Well, I'm replaying Fallout 1 now thanks to you

[Jogre]

My view is romance and sex are as much a part of the human experience as anything. So, if you're willing to risk Wasteland Herpes, you should have the option.

Better that than causal murder and no romance.

Yes, but not with Tandi.

Tandi isn't that kinda girl mistah. If you're looking for that sort of thing go find a Brahmin or something


(In all seriousness though, with major characters in a game, I find it's better to be encouraged to look at them from a platonic point of view. Like for instance Veronica in FONV: I find in my games I end up seeing her as a close friend, and as a result have a level of admiration/respect for her that I wouldn't otherwise)

 

[DerGogan]

I think they're shooters with RPG elements personally.

So why the fuck are they called "Fallout" ?!?

 

[R.Graves]

So why the fuck are they called "Fallout" ?!?

Because it shares a few bastardised versions of creatures/races from actual fallout games.

 

[Dr Fallout]

Yes, but not with Tandi.

Tandi isn't that kinda girl mistah. If you're looking for that sort of thing go find a Brahmin or something

You can try, but she doesn't take it well.

 

[CT Phipps]

So why the fuck are they called "Fallout" ?!?

Why is Tales from the Borderlands, Borderlands?

Because the setting and lore are rich and beautiful no matter what sort of game you're playing on them. You could easily do a Telltale-esque Fallout game and have no combat whatsoever and it would be a great game.

Sorry for the delay, I'm only now to the Deathclaw.

Aww, Harold, you're such a poor sad little mutant.

 

[cordelionreaver]

Why is Tales from the Borderlands, Borderlands?

Because the setting and lore are rich and beautiful no matter what sort of game you're playing on them. You could easily do a Telltale-esque Fallout game and have no combat whatsoever and it would be a great game.

Sorry for the delay, I'm only now to the Deathclaw.

Aww, Harold, you're such a poor sad little mutant.

Except Tales from the Borderlands is marketed as a spin off. Fallout 3 and 4 are marketed as sequels.

 

[Dr Fallout]

Except Tales from the Borderlands is marketed as a spin off. Fallout 3 and 4 are marketed as sequels.

That's a good point. I would love to see an official Fallout RTS, but only in the safe knowledge it's merely a spin off and not representative of how the IP will progress in the future.

 

[R.Graves]

To clarify once more, I've played Fallout 1.

I just played it in college....15 years ago.



So, it's been awhile.

I'd like to remind you that gizmo deals in child prostitution. It's why I've only ever took his side in one play through.

What happens if you destroy the base before confronting the master and then return chip? Do I get New dialogue options if I do that?

 

[Dr Fallout]

I'd like to remind you that gizmo deals in child prostitution. It's why I've only ever took his side in one play through.

How do you know?

 

[R.Graves]

How do you know?

Sorry. It took me a while to find the evidence in the dialogue file.
Here's what sinthia (one of gizmo's prostitutes) says when the VD asked what else he controls.

{Just about every bad thing a person could do in this town. He owns the Casino. He runs me and some of the other gals, even some little kids. I hear he is trying to take over the bar.}

She doesn't really have a reason to lie to you as you literally just saved her life in that instance (at least my VD had)

Anyway here's a link:
http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/SINTHIA.MSG

It's Message {134}

 

[Dr Fallout]

Ah... wow... that's bad.

 

[Risewild]

Actually, it's more an observation of the limitations and growth of freedom. You could be anyone as Vault Dweller as long as you were from the Vault. You could be a fat old man named Old Man Henderson or a sweet kindly grandmother like Lilly or a child or a lesbian or a slack jawed moron. Other games would have just assumed you were a man ala Baldur's Gate but Fallout restricted you JUST ENOUGH to tell their story.

Fallout 3 and Fallout: New Vegas remembered this lesson.

You can't be an old man or a grandmother like Lily because Fallout (and Fallout 2) limits the age you can give your starting character from 16 to 35 years old...
Also in Baldur's Gate games you can pick your character's gender at character creation... I am confused why you would say the game assumes you're a male.

