Everything is poisonous in sufficient quantities. Except Coffee.
Parenting and Drinking for Eternity
- Thread starter Jebus
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which is what buxx means. Its so accepted in society already that people almost completely forget its addictive nature. And everyone is assuming something when you say "I don't drink" like your "sick" or something. I hate it when that happens. Could it not happen that I just dislike alcohol? The taste. Just as how I hate the smoke from cigarettes.donperkan said:
hence why it is even more important to teach your kids not how to avoid it but how to deal with it.
Of course. There is NOTHING wrong with your beer or wine or what ever you enjoy sometimes to a meal or on parties and what ever.
If you decide not to drink thats of course even better. But its more important to teach your kidz how to deal with it.
Stanislao Moulinsky
Vault Fossil
valcik said:It is a poison, in fact.donperkan said:
You can get intoxicated with alcohol or even killed. The same goes for nicotine, for instance.
Don't breath, oxygen is poisonous.
donperkan
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
No, no, no and no.
When offering something i do it with best intentions and if my offer is turned down i have a right to three assumptions. First assumption: "is there something wrong with it", second assumption: "is there something wrong with you" and the third assumption: "is there something wrong in me offering it". To elaborate. I am offering it, i wouldn't offer it if it was faulty, is there something preventing you from accepting it. If there is nothing wrong with it and there is nothing wrong with you then you are obviously not willing to accept it from me. Maybe it's just the mentality but i see a fundamental difference between us. You are seeing a glass filled with liquid whereas i see a host welcoming me. For me it is not normal and to a degree rude to turn down something a man has offered with good intentions. I grew up in an environment where it is considered common curtesy to welcome someones company to the best of your ability. I know when i'm offered something that the person offering it to me holds it in high regard and it would be inconsiderate for me to turn that man down. Dead guy presented a vegetarian case here's an even worse case, i was offered horsemeat. I love horses and the thought that someone could cause suffering to that magnificent creature is... I ate what was offered to me and i thanked my host because i know he made an effort just for me.
I think the main difference between us is the perception of the thing we are offered. For you food is something you go and purchase in a supermarket, you purchase it with the money you earned performing various task i on the other hand had the pleasure to experience what it means to create your food from the barren soil. I know it takes a lot of hours of hard work to put a steak on the plate, i know someone made a lot of effort in making wine.
Paying for something and offering it to someone can dilute or even obstruct the notion that someone put work in that thing but it can't obstruct the notion that someone is making and effort to accommodate you.
I was a bit sarcastic when mentioning narcotics obviously when experimenting you should try to create a safe environment for your self and the people around you.
When offering something i do it with best intentions and if my offer is turned down i have a right to three assumptions. First assumption: "is there something wrong with it", second assumption: "is there something wrong with you" and the third assumption: "is there something wrong in me offering it". To elaborate. I am offering it, i wouldn't offer it if it was faulty, is there something preventing you from accepting it. If there is nothing wrong with it and there is nothing wrong with you then you are obviously not willing to accept it from me. Maybe it's just the mentality but i see a fundamental difference between us. You are seeing a glass filled with liquid whereas i see a host welcoming me. For me it is not normal and to a degree rude to turn down something a man has offered with good intentions. I grew up in an environment where it is considered common curtesy to welcome someones company to the best of your ability. I know when i'm offered something that the person offering it to me holds it in high regard and it would be inconsiderate for me to turn that man down. Dead guy presented a vegetarian case here's an even worse case, i was offered horsemeat. I love horses and the thought that someone could cause suffering to that magnificent creature is... I ate what was offered to me and i thanked my host because i know he made an effort just for me.
I think the main difference between us is the perception of the thing we are offered. For you food is something you go and purchase in a supermarket, you purchase it with the money you earned performing various task i on the other hand had the pleasure to experience what it means to create your food from the barren soil. I know it takes a lot of hours of hard work to put a steak on the plate, i know someone made a lot of effort in making wine.
Paying for something and offering it to someone can dilute or even obstruct the notion that someone put work in that thing but it can't obstruct the notion that someone is making and effort to accommodate you.
I was a bit sarcastic when mentioning narcotics obviously when experimenting you should try to create a safe environment for your self and the people around you.
Taking up the earlier topic about *Drinking is just as dangerous as ANY other drug.* I want to explain myself why I hate this mentality.
Also I'm not saying drinking alcohol can't get dangerous and there should be more done for prevention or drinking in moderation. (Though, in my case I only drink two or three times a year, but go pretty heavy on it if.)
