Rude awakening: Why Fallout: New Vegas felt incomplete

[Courier]

I thought the reason it felt incomplete was because they cut out half the story to sell later as DLC?

Edit: Oh yeah, that's exactly why it felt incomplete.

 

[Surf Solar]

It would be nice of you to explain what exactly Ulysses story with the Courier has to do with the main story of NV? It is an entire different story arc.

 

[Walpknut]

And considering that every DLC takes about 6 hours it is hardly "Half of the story".

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Bethesda is growing increasingly more predictable, also increasingly more stupid.

For ten minutes I have been trying to find some words that describe my feeling regarding regenerative health in what is suppose to be an RPG, but I just can not find the right ones.

If this bullshit carries on in Fallout games.

You know what? I hope the economic recession destroys the games industry, because it honestly has lost all the right to exist.

 

[Courier]

It would be nice of you to explain what exactly Ulysses story with the Courier has to do with the main story of NV? It is an entire different story arc.

The Ulysses story arc is only what triggers the rest of the game's plot and explains why events in the story happen the way they do, it's not like cutting the story arc out of the game without any explanation left gaping plot holes or anything .

And considering that every DLC takes about 6 hours it is hardly "Half of the story".

Every DLC lasts 6 hours = 24 hours.

Main Story arc lasts about, oh 24 hours.


They cut out a huge story arc, one which is undeniably tied to the main story arc and causes the main story to make little sense without it, without any explanation so that they could sell it back to you at a later date.

 

[Surf Solar]

The Ulysses story arc is only what triggers the rest of the game's plot

Tell me more.

 

[Walpknut]

The Ulysses plot is just an expansion of the starting event, one that doesn't even affects the rest of the plot, is like saying that FO1 cut out half of the story to include it in the sequel in the time traveling random encounter when you destroy the water chip as the Chosen One, it's the event that sets in motion the plot of the first game after all.

Bethesda is growing increasingly more predictable, also increasingly more stupid.

For ten minutes I have been trying to find some words that describe my feeling regarding regenerative health in what is suppose to be an RPG, but I just can not find the right ones.

well, the good thing about the gamebryo engine is that it is mod friendly, and removing Health regeneration would be a very simple mod to make.

 

[Mr Fish]

Until you reach Boulder City the game is linear.

I complained about the same thing, to be honest. The world design was atrocious, with invisible walls dotted over mountainslopes to keep you on the path, and then you could go north (DEAAAAAATH) or south (A WINNAR IS YOU).

I strongly dislike the linear path of FO:NV's first 5 or so hours (assuming you stop and do side quests along the way, that is) not necessarily because it is linear, but because it isn't even that interesting.

Ahem: http://fc03.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2...w_to_get_north_by_gabriel77cortez-d3l1vn8.jpg

I made that damn guide for a reason, spread it around.

 

[Courier]

The Ulysses story arc is only what triggers the rest of the game's plot

Tell me more.

You get told that another courier turned down the job and specifically requested you deliver the platinum chip, then you never hear anything about it again. IIRC Chris Avellone mentioned that the Ulysses story arc was hard to cut out of the main game because of how much it tied in.

As much as I like New Vegas and its DLC, Bethesda and Obsidian's business practices have been less than admirable since its release.

The Ulysses plot is just an expansion of the starting event, one that doesn't even affects the rest of the plot, is like saying that FO1 cut out half of the story to include it in the sequel in the time traveling random encounter when you destroy the water chip as the Chosen One, it's the event that sets in motion the plot of the first game after all.

No, it's a bit more like FO1 cutting out the part about the overseer telling you to go look for the water chip, then cutting out almost every other reference to water chips, and having the game be entirely about a guy in the wasteland who kills the Master.

 

[Walpknut]

No, because 1. You get told that you were to take the platinum chip from the beginning by Mitchell, and later by a lot of other characters and the important thing is that House was the one requesting the job, not Ulysses refusing it, you get to know every faction, their motivations and goals, and none of that has to do with some Rastafari guy in a trenchcoat refusing a job.

 

[Courier]

No, because 1. You get told that you were to take the platinum chip from the beginning by Mitchell, and later by a lot of other characters and the important thing is that House was the one requesting the job, not Ulysses refusing it, you get to know every faction, their motivations and goals, and none of that has to do with some Rastafari guy in a trenchcoat refusing a job.

To quote MCA:

Oddly enough, tearing him out of the game was almost as hard as putting him in because companion scripts touch almost everything (and he also was a complicated character in terms of some of the hooks into the storyline).

Ulysses was a major character in the game, was the driving force that set the events of the game in play, gives the Courier all his motivation for what he does throughout the game, has a location named after him, and he was cut. Without any regard to the plot holes it would leave or confusion it would cause, they cut him.

He was the MacGuffin that causes everything that happens in the story to take place, and they cut him. That would be like The Maltese Falcon cutting out the eponymous Maltese Falcon.



Oh yeah, and the reason the devs gave for cutting him and his storyline out of the game? They were worried it would confuse players to have more than one main story arc. Although apparently "confusing players" is okay as long as their wallets get a little heavier in the process.

I miss the days when game developers didn't insult your intelligence.

 

[Walpknut]

Plot holes created by Ulysses? Ulysses doesn't give the Courier his motivation for everything he does, he is not the driving force at all, it's House, and Benny is whom motivates the Courier to go look for him (getting robed and shot in the head). Ulysses has a important role in back events but he is a minuscule presence on the plot of the game itself.

 

[TheDidact]

You know what? I hope the economic recession destroys the games industry, because it honestly has lost all the right to exist.

That isn't fair to companies not named Bethesda.