No because officer forggetable-bethesda-character #9478 opens a dialogue with you no matter what and the proceeds attack regardless of your stats and dialogue option. Killing that NPC is unavoidable unless the roaches do it for you in which case your character has decided to just let a man die. Its a bullshit No-win situation for a pacifistic character.

We can do Vault 101 without killing any person at all. I always just run from them and don't have any problems. Done that probably hundreds of times already while testing TTW .
EDIT: Also it doesn't open a dialogue, he just shouts something like "Hey hold it right there" and starts to attack you, but then changes his attention to the radroaches that attack him, giving you the chance to just move away. He will chase you after he kills the rad roaches though, but I usually have time to run from him, help Butch's mother and still continue running before he can catch me (which will happen if you don't run to the exit and take your sweet time).

 

[R.Graves]

We can do Vault 101 without killing any person at all. I always just run from them and don't have any problems. Done that probably hundreds of times already while testing TTW .

Still... What if you wanted to play a sneaky character? Or a character who can talk people down? The sneak option isn't given to you when it comes to butch or that first officer. The speech option isn't ever given because iirc the overseer kills you even if you reach an agreement.
And butch just knows you're there no matter what so then you have to kill roaches or let someone die. Ain't nobody give fucks about roaches but I should have the option to not kill them and save butch's mom another way. Like I dunno... Turn the lights on and watch em scatter?

All I'm saying is I shouldn't be forced to Dean venture my whole way out of vault 101 to avoid killing people.

 

[CT Phipps]

You can't be an old man or a grandmother like Lily because Fallout (and Fallout 2) limits the age you can give your starting character from 16 to 35 years old...
Also in Baldur's Gate games you can pick your character's gender at character creation... I am confused why you would say the game assumes you're a male.

1. Well, that's disappointing on the age limit.
2. Well, they were canonically so/

We can do Vault 101 without killing any person at all. I always just run from them and don't have any problems. Done that probably hundreds of times already while testing TTW .

Cool.

For me, I felt the murder of the Vault Security operative was a roleplaying milestone. It's when your character becomes a killer to survive. But that may not be who you want to be.

EDIT: Also it doesn't open a dialogue, he just shouts something like "Hey hold it right there" and starts to attack you, but then changes his attention to the radroaches that attack him, giving you the chance to just move away. He will chase you after he kills the rad roaches though, but I usually have time to run from him, help Butch's mother and still continue running before he can catch me (which will happen if you don't run to the exit and take your sweet time).

*scribbles that down*

 

[Risewild]

Still... What if you wanted to play a sneaky character? Or a character who can talk people down? The sneak option isn't given to you when it comes to butch or that first officer. The speech option isn't ever given because iirc the overseer kills you even if you reach an agreement.
And butch just knows you're there no matter what so then you have to kill roaches or let someone die. Ain't nobody give fucks about roaches but I should have the option to not kill them and save butch's mom another way. Like I dunno... Turn the lights on and watch em scatter?

All I'm saying is I shouldn't be forced to Dean venture my whole way out of vault 101 to avoid killing people.

I am not defending the game, I was just pointing out that when you said:

Killing that NPC is unavoidable unless the roaches do it for you in which case your character has decided to just let a man die.

It is not the real case .
To be honest I hate how the guards are immediately hostile for no good reason at all. What real life officers would do would be going to you and ask you to accompany them for some questions. If you refused they would be violent and apprehend you in some way without killing you unless there was no other choice. Since the overseer wants to question the Lone Wanderer, it makes no sense being kill at first sight.

2. Well, they were canonically so/

And canonically the Vault Dweller was a male too...

 

[CT Phipps]

Fallout Thoughts 3#

+ I suppose I've always had an easier time accepting Fallout 3 and its successors because I've always mentally divorced them from the original timeline. I've mentioned Battlestar Galactica's modern incarnation before but in serious times, I consider Fallout 3 a remake of 1 and 2 rather than an actual sequel sequel. Yes, it's still technically set in the same universe but the "soft reboot" element is all there in my head.

It's like I can appreciate HP Lovecraft and Brian Lumley's Cthulhu Mythos stories as well as write my own without ever thinking the spin-offs by other writers is part of the original material WHILE accepting them as unique and enjoyable things in their own right. Batman by Bob kane is different from Batman: The Animated Series is different from Batman: Arkham Asylum. This is despite the fact the Arkhamverse incorporates elements from both.

I see the Bethesdaverse as different from the Cainverse even if it takes all of Cain's work as canon.

+ Anyway, off to the Hub.

+ I murder a bunch of Coyotes on my way to the Hub, which proves to be a mistake as it's causing me to run out of ammo. I'm playing a very violent and aggressive playthrough, which is strange for a 18 year old Vault Dweller but I suppose some children are just born with a capacity for violence and find their niche. I also assume Ian and Tycho are teaching him how to shoot in-between their travel times.

+ Well, maybe not Ian. YOU SUCK WITH SUBMACHINE GUNS! WORSE THAN SULIK!

+ The Hub is basically a sign of Tim Cain's excellent world-building as you have the economic center of the map and how it relate to all of the other settlements. The Water Merchants here sell to the other communities and we have their opinions on how everything works in the Commonwealth like trade caravans and more. This is a mistake in Fallout 4 as you have Bunker Hill as an economic juggernaut when I can't for the life of me see why they shouldn't be based in Diamond City. You have to make a bloody dangerous trek to the people you want to ferry your goods.

+ I'm warned away against the Maltese Falcon and go looking for work because if I'm going to deal with the Water Merchants, I need to have some caps ready. This involves me dealing with Butch Harris who tells me a bunch of caravens are disappearing. As we see, THE MASTER'S EVIL IS AFOOT! Butch hires me to deal with the problem and says it's probably NOT the Death Claw.

Also, kudos to Ron Pearlman here.

+ I go get some information on the Deathclaw and end up meeting Harold. Harold is a mutant rather than a ghoul but I suspect in this universe, all ghouls are supposed to be what happens when people get SOME FEV exposure versus dipping them in a Vat. I think the two species were meant to be related before it was retconned to being Ghouls=Radiation victims and Super Mutants=FEV victims.

Oh and a nice way to slip the Master's origin into the story.

+ I go a Death Claw Hunting! Death Claw Hunting! It's brutal, truly, with my shotgun barely able to take the character and I die on my first playthrough. Still, I manage to take down the thing on my second playthrough and then discover SUPER MUTANTS ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE CARAVAN DISAPPEARANCES! They're kidnapping people to dip them! Interestingly, the message is articulate and shows more the "smarter" Super Mutants versus Harry.

+ I tell Butch the truth, despite the fact I don't think the Hub police will do anything but get them killed.

+ I also blackmail Bob at the Iguana Stand for 100 Hub Bucks a week. Listen, if God didn't want us to engage in cannibalism, he'd have made it give us a prion disease.

*pause*

Oh.

+ I'm tempted to go send some Water Merchants to my Vault but we've still got quite a few days left and I'm okay with waiting for the time being. On the plus side, I do think it's a cool thing to base trade on water and that's why caps exist.

Because Hub bucks are stupid. I only give credit to NCR Dollars because Aradesh and Tandi are on the money.

 

[Jogre]

I see the Bethesdaverse as different from the Cainverse even if it takes all of Cain's work as canon.

Do you consider New Vegas part of the Bethesdaverse or the Cainverse?

I'm tempted to go send some Water Merchants to my Vault

Don't.

By the way, are you playing it with the Fixit patch?, Because if you're not, I'd like to warn you that you will be held against impossible time limits, and it will be impossible for you to achieve a few endings.

You can try, but she doesn't take it well.

 

[CT Phipps]

Fallout Thoughts 3#

Do you consider New Vegas part of the Bethesdaverse or the Cainverse?

I don't consider Fallout: New Vegas to be canon with the original series despite its many shout-outs and nods. This is due, of all things, to the thematic differences of the two game series. NCR in the Fallout: New Vegas universe continues to evolve into an expansionist and increasingly America-Reborn sort of government which I think is against the spirit of the first two games. Chris Avellone, I think, agrees with this interpretation as Lonesome Road is a long winded criticism of the backwards-thinking characters in the game.