Anyway, to the point:
Saying that drinking is just as dangerous as other drugs does not prevent drinking, however it lowers the bar for ANY other group.
In short
What is the leading cause of drug consumation (for teens and young adults)?
Group Mentality
What helps to convince people taking drug X?
Making it less harmless than it actually is.
...
Get my point? I've seen the actual argument being made as well.
Drinking a beer is NEVER equivalent to snorting coke, injecting heroin or doing shrooms. Suggesting that is helping nobody.
Also I'm not saying drinking alcohol can't get dangerous and there should be more done for prevention or drinking in moderation. (Though, in my case I only drink two or three times a year, but go pretty heavy on it if.)
Anyway, to the point:
Saying that drinking is just as dangerous as other drugs does not prevent drinking, however it lowers the bar for ANY other group.
In short
What is the leading cause of drug consumation (for teens and young adults)?
Group Mentality
What helps to convince people taking drug X?
Making it less harmless than it actually is.
...
Get my point? I've seen the actual argument being made as well.
Drinking a beer is NEVER equivalent to snorting coke, injecting heroin or doing shrooms. Suggesting that is helping nobody.
So you accept whatever someone offers you? Interesting. You do realize you don't have to do something or eat something you don't want to, right?donperkan said:
Do you think you'll offend someone if you don't want what is offered? If I offered someone something and they said "No thanks" then that's just fine with me. It's not an issue, it's not a big deal. Why, whenever I prepare a food or something I always offer if anyone else wants some, and when they say "no" I am not crushed, I am not all "Aw man, I spent money on the ingredients, I spent so much time preparing it, and they don't want it. God, they must hate me! Or... there must be something wrong with them! Yes, that's it!" You know what I actually think if they decline? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. Hell, if I think anything it's probably "Well, more for me then."
I just don't understand your mentality that you must accept what is offered to you, even if you don't want it. You seem to think that people declining a drink or drug are making a huge "fuss" about it, making a big deal, thinking "How dare you even think that I would want that! Fucking cocksucker!" (for those who don't know, that last line was hyperbole), when the only one making a huge fuss about anything is you.
Do you want a piece of gum? No thanks. Do you want a glass of water? Nah, I'm good. Do you want a beer? Thank you, but I'm fine.
God, look at the malice in that person who is politely declining an offer. What a complete dick. Don't they know that the person offering likes them? What do they think, that the one offering is going to harm them? Man, that declining guy is such an asshole.
Seriously, it's kind of crazy how you think.
valcik
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
Absinthe should definitely be treated as a conventional weapon!Formerk said:
Surf Solar
So Old I'm Losing Radiation Signs
Heh, well I don't make a big fuss about it, but if I would give someone a welcoming gift (doesn't matter if its alcohol or not) because I like this person and he/she/it outright refuses to take it, I'd be a bit pissed too, I just wouldn't say it. Guess I was raised a bit similar like donperkan, but I don't really make a big deal out of it.
donperkan
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
Missing the point. It's not about the gum, it's not about the glass of water, it's about the act of giving and sharing. I here by welcome you to my company here is a small act of my good will. I thank you by accepting. Offering nothing will not effec my opinion of you but offering something, no matter how insignificant, will.
Try it out.
I understand that. I know it's not about the physical thing being offered. I suppose I'm just different from you, for if someone offers me something and I decline, I thank them for their offer and thinking of me and their kindness. Hence the "thanks" in "no thanks". I don't need physical objects given to me to think better of someone else or to feel welcomed, or vise versa.
I mean no great offense when not accepting an offer. And I'm not greatly offended if someone politely declines whatever I offered them. This is basic human communication and interaction.
And besides, a good host usually doesn't just have one thing to offer someone, something as small as a drink (alcoholic or otherwise), and isn't all "You must accept this one thing or I will know you don't like me! Prove your love for me!" It's usually "Do you want a beer?" "No thanks." "How about some water, soda, etc.?" Again, this is really normal and really basic.
I mean no great offense when not accepting an offer. And I'm not greatly offended if someone politely declines whatever I offered them. This is basic human communication and interaction.
And besides, a good host usually doesn't just have one thing to offer someone, something as small as a drink (alcoholic or otherwise), and isn't all "You must accept this one thing or I will know you don't like me! Prove your love for me!" It's usually "Do you want a beer?" "No thanks." "How about some water, soda, etc.?" Again, this is really normal and really basic.
donperkan
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
verevoof said:
Take that thought a step further. What if you don't have soda available. That means i just forced you to admit you are lacking something. To avoid putting you in an awkward position i accept what you offered.
