"My precious" - GFW on fans, industry and media

Spelling errors be damned!

You know, its not like we never say anything about a game. We liked Van Buren after we saw the demo. We were initially sympathetic to Tactics, and we are often divided about even Fallout 2. So what? We're supposed to check out critical faculties at the door in order to swallow Betheda's promises and weak delivery.

Seriously, how many times does a person need to lie before someone calls them on it?

I suspect that what we see here is a hegemonic project. They want us to concede to their domination, to reduce our expectation, to accept what they give us and be grateful. And we're the bad guys because we're the ones who won't put up with getting fucked over? Bullshit.
 
Actually, I loved Van Buren when I read the design docs, long before seeing the demo.
 
I got my copy of GFW a few days ago. I wondered when a post on this article was going to go up.

The article itself had some "bad" spots, yes, but, all things being considered, I didn't think it was completely horrible.

The artwork for the article, however, was incredibly insulting. Not only with the "Gollem" theme, but also a "side by side" comparison of the graphics from F1 and F3 - again implying the tired old lie that Fallout fans only want an "exact remake" of the original two games, with no evolution at all.
 
Dougly said:
The artwork for the article, however, was incredibly insulting. Not only with the "Gollem" theme, but also a "side by side" comparison of the graphics from F1 and F3 - again implying the tired old lie that Fallout fans only want an "exact remake" of the original two games, with no evolution at all.
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The most important thing is that they didn't use Brother None's explaination of what we really expect from real Fallout sequel.
 
Sorrow said:
The most important thing is that they didn't use Brother None's explaination of what we really expect from real Fallout sequel.
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That's pretty odd, from a journalist viewpoint, too. I could remember from my days in the editing office how happy someone would be after he interviewed multiple people for an article and got diametrically opposed opinions. It provides a hook, it provides fire, you can write a journalistic sound piece clearly representing both opinions without ascribing to either one, and if you really need sales just look for acerbic points and counter points.

But having two directly opposed views is ideal for a journalist, and having the two sides clearly state their intentions and finding them to be very divergent (as in Todd's "we always reinvent" vs my "it doesn't need reinvention") is just joy x10, as it gives you two solid quotes to build an article around.

That must be a form of journalism they don't apply in gaming journalism, tho'. The standards of gaming journalism never cease to amaze me.
 
Wild_qwerty said:
Also used by some NMAers to say "Bethsaidia is shit" rather we should be saying "the potenial for Fallout 3 to be shit is quite high" ;)
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Through the quality of their own work as a developer and a publisher in light of their own claims, I can honestly and safely say "Bethesda IS shit" with all certainty. I'd include a few more things such as "console whores" and "lying cuntrags", <s>but that just makes them cry off to mommy</s> but they are actually proud of those Traits they picked. :twisted:
 
The talking heads were indeed nice, but I disliked the semi-recycling of Aradesh/Maxson's face models. I think The Overseer's was very similar to Rutger's as well.

Just sayin'

Welcome back, anyway.
 
Wooz said:
The talking heads were indeed nice, but I disliked the semi-recycling of Aradesh/Maxson's face models. I think The Overseer's was very similar to Rutger's as well.
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I could see that, though my favorites were more along Harold, Set, the LT. and The Master. The ones with a lot of detail and you know they had fun designing.

I guess those might be a stretch for Bethesda's expression engine...
 
Dang, meant Butch. Rutger's another character, without a talking head. My bad.
 
This post is broght to you by Macallan Single Malt Scotch

The Xbox is the worst thing to ever happen to PC gaming. It used to be that console games and PC games were well separated and each group of gamers got what they wanted. There were PC ports of some console games (most crap, some good), and rarely a PC game ported to a console (there was actually a Playstation port of Civ2).

When M$ started selling a PC (running Windows CE) as a gaming console, things took a sharp downhill turn. The first thing M$ did was buy Bungie in order to make Bungie's in-development PC/Xbox FPS into an Xbox exclusive (though there was eventually a poor PC port). I can see how Halo is a huge deal to a console gamer, but after playing it on a friend's Xbox, I was underwhelmed. It's the same basic FPS mechanics PC gamers have been enjoying since Wolfenstein 3D (limited by a console controller), though it does have the actual 3D environments PC gamers have had since Quake I.