For me, the hypothetical future of the Cain Fallout universe is symbolized by New Arryo with its merger of tribalism, environmentalism, democracy, and technology into a new hybridized future. The Bethesdaverse, by contrast, is more pessimistic than the Cain Fallout universe with the essential belief humanity will keep falling into patterns of war, devastation, and recovery to the point that very little progress has been made 200 years later. NCR, for all of its accomplishments, has rebuilt itself into the same imperialist jingoistic war hungry power of the Pre-War America, albeit perhaps before it fell to complete evil.

I do think that NV manages to improve on the new world created by Bethesda from the Cainverse's stuff. It manages to give a lot more freedom of choice to do nonviolet resolutions as well as make a lot more seamless connection from the original games to the new continuity 100 years later. I think the game also works as a contrast to Fallout 3 in many places which a lot of players ignore because of their abject hatred of Bethesda.

Specifically, Father Elijah is very obviously meant to be a foil to Elder Lyons and basically can be summarized as "Elder Lyons if Elder Lyons was evil." Veronica's quest, likewise, is improved by the fact we know that all of her improvements to the BOS work wonderfully in Washington D.C. and she would have been happier if she'd gone with them. Arcade Gannon's story, likewise, benefits from the knowledge if he'd not gotten shot down with his family then he would be one of those faceless mooks or scientists we murder at Raven's Rock.

It also takes the theme of "humanity never puts itself together" and uses to underscore the Four Factions in various ways with the Yes Man! ending being the only one which breaks free of the cycle but potentially for the worse given it has no guarantees. Old World Nostalgia is not really a theme of the original Fallout games the way it is in the Bethesdaverse and New Vegas seemed to recognize it and refine it until they actually made some awesome DLC around the idea of Old World Blues.

Plus, I prefer to think of Vault 21 as actually James and Catherine's home because it provides an interesting origin for them.

Albeit, you have to wonder how the hell they ended up crossing the United States to get to the United States capital and why. My theory is James is badass like his child and he was seeking Doctor Braun.

By the way, are you playing it with the Fixit patch?, Because if you're not, I'd like to warn you that you will be held against impossible time limits, and it will be impossible for you to achieve a few endings.

I am playing with the Fixit Patch.

 

[Dr Fallout]

For me, the hypothetical future of the Cain Fallout universe is symbolized by New Arryo with its merger of tribalism, environmentalism, democracy, and technology into a new hybridized future. The Bethesdaverse, by contrast, is more pessimistic than the Cain Fallout universe with the essential belief humanity will keep falling into patterns of war, devastation, and recovery to the point that very little progress has been made 200 years later. NCR, for all of its accomplishments, has rebuilt itself into the same imperialist jingoistic war hungry power of the Pre-War America, albeit perhaps before it fell to complete evil.

Says Bethesda's universe is more pessimistic.

Hmm... sure, I guess the onset of corruption in the NCR, rampant drug abuse, continued racism and massacres against ghouls, slaver towns and inter-mutant/human/ghoul conflict is really great! (Seriously, Fallout 1 and 2 are replete with bad endings, with the bad endings outnumbering the good endings by A LOT. In fact, the bad endings of Fallout 2 outnumber the bad endings of Bethesda and even [dare I say it) Fallout New Vegas. So.... umm yeah that's stupid).

 

[CT Phipps]

Says Bethesda's universe is more pessimistic.

Hmm... sure, I guess the onset of corruption in the NCR, rampant drug abuse, continued racism and massacres against ghouls, slaver towns and inter-mutant/human/ghoul conflict is really great! (Seriously, Fallout 1 and 2 are replete with bad endings, with the bad endings outnumbering the good endings by A LOT. In fact, the bad endings of Fallout 2 outnumber the bad endings of Bethesda and even [dare I say it) Fallout New Vegas. So.... umm yeah that's stupid).

Wow, you played Fallout 2 like shit man. My Super Mutants, Ghouls, and Humans all mine uranium together until it plays out. Then again, I also ended the Slavers in the Hub, the Shi are building plants which eat radiation, and New Reno is run by the Clampets rather than the Corelones because I murdered the hell out of the other factions as well as cured Jet addiction.

Well, actually, no the Clampets get overrun by my bastard child but that sort of thing happens.