Why would you offer something you don't have? Offer what else you have, or ask if they want anything, and if they end up not wanting anything and politely thanking you for your offer, it is not a big deal.
This is such a pointless conversation, it shouldn't be such an issue, and therefore I'm not going to continue. You might want to try not letting these non-issues bother you so much. Really, it's no big deal.
This is such a pointless conversation, it shouldn't be such an issue, and therefore I'm not going to continue. You might want to try not letting these non-issues bother you so much. Really, it's no big deal.
No, I don't get it. What are you trying to say? Seems to me you are actually contradicting yourself.C2B said:
What is this statement based on? "Common knowledge"?C2B said:
Heh, how very stupid of you. Seriously. What if you were offered you dog meat with a glass of pig blood? Is there a line you wouldn't cross? Would that be offensive towards the person offering it to you?donperkan said:
Apparently for donperkan, friendship and politeness are contingent on accepting anything offered, no matter if you actually want or like it.
Can you not see how ridiculous that is, donperkan? If I ask for something and a person exerts money and effort to get it for me, then yes, I'm then a dick if I then turn around and refuse. If something is offered to me unasked for, that is contingent on an assumption that I want whatever offered. You can make such an assumption, but when you do, you risk my not wanting it, and there's nothing impolite either about you offering it or me refusing. Someone else makes an assumption about what I might like, and somehow that obliges me to go along with him? What kind of spineless attitude is that? Do you really want to live your life by other people's preferences? Pretty much the definition of caving to peer pressure.
Weed and caffeine are less harmful than alcohol. XTC is riskier. LSD is riskier than that. Coke can be worse than that. Krokodil is worse than coke. Sure, there's a distinction between each kind of drug that shouldn't be ignored, but why is your arbitrary line where there is "alcohol" and "other drugs" more sensible than Bux'?
Can you not see how ridiculous that is, donperkan? If I ask for something and a person exerts money and effort to get it for me, then yes, I'm then a dick if I then turn around and refuse. If something is offered to me unasked for, that is contingent on an assumption that I want whatever offered. You can make such an assumption, but when you do, you risk my not wanting it, and there's nothing impolite either about you offering it or me refusing. Someone else makes an assumption about what I might like, and somehow that obliges me to go along with him? What kind of spineless attitude is that? Do you really want to live your life by other people's preferences? Pretty much the definition of caving to peer pressure.
C2B said:
Weed and caffeine are less harmful than alcohol. XTC is riskier. LSD is riskier than that. Coke can be worse than that. Krokodil is worse than coke. Sure, there's a distinction between each kind of drug that shouldn't be ignored, but why is your arbitrary line where there is "alcohol" and "other drugs" more sensible than Bux'?
donperkan
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
Buxbaum666 said:
I would shout Heghlu'meH QaQ jajvam
You guys just don't get it. I'm not making this stuff up it's been tested and passed on through generations. You can call me stupid or spineless but that doesn't change the fact that it's a helpful social manner.
http://youtu.be/SDrABWb9VIQ
Brother None said:
What? I neve said that nor made that distinction. I don't want to set up a arbitary line here. Also @Buxx what about offensivness? I don't care what is offensive. Offensive doesn't play a role.
The problem is starting!
Saying that all drugs are the same = lowering the entry bar/giving an argument to try out these drugs.
For example person A could say in trying to convince person B to try out drug X.
"Hey, you should totally do coke with us. It's not any more dangerous than drinking a glass of wine/ a beer (or smoking weed), don't you know?"
Again, I have actually seen this argument made. (Also a variant where smoking weed was compared to shrooms) And it actually works. (Which is mainly because you're doing and believe quite possible some really dumb stuff at that age)
Yes, any drug can get really bad if misused. I'm not denying that. And I'm not arguing about distinictions. I'm just saying there ARE differences between drugs and they shouldn't be equated to the same. In this case some drugs one should just stay away in the first place and never get in.
We shouldn't help there by lowering the danger of more harmful/riskier drugs (which happens if you equate all drugs). But by making people more aware of the consequences of alcoholism.
Letting other people decide what and when you drink and consume drugs is a "helpful social manner"? Yeah...Look, no one is denying there are people who live this way, we're just saying it shouldn't be applauded, it should be looked down on, because letting other people make your decisions for you is no way to live. Yes, it is stupid and spineless. If you want to cave to the slightest peer pressure go right ahead, but be honest about it, don't make up weird societal rules.donperkan said:
Bux didn't say that. That wasn't his point, and you know it wasn't. His point is "alcohol should be viewed and treated as a potentially dangerous drug", not comparing it directly to coke.C2B said: