fan of the Legion is exactly what it is.

"Because he wants to play dress-up as a Roman Emperor.
It's meant to be ridiculous and over-the-top because you, the audience, are supposed actually know what the fuck the Roman Empire was. The average wastelander and Legionary just isn't in on the joke."

I understand this. It is good that he is using something ridiculous and over the top. something different from the failed pre war society.
(Failed, might I add, because america got blown up)

"First off, appealing to outside threats doesn't fucking mean anything. Every civilization has had them. You're doing what authoritarians always do and it pisses me off. (There is an outside threat, therefore what I do is justified. I am a necessary evil.) It's a far gone rightwing mentality and I'm sick to death of it. That and the vague contempt for humanity that requires that we crack down on all personal freedom, as if that's any real solution."

"However, if one keeps quiet, goes about their business and fulfills the rare request the Legion has, then Caesar is a peaceful and caring lord. Many people don't consider this a problem, as even before Caesar's rise, they had little say in the chaotic wastes."
-fallout wiki

this makes sense. what would he care if you are orderly and not chaotic, and law abiding

we must remember that Here and now in our world is different to the wasteland, which means radically different solutions to very different problems.

I agree completely that today in the year 2016 cracking down on personal freedoms is bad. its awful and disgusting and dreadful and wrong.

But in a wasteland 200 years later? Circumstances change. It is not like he is a big brother monitoring you like the NSA. wastelanders did not have particularly much say in the first place.

 

[DVL]

Christ, for being a guy who likes to point to corrupt robber barons and land owning ranchers as being corrupt, how is it any better that Legionaries get to replace them?

Much less talking about whether Legionaries retire to water and electricity. Regardless of whether or not they have that (I'm betting that it's spotty and pretty tribal), that doesn't sound like the philosophy of self-reliance, moralism and Darwinism that the Legion likes to preach about constantly. It's a second consideration at best.

It's so comically ass-backwards. You don't ban prostitution because it's immoral. Quite to the opposite. Legalizing it is actually better because it's easier to test for diseases and protect a marginalized group from exploitation and abuse. Human vice isn't so disruptive to human society that making every crime a hanging offense actually improves matters. It's a grade-schooler's idiotic idea of how civics ought to work. (And by the way, the theology of sin is retarded for the same reason.)

I mean, not that this particular example is a good one because you can own women if you're privileged enough. Which yeah, I guess is one way of dealing with prostitution.

But that's how it works in the Legion. You're guilty until proven innocent. Hey look at Boone's wife. What a dumb cunt. I bet she's a degenerate. Let's make her a slave for her own good! That's the automatic prejudice and worldview of every Legionary, and well, Caesar too. He doesn't respect the agency or autonomy of tribals. But that's just symptomatic of his general contempt of people in general. And it's implied that's what Joshua's change-of-heart is really about.

 

[Vergil]

You're applying modern morality and societial norms to a group of people who until Caesar lived in the dirt and could hardly take care of themselves. They didnt have any rights to lose.

 

[superdude34]

"You're applying modern morality and societial norms to a group of people who until Caesar lived in the dirt and could hardly take care of themselves. They didnt have any rights to lose"

thanks man. this is the point I am trying of make

"But that's how it works in the Legion. You're guilty until proven innocent. Hey look at Boone's wife. What a dumb cunt. I bet she's a degenerate. Let's make her a slave for her own good! "



one thing I have noticed is there are all sorts of other slavers in other places, but everybody targets legion for it. It happens in the Capitol, in the commonwealth and other places presumably. it happens all over in the post war world.

Evil factions are awesome
slavery is part of the parcel

One of the main reasons I actually picked legion is because when Caesar goes, there will be power vacuum and a civil war and it will be inserting to see the shit hit the fan. they could make expansions based on the huge explosive rows and war. different factions within the legion

 

[DVL]

You keep doing this where you talk about the East coast, even though pretty everybody in the West except one faction doesn't practice slavery. The NCR Rangers explicitly came into being in FO2 because they were meant to combat slavers. NV makes it clear that the canon ending is that the Rangers became a military power in its own right.

You're applying modern morality and societial norms to a group of people who until Caesar lived in the dirt and could hardly take care of themselves. They didnt have any rights to lose.

That's an excuse. I've said as much and I'm not refuting this again. That makes their stupidity maybe understandable, except it's not the explanation.
If anything else Honest Hearts proves how logically incongruous this is. You can't claim that every culture is "savage" when you have tribals are literally better about some things than the Legion is.
And Caesar isn't just "making do" anymore. It's about triumphalism now.

 

[superdude34]

It happens all over the post war world. I dont focus on east or west coast in fallout, I focus on the whole world. It doesn't feel right to isolate one world completely from the other.
It is the same place altogether, just compass directions. No matter how many people deny, F:NV and Fallout 3 are the same universe

 

[DVL]

You know, I'm not talking to you if this is your level of reasoning.
Derp, Caesar is worse than his neighbors and a lot of tribals. But it's okay because he's only just as bad as slavers of the logically incongruous East Coast.

 

[Dino_Of_Wastes]

a scenery with house/yes man victory and both ncr and legion break up in minor factions is a lot more cool

 

[Vergil]

That's an excuse. I've said as much and I'm not refuting this again. That makes their stupidity maybe understandable, except it's not the explanation.
If anything else Honest Hearts proves how logically incongruous this is. You can't claim that every culture is "savage" when you have tribals are literally better about some things than the Legion is.
And Caesar isn't just "making do" anymore. It's about triumphalism now.

Name 1 tribe that is comparable to Caesar's Legion in terms of land, wealth, standard of living, security, technology, and education.

I'm not saying the Legion is perfect but its better than wallowing in your own filth, starving to death and constant futile fighting with other just as worse off tribes. Whether you agree with Caesar's longterm plan or not it is a fact that most tribes who submit to Caesar live a much better life than they did before.

Also I'm guessing you also hate the real ancient Rome because it took over small pissant tribes and absorbed them into the Roman Republic/Empire?

 

[Dr Fallout]

Thanks Superdude. By the way, the Followers admit that stimpacks and modern medicines are running out, which sets out the legion to be able to survive in the wasteland the best. They can make medicine, fight well and know survival techniques which allows them the best chance. The NCR rangers are their only equals on a survival level. No one else in the NCR army is.

 

[Vergil]

The Legion doesn't totally abandon technology or anything. They just don't have a strong reliance on it like other factions do.