Reactions to the GI scans

So no matter what I do, either by renting it or getting it pre-owned, beth will still get some kind of financial benifit?


Well, guess the only way to play this thing without handing them any of my money is to have a friend lend me thier copy. But even then that's giving them someone else's money. Since that's the case, I'm not going to do anything at all, I'll just wait for someone to put a viewing of it on Youtube.

That way I'll be able to see the trainwreak without supporting anyone.
 
Wyrmwolf said:
So no matter what I do, either by renting it or getting it pre-owned, beth will still get some kind of financial benifit?
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Not really. Getting it pre-owned will generally not benefit Bethesda financially.
 
By buying it pre-owned, you'd be financially benefiting the store that financially benefited the previous owner who financially benefited Bethesda.
So.. um.. it depends on how far your principles go. :)
 
Sander said:
You don't understand market economy much, do you?
Buying a copy of Fallout 3 new, will result in the store buying a new copy to re-fill their stock. Buying a used copy usually won't have that result, since used and new games are treated as seperate stock.

So, yes, by buying Fallout 3 you are almost directly giving Bethesda money for the game.
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My understanding about the market economy, or not, I did work at EB in college, before their transition to their new pestering policies (which is why I hate them).

But here's the thing. They will restock based on how many Fallout 3's are selling. And it doesn't matter if they are new or pre-owned.

It will all depend on how well they are selling and how often they are being traded in. They will try to sell you the used copies, if they have them, because its more money for them. But, selling a pre-owned copy Fallout 3's, and running out of them, is just as much a sign for them to order more as selling a new one.

So buying a pre-owned copy is still adding to the situation that is going to cause them to restock
 
Autoduel76 said:
My understanding about the market economy, or not, I did work at EB in college, before their transition to their new pestering policies (which is why I hate them).

But here's the thing. They will restock based on how many Fallout 3's are selling. And it doesn't matter if they are new or pre-owned.

It will all depend on how well they are selling and how often they are being traded in. They will try to sell you the used copies, if they have them, because its more money for them. But, selling a pre-owned copy Fallout 3's, and running out of them, is just as much a sign for them to order more as selling a new one.

So buying a pre-owned copy is still adding to the situation that is going to cause them to restock
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Okay, that I didn't know, because that seems rather silly. But whatever.

In any case, if you know that, why did you try to tell people that buying Fallout 3 from EB or the like would *not* benefit Bethesda?
 
Sander said:
Okay, that I didn't know, because that seems rather silly. But whatever.

In any case, if you know that, why did you try to tell people that buying Fallout 3 from EB or the like would *not* benefit Bethesda?
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I didn't say that. I said buying a pre-owned copy wouldn't benefit them "any less than a new one"

They both benefit them.

The store manager simply decides how many copies of a game he thinks the store needs, based on how many they are selling.
 
I really wish Bethesda inspired some more confidence in me because I would be more willing to play this even with these liberty's taken, if they had made Oblivion and Star trek legacy any good! Both of those games disappointed me to no end and it seems like it's always up to the community to fix these broken games they release, so I won't fall for it this time...
 
Plissken said:
http://kotaku.com/photogallery/falloutscans/2033962

Did anyone else notice the following sentence from the GI Article?:

"We've revamped the entire system from Oblivion to give us better gameplay with guns."

I think I'm going to be sick... :puke:
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"Revamped" So he means he has gone back and used the oblivion system as a template? Ugh, this is NOT looking good.
 
Autoduel76 said:
No. Resales from trade ins.
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Well, I don't know how you guys worked, but at where I worked (FRH), that was quite different.

We'd restock based on any sales. If a person returns an item, it would go onto the shelves and the computer would automatically restock one less based on the extra copy in the shelves (i.e. if it is determined that you should have 6 copies, the computer will always order copies from HQ based on how far under 6 you are. The computer knows). The sale of the returned item would thus not provide an extra order, unless the game was massively sold, massively restocked and then massively returned, which would suck. Sounds like you had a bit of a primitive system going on there, tho', who the hell still restocks based on the manager's opinion? What is this, the 20th century?

Actual second-hand sale, which was only done on specific subbranches of the main branch, would completely be outside of the normal restocking loop, and wouldn't affect it in any way.
 
Autoduel76 said:
I didn't say that. I said buying a pre-owned copy wouldn't benefit them "any less than a new one"
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Please do not lie, it's annoying:
"Well, technically, you aren't directly handing money to any company unless you buy it directly from them, or preorder it. Because, EB, Best Buy, Wallmart, or whoever you are going to buy it from has already paid Zenimax for the games. "
 
Brother None said:
Sounds like you had a bit of a primitive system going on there, tho', who the hell still restocks based on the manager's opinion? What is this, the 20th century?
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Well, despite being a big chain, the individual EBs and Gamestop are each quite small stores. They actually don't carry a ton of stock, in part because pre-owned sales is such a huge part of their profit.

They, intentionally, try to keep their stock of new games low and sell customers pre-owned games.

That is really the whole purpose of them taking pre-orders. So they can judge how many people are going to buy a new game (which is why I said, preordering the game would be more like directly handing them your money). But, they only get a very small number of games after their preorders.

