Unsurprisingly, Duke Nukem Forever reviews are negative

Discussion in 'General Gaming and Hardware Forum' started by Brother None, Jun 10, 2011.

  1. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    Half Life 1 for example. As it did pretty much all of the stuff. Enemys would search for cover, lob grenades in your direction, attack as team etc.

    No clue about Halo. All I know is that the AI in shooters has not really improved since that day. In many cases it has become even worse. Well actually in most cases. But nevermind.

    The AI in FEAR1 was pretty decent though. But it might have been also because they usualy hit you hard when ever you are inside a room with more then 4-5 of them and you do not regenerate health while sitting behind a shelf. (not that the game is not throwing health packs over you feet every 5 meters or so, just saying).
     
  2. 34thcell

    34thcell Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    333
    Sep 22, 2008
    Halo's AI wasn't too complex, but it had a handful of nice reactions to triggers i.e sticking grenades to them or killing their friends. They also used cover and dodged grenades/vehicles quite well. It didn't make the game particularly challenging, but it had a lot more personality than most shooters.

    I don't know why people assume such a popular game only had auto-aim and recharging health to offer.
     
  3. maximaz

    maximaz Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!

    Apr 2, 2006
    I agree with sea 100%. Halo series has some of the best AI in the genre. Not only do the enemies seem to have an appropriate reaction for pretty much everything, it isn't always the same reaction either. If you stick one with a grenade, they will either leap for cover in desperation, launch at you, or just panic and explode. If you kill enough of their buddies they might come at you guns blazing or make a run for it. They act and comment very appropriately during combat and it's rare to hear them repeat themselves very often.

    I have not played Reach so I can't comment on that one but I remember some fantastic moments during battles in Halo 3. I had a grunt coming at me, yelling "you killed my buddy!" or something like that and I DID just killed a grunt and it was NOT scripted. I even had a grunt flee imminent ownage with "I can't run when I'm scared," and another one call me a jerk before he died. Very few games make enemies feel so alive. I don't think the games get their dues from the more "hardcore" crowd, who concentrae on the overhype instead.
     
  4. Ratty Sr.

    Ratty Sr. Formerly known as Ratty Moderator Orderite

    Apr 23, 2003
    DNF is out? That's it, folks, game over. id Software, cancel Rage; Valve, cancel Half-Life 3; Croteam, cancel Serious Sam 3. The ultimate FPS has just been made, and no one can ever hope to touch Duke's toes, let alone-

    *clicks link*

    Oh, wait, it's shit. Carry on.

    I'm going to assume that you weren't around in 1996 and forgive you this statement, instead of crushing you, chewing you up, spitting you out and using your remains to fertilize my carnivorous plant garden.

    By the way, this is the original Duke Nukem:



    I'm guessing the game you were referring to is the third Duke Nukem game, better known as Duke Nukem 3D:



    In case you were wondering, it is hands down one of the top five first person shooters ever made. And yes, it mops the floor with any game id Software made since Doom. Suck it, Quakefags.

    System-wise, Halo series has perhaps the most sophisticated AI seen in games to date. Halo 2 pioneered the use of behavior trees for game AI, and they have time and time again proven to be the ultimate tool for implementation of complex, hierarchical, reusable behaviors, so much so that they have been used in dozens of games to date, studied academically, employed in professional embodied agent systems, and pretty much pushed the traditional FSM and HFSM approaches to the fringes of behavior AI engineering. It could be said that Bungie with Halo 2 made the single greatest contribution to evolution of artificial intelligence for embodied agents to ever come from the field of game systems engineering.

    I dislike console shooters as much as the next guy, but let us give credit where credit is due, shall we?
     
  5. fedaykin

    fedaykin Vault Fossil

    Jul 15, 2007
    Yeah, it's the most sophisticated retarded kamikazi AI known to man.

    Seriously, did you play some kind of Halo Super AI Edition that I don't know of?
     
  6. Eternal

    Eternal Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?

    461
    Nov 4, 2008
    I never actually did get around to playing D3D or Project Manhatten. I remember playing the heck out of the shareware version of Shadow Warrior though.

    I do wish they'd make a new ORIGINAL style Duke game for a handheld system. But I doubt that'll ever happen. To 90% of gamers today Duke started with Duke3D. Sort of like the "original" Fallout is Fallout 3.
     
  7. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    >_> ?

    [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yl1Rn3ivLlM[/youtube]

    it seems "modern" shooters still did not teached their AI what to do against "snipers"

    [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAnHIz5uJjA&NR=1[/youtube]

    Runing might be as well a problem

    [youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnH5BfZ6io4&NR=1[/youtube]
     
  8. sea

    sea Vault Senior Citizen

    Oct 5, 2009
    Can't speak for Crysis 2 or Halo 2, as I haven't played either, but I did hear about complaints against Crysis 2's AI occasionally doing dumb things - and to be fair, there are very few games which actually do handle attacks from snipers properly in a way that isn't 100% scripted. As for Halo 2, well, like I said, I haven't played it, but I don't know if that one video constitutes normal gameplay (I kind of doubt it). I certainly never saw anything like that in the first Halo.
     
  9. GreyViper

    GreyViper Where'd That 6th Toe Come From?

    401
    Jul 2, 2004
    To be honest its not that bad, I guess it might have resulted from big exceptions. As a shooter its ok, pretty entertaining has the old Duke 3D feel. The downsides are the long intro, well the one that came after boss fight and the ability to only carry 2 weapons. Other then that its a fun shooter, as for AI Im guessing its the same they used from 90s. Still the game makes you chuckle time to time when recognizing some game play elements from other 3D Realms games. Also this game has a lot of mini games, I spent 15 playing pool and with the pinball machine.
    Overall I found it more entertaining then say F.E.A.R.2 so thumbs up from me.
     
  10. Kilus

    Kilus Not Australian Orderite

    May 3, 2003
    Did you have it on Legendary? The lower the difficulty the less you can see the behaviours due to less enemy health, numbers and rank. Other than that the AI is designed while being complex to basically roll over and die once a player has sufficient skill at using the weapons and levels/cover and how the AI works.
     
  11. vanzizzle

    vanzizzle It Wandered In From the Wastes

    103
    Feb 15, 2010
    Why rag on halo? Call of duty black ops bots. Hands down the worst AI. Ever.
     
  12. sea

    sea Vault Senior Citizen

    Oct 5, 2009
    Not to mention that the AI actually gets better (uses more cover, better tactics, flanks and surrounds more, etc.) on higher difficulties rather than just doing more damage, unlike just about every other shooter. Again, I don't want to act like it's infallible, but I'm having a hard time thinking of a modern shooter that has better AI, especially one that has to manage 10+ distinct types of enemies all with their own unique behaviour.
     
  13. Ratty Sr.

    Ratty Sr. Formerly known as Ratty Moderator Orderite

    Apr 23, 2003
    No, just the one that has better AI than almost any other FPS ever made.

    Seriously, if you're arguing that behavior AI in games in general is poor, then I agree with you. Behavior AI sucks across the whole spectrum of its applications, and the field still has a long way to go before it can even come close to simulating humanlike behavior. But that doesn't change the fact that AI in Halo games is top of the line, and in many ways groundbreaking.
     
  14. Ausdoerrt

    Ausdoerrt I should set a custom tit

    Oct 28, 2008
    Well, my 5c on the whole argument... Maybe Halo's AI is as awesome on the technical level as some of you describe - you guys certainly seem to know a lot more about how the stuff works than I do. Still, on the gameplay level, I do not recall any of it ever showing. It wasn't bad, but wasn't the "greatest AI in the world" some of you are touting. I, for one, remember STALKER's AI to be a lot more smart than Halo's - until some engine glitches kick in.

    As for the "you have to turn it up to maximum difficulty for it to actually show" elitist bullshit, well, let me say this: any game is supposed to be at its best on Normal/Hard, and if it doesn't work properly for a majority of players, then it's the game's fault.

    "How so" is it decent, or "how so" does it resemble Unreal? :P I'm assuming the latter - so aside from the minor similarities that may be completely subjective, as well as people claiming that Halo tried to imitate a lot of game modes from later Unreal Tournaments (no personal experience here), I'd say the Covenant elites definitely look inspired by the Skaarj, in their design and behavior.
     
  15. 34thcell

    34thcell Look, Ma! Two Heads!

    333
    Sep 22, 2008
    Not saying Halo's AI was clever, just there's a lot more happening there than most games. Not only AI, but the different animations for the enemies, like running with their hands in the air or getting pissed off.
     
  16. I_eat_supermutants

    I_eat_supermutants Vault Senior Citizen

    Feb 5, 2007
    Yar. It was more of a joke as in it is really DN3D 2.5. I didn't expect much anyways so I'm not at all dissapointed. A game that is in devolpment that long is bound to fail. As mentioned as Daikatana.



    I'm only waiting for Diablo 3 and some machine parts so I can play The Witcher, The Witcher 2 and Starcraft 2.
     
  17. fedaykin

    fedaykin Vault Fossil

    Jul 15, 2007
    I probably played on normal difficulty.
    In practice, my experience was the opposite. It was stupid and easy to beat. But I'm sure it's great in theory -- like Beth's radiant AI...
     
  18. Ausdoerrt

    Ausdoerrt I should set a custom tit

    Oct 28, 2008
    STALKER was pretty good.
     
  19. Crni Vuk

    Crni Vuk M4A3 Oldfag oTO Orderite

    Nov 25, 2008
    I would say average. But what ever if that now is true or not. Fact is STALKER was definitely not coming out the way how it was "hyped" or "promised" before. You can see that during the game as well. Remember it was said at some point it would have helicopters, tanks and cars for the player. Then it was only left to tanks an cars. At some point only cars. Now your forced to walk the whole world on foot.

    I dont care if the sequel needs now 2, 3 or 5 years to get finished. I just hope this time they either dont be such a loudmouth or make the game how they promised it.
     
  20. Guiltyofbeingtrite

    Guiltyofbeingtrite Vault Dweller

    751
    Oct 13, 2008
    in Halo 2 after finishing a firefight when I was allied with Elites they would walk over to downed allies and mourn their deaths, I had never seen it before in a shooter and it was great. I'm not sure if that is more a script but it was rare and wouldn't happen at an inopportune time. I always found Halo's AI to be rather good. Snipers knew to take cover, enemies would use suppressive fire to pin you down, not too much friendly fire, they'd avoid clumping together, would run away from allies if plasmaed, unless they were the grunts.

    Both Human and Covenant were also pretty great pilots and vehicle operators. You'd actually have a shot at taking out enemies and continuing through the game in the passenger seat or turret.