One of the idiosynchrasies of the console gaming market is that hardware manufacturers will (especially at the launch of a new console) take a loss on the hardware of the console and make it up in royalties from game developers who will pay the console manufacturer to have their game playable on a particular platform. So now M$ has convinced a lot of PC game developers that the PC is not a profitable gaming platform to develop for, and gotten them to go "cross platform", i.e. dumb down their games to accomodate console controllers and gamers accustomed to all the depth and complexity of Super Mario Bros. Even M$'s "Games for Windows" initiative is a hoax designed to drive developers to Xbox and PC users to Vista. One of the requirements for a game to carry the "Games for Windows" logo is that the game is designed to use the Xbox 360 controller. We PC gamers are used to using most of our 10 fingers when playing a game, not just our thumbs and index fingers.

Bethesda drank the Xbox Kool Aid (or Flavor Aid to be more historically correct) starting with Morrowind. Morrowind was still a decent PC game, but Oblivion was clearly an Xbox game with a PC port. For reasons incomprehensible to rational human beings, Bethesda spent around 6 million dollars to acquire the Fallout intellectual property and turn it into yet another Xbox game with a port to the PC. The true fans of Fallout are casualties of the unholy union between M$ and console gaming.

I think the most we Fallout fans can realistically hope for now is success for the independent developers/fans who have been working on the type of RPGs we enjoy playing. Age of Decadence looks promising, and FIFE looks like a great asset waiting for an ambitious execution. Unfortunately I don't have the programming/scripting/art skills to contribute to such efforts.
 
It's a bit sad that being insulting is the favored method of dissent for so many Fallout fans. Civility is always worthwhile, ESPECIALLY when addressing the enemy. Maybe if the collective tact of the Fallout community was a little better we wouldn't have quite the reputation we get? It saddens me that we are so constantly misrepresented, but it's the harshest among us who facilitate that negative stereotype.

This is hardly me being an apologist to all the parasitic journalists out there who constantly misrepresent us, but if they had nothing to leech off of, it wouldn't be a problem like it is (most likely).
 
Just got a copy of GFW, and read the article.

I think that it is important to point out here that Levine was commenting on the Ayn Rand, Objectivist movement people and aspects of Bioshock. No where does he ever mention System shock. And his quote about the human xerox machine pretty much pertains to that fact.

I do think the article tends to validate more the opinions of the publishers and not of the gamers. It could have been much worse then it is, but that is really not an excuse.

If they wanted to be really fair they could have been, but I think the goal was to once again marginalize the fans. If they wanted to make up for this, an article in next months issue written by someone in this fan community would be nice, if not that then at least publish a few of the reactions in the letters section. In essence they are giving a voice to the devs who already have one, and once again trying to silence those who lack the ad dollars to have one.
 
xdarkyrex said:
Civility is always worthwhile...

...parasitic journalists
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It's a double-edged sword, I suppose.

Anyways, you seem content to lay the blame of our reputation on users who are less cordial than others. I hope you don't think it has less to do with how some people can be blind, one-sided, and thickheaded. Your idea seemingly relies too heavily that (many) other people are all level-headed, objective, and present valid arguments and the flak they receive is uncalled for. I suppose if that were true, NMA's blacklist wouldn't be as full as it is now.

I don't think we should worry about our image amongst the gaming media as much as we should worry about our purpose as a fansite who doesn't babysit and tailor themselves to better accomodate infantile cretins, biased journalists, and corporate thugs.

To me, there are times for civility, and times for hostility.
 
I just found this on digg, and even without Rosh's timely return it would've reminded me of our situation, although the return of the deathclaw put an emphasis on irate:

Samuel Adams said:
It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.
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Although I'm not really optimistic that we'll prevail, the Moronrail seems unstoppable. We can hope to endure, though.
 
Only the ashes of those brushfires keep getting recycled into strawmen a la Gollum, hunched over a computer with the words "Rant Board" emblazoned across the screen.

Come to think of it, Brother None, were you offended by this cartoon? I am assuming that you didn't know such a cliched portrayal of NMA posters would accompany the article.
 
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