 

[Courier]

Plot holes created by Ulysses? Ulysses doesn't give the Courier his motivation for everything he does, he is not the driving force at all, it's House, and Benny is whom motivates the Courier to go look for him (getting robed and shot in the head). Ulysses has a important role in back events but he is a minuscule presence on the plot of the game itself.

Ulysses is the person who made the choice for specifically you to deliver the package, and his reasons for doing so were never explained. Without Ulysses "The Courier" probably wouldn't have been the person to deliver the chip, someone else would have and the Mojave's fate would be entirely different.

Ulysses' actions in choosing specifically you, the Courier, are what sets the entire plot in motion. The developers have specifically stated that he was a very complex character that was deeply tied into the main storyline, yet they cut him out in order to make an extra buck.


Don't get me wrong here now, I still think the other three DLC are mostly original content with original plots that were never planned to be in the original game, it's mainly Lonesome Road I'm complaining about here.

They cut a major character and plot point out of the vanilla game and if you want to get it back you have to pay $10. It's entirely possible that Lonesome Road will flesh out Ulysses' story a bit more than it would have been in the vanilla game but still, I feel gypped having to buy back content that was supposed to already be in the game I bought.


Edit: At least other game developers have the common decency to lie about their DLC just being content cut from the original game.

 

[TheFlyingBuddha]

Oh yeah, and the reason the devs gave for cutting him and his storyline out of the game? They were worried it would confuse players to have more than one main story arc. Although apparently "confusing players" is okay as long as their wallets get a little heavier in the process.

Do we have a quote on that one? I recalled Sawyer mentioning on formspring that the reason he was cut was because he was related to Legion content and a lot of Legion content was cut.

I'll have to try and find the comment... it's a bitch trying to find old stuff on formspring.

 

[GeeZee]

The article was alright. Not great.

I don't see ANY problem with Courier not being inexperienced guy who just crawled out of his shelter. It DOESN'T mean that he's suddenly the explorer and omnibus.

Seriously, if we ignore the possible amnesia, Courier is level 1 because he was Courier. He was walking. Carrying parcels. He wasn't running around killing everything and changing people's fates, dammit! Just because he can walk and knows the map doesn't mean he's incredibly experienced adventurer, looting Vaults and caves.

Besides, Courier comes from NCR territory, and we can assume that specifically, from the Divide. He might as well be in the Mojave for the 1st time ever.

I also don't like how he wants every Fallout game to feature the afore-mentioned greenhorn, who just crawled out of his safe ecosystem into relatively freshly scorched Earth. It's been 200 years since the war. 2-0-0 YEARS. This gimmick got already dumb with Lone Wanderer.

Poseidon! The Enclave! The Brotherhood!

OH NO. NO. NONONONONONONONO.

Seriously, don't people get that after 200+ years it's just stupid and dumb?

Dead Money had a lot of good elements going for it that were hampered by clunky storytelling.

I have to strongly disagree.

I really enjoyed what Honest Hearts brought to the table: interesting characters and a fascinating perspective of how spirituality plays in to societal and cultural development,

Lol. Aside from Burned Man, no one was particularly interesting, and neither was the story.

the regenerating health system Bethesda is using in Skyrim?

We are doomed. No, wait, Bethesda became a joke after Morrowind. Nothing new under the sun.

EDIT:

I'll have to try and find the comment... it's a bitch trying to find old stuff on formspring.

http://www.formspring.me/JESawyer/q/211533046065698998

Is it this post?

 

[brfritos]

Health regeneration is probably the laziest game development fad that has caught on pretty steadily since Halo. Who needs to worry about pacing, item placement, or any situations which might stress the player, when you can just stop and refill at any moment.

NV also has health regeneration if you buy the implant or use the atomic valance, but is only usefull outside of battle (mainly when you sleep or travel).

So the problem is not the regen itself, but laziness of the devs.

 

[GeeZee]

It's entirely possible that Lonesome Road will flesh out Ulysses' story a bit more than it would have been in the vanilla game

Most likely. After all, if he would love to obliterate you earlier like he wants in DLCs, he would be far from being a companion.

Besides, doesn't it seem that Obsidian abandoned this whole "Ulysses being Legion" concept? He dislikes Legion, NCR, BoS, and the only community he does want to see is America.

Sure, he was described as a Frumentarii in Honest Hearts, but then again, it was Sawyer's DLC, and not MCA's, so he might not keep track of what's going on in his story.

 

[Unholy6]

On the topic of the Creation Engine and the future of the Fallout franchise, I know it's a bit early to speculate, but I wonder if Fallout 4 will feature the regenerating health system Bethesda is using in Skyrim?

After searching around the only thing I found about health Regeneration in Skyrim is it exists outside of combat, regenerates slowly, and that is from a secondhand source on gamespot forums who heard about it from Pete Hines twitter account. However what I have seen while watching the E3 demo vid part 1 on youtube was a healing spell that was marked clearly as Healing being used to heal the character.

EDIT: I thought the article made some good points, however the only thing incomplete I see about it was Caesar's Legion. I don't think I could accurately describe my hate for seeing such great potential being drug down to the DEESE GUYZ EVUL category instead of the shades of grey present within the NCR.

 

[RRBM]

On the topic of the Creation Engine and the future of the Fallout franchise, I know it's a bit early to speculate, but I wonder if Fallout 4 will feature the regenerating health system Bethesda is using in Skyrim?

After searching around the only thing I found about health Regeneration in Skyrim is it exists outside of combat, regenerates slowly, and that is from a secondhand source on gamespot forums who heard about it from Pete Hines twitter account. However what I have seen while watching the E3 demo vid part 1 on youtube was a healing spell that was marked clearly as Healing being used to heal the character.

Yeah, I might've really screwed the pooch on that one. I'm looking around now and I can't find a solid source on how it works, either.

Sorry, guys.