But, yes, managers here order stock, the computer doesn't make decisions for them. That type of system wouldn't work for them, if pre-owns were outside the system, like in your example, because pre-owned copies are so important to them. They would gladly stay "sold out" of new copies of game, to be able to tell a customer "but we do have a pre-owned copy I can sell you".

But its not as archaic, or time consuming, as it sounds because they keep such a small amount of actual new stock at these stores.

Of course, they are also struggling as a whole. They are getting squeezed out by big chains like Best Buy and Frys that most people would rather shop at. And that's why they have all these new policies of pushing pre-owned games and magazine subscriptions at you when you walk in the door. These stores would go under, if people stopped buying used games.

Personally, I wish they would. I don't shop there if I can avoid it. But that's my issue.

Sander said:
Autoduel76 said:
I didn't say that. I said buying a pre-owned copy wouldn't benefit them "any less than a new one"
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Please do not lie, it's annoying:
"Well, technically, you aren't directly handing money to any company unless you buy it directly from them, or preorder it. Because, EB, Best Buy, Wallmart, or whoever you are going to buy it from has already paid Zenimax for the games. "
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What's unclear about this, Sander?

The only way you are handing money directly to anyone is to pre-order it, or buy from them.

If you pre-order it from EB, or Gamestop, for example they will then order as many copies from Zenimax to fill their pre-orders. Which means, your pre-order accounts for them purchasing one more copy of the game.

Otherwise, EB, BB, Wallmart/etc. have already paid Zenimax for their copies of the game when you walk into a store and buy it. So, you aren't, technically, directly paying them anything. You are buying something that's already been paid for.
 
I wonder if the major chain-stores are closer to my system. FRH has about 170-200 stores spread over the Benelux with about half a million gross in sales per store per year (on average), not counting Van Leest subbranches. At that size, centralized restocking through computer is not just usable, it is downright vital. It'd make sense if major chains that don't live off pre-owneds have the same system in the US, it just works so damned well.

If you pre-order it from EB, or Gamestop, for example they will then order as many copies from Zenimax to fill their pre-orders. Which means, your pre-order accounts for them purchasing one more copy of the game.

Otherwise, EB, BB, Wallmart/etc. have already paid Zenimax for their copies of the game when you walk into a store and buy it. So, you aren't, technically, directly paying them anything. You are buying something that's already been paid for.
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Hah! Like a vegetarian going "oh well, the cow's dead, anyway" and eating away. You're technically right, but it de facto doesn't matter, because if nobody buys the stocked copies of the major chains, those major chains won't order new copies either. It's the same mechanic as pre-orders, it just has a longer kick-back time.
 
Autoduel76 said:
What's unclear about this, Sander?

The only way you are handing money directly to anyone is to pre-order it, or buy from them.

If you pre-order it from EB, or Gamestop, for example they will then order as many copies from Zenimax to fill their pre-orders. Which means, your pre-order accounts for them purchasing one more copy of the game.

Otherwise, EB, BB, Wallmart/etc. have already paid Zenimax for their copies of the game when you walk into a store and buy it. So, you aren't, technically, directly paying them anything. You are buying something that's already been paid for.
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Yes, and by that you were saying that buying the game doesn't matter at all and won't financially benefit Bethesda additionally, which is a load of horseshit.
If you didn't *mean* to say that, then you should've chosen your words differently.
 
Brother None said:
I wonder if the major chain-stores are closer to my system. FRH has about 170-200 stores spread over the Benelux with about half a million gross in sales per store per year (on average), not counting Van Leest subbranches. At that size, centralized restocking through computer is not just usable, it is downright vital. It'd make sense if major chains that don't live off pre-owneds have the same system in the US, it just works so damned well.
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Oh, I'm sure the major retailers work by that system. They sell so many other things too, there's no way that a manager could manage it all by hand, I'd think.

But, they don't sell pre-owned games at all at those stores.


Sander said:
Yes, and by that you were saying that buying the game doesn't matter at all and won't financially benefit Bethesda additionally, which is a load of horseshit.
If you didn't *mean* to say that, then you should've chosen your words differently.
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I chose my words fine. Its just that you ignored my second paragraph

Autoduel76 said:
Well, technically, you aren't directly handing money to any company unless you buy it directly from them, or preorder it. Because, EB, Best Buy, Wallmart, or whoever you are going to buy it from has already paid Zenimax for the games.

Buying it used at EB saves you money and gives EB additional profit, but you are no less giving Bethesda your money that way, than if you bought it new at EB.
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If you took from it the idea that I was saying that buying the game wouldn't benefit Bethesda, then really you were reading way too much into it than was there. I was clearly responding to the guy who thought buying a preowned copy wouldn't benefit them and explaing why it would just as much as a new copy.

The first paragraph was semi-sarcastic. I was simply pointing out that the only way you wouldn't be giving money to Bethsoft by buying pre-owned is IF you believe that the only way to be handing them money is in some direct fasion. And I was simply pointing out that IF you believe that, then buying new doesn't change the fact that you aren't directly handing them money either.

The only way, not to be benefiting Bethesda's bottom line is to not buy the game.
Jeez. Sometimes you guys just love to argue don't you.
 
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