Why do people think New Vegas was actually good?

Sicknessoverload said:
Well, a main quest should be its own questline which New Vegas doesn't really have save for the Securitron vault, Kimball, and the Hoover Dam battle. (I may be forgetting some stuff)
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Yes, you're forgetting the entire Benny storyline. New Vegas has a factional based main quest, the idea that it's poorer because it cohesively weaves the entire setting into it is quite alien to me. The opposite turns me off, I feel. The worst example being Skyrim, I kinda liked walking around and doing stuff in the world but the main quest was so removed from anything that gripped me to the setting that I didn't care. It felt like some dutiful chore calling to me. In New Vegas, the worldbuilding and the detailed setting pull me in, and the main quest is just as part of that because it's not your chosen destiny, it's your character being an agent of change in this regional conflict.
 
Sicknessoverload said:
Well, a main quest should be its own questline
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Why should it be so? I have named reasons why it should be as it is in New Vegas.

Sicknessoverload said:
they aren't that fun to play.
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Why not then? Please elaborate.

Sicknessoverload said:
Vault 87 is more fun to play for me
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And why is vault 87 more fun then than most of New Vegas's quests?

Also, please don't double post. It is against forum rules.

Sicknessoverload said:
Metro, and Wolfenstein.
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So if gameplay is what matters, those 2 have far better gameplay in their shooting mechanics than Fallout 3 or NV does, so why play Fallout?

Sicknessoverload said:
For an RPG New Vegas wipes it's ass with Fallout 3 and then some
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And given Fallout is an RPG franchise, can you therefore see why it is therefore a better game?
 
TheGM said:
I can aim down the sights in New Vegas thus improving the gameplay. Fallout 3 simply can't compete with the better gameplay of New Vegas.
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I couldn't stand that. Granted... it may feel better to shooter fans, but in an RPG the character is the one doing the shooting; should be the one doing the MISSING as per their stats & skills. Players should not be able to compensate for the PC's bad aim; also should not be able to handicap them with their own bad aim.
 
I think I forgot the Benny arc because I didn't care for that much either lol. I think we can agree to disagree, the main quest doesn't have to be tied to the region for me to enjoy it.

Sorry for the double posting, I'll reply to someone then have reply to another and then to another. So, I'll use Nellis as an example I don't really care for it because all of the quests save for Ant Misbehavin' are extremely boring. The one where you have to go to Helios One to get the array parts, or the one where you have to convince Alice to let the girl go for Jack, and do the little museum bit and the doctor bit. None of that is fun, its fast traveling back and forth.

I'll use Nellis again, Vault 87 is more fun than all of that, It doesn't have the quest marker so you're forced to explore and use your surroundings to get to the G.E.C.K. it's a blast to play.

Well to tell you the truth, I prefer Fallout's lore to Metro's and Wolfenstein's, even if their gunplay is better.
 
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Gizmojunk said:
I couldn't stand that. Granted... it may feel better to shooter fans, but in an RPG the character is the one doing the shooting; should be the one doing the MISSING as per their stats & skills.
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Yeah but you've got to admit that's hard to pull off in an FPS. I've argued in the past that skills in an FPS Fallout should affect spread, recoil control and reloading speed but iron-sights should be a standard.
 
Sicknessoverload said:
I've seen Star Trek II, you can't compare Federation technology to Vault-Tec. And, to my knowledge, didn't they use the G.E.C.K. to make a city?
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But that is what the GECK did. it was star trek tech. hell they had fucking replicators. that is one of the background tragedies in the series, they solved the resource shortages by unlocking the secret of replicator. and what did they do with them? turn them into vending machines at a casino because Big MT had some shady plan going on.
Gizmojunk said:
couldn't stand that; granted... it may feel better to shooter fans, but in an RPG, the character is the one doing the shooting.
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wooooosh.
 
TheGM said:
But that is what the GECK did. it was star trek tech. hell they had fucking replicators. that is one of the background tragedies in the series, they solved the resource shortages by unlocking the secret of replicator. and what did they do with them? turn them into vending machines at a casino because Big MT had some shady plan going on.
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It's been a while since I've given it a flick through, but wasn't the GECK clarified in the Fallout Bible to be a really useful toolset, in effect. Preserved seeds, instructional manuals on how to build stuff like adobe structures, stimulating chemical mixtures etc etc. Something that would be invaluable to a growing desert community, but not actual magic like the Arroyo Tribals thought it was. I thought it was Fallout 3 that turned it into that.
 
Atomic Postman said:
Yeah but you've got to admit that's hard to pull off in an FPS.
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Legend of Grimrock did it well enough. Characters had access to firearms, and their skill affected what they could hit. ;)
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This was a problem with FO3. Ignoring (of course) that a Fallout 3 shouldn't be an FPS... FO3 erroneously kept some vestigial RPG combat mechanics that just don't work in first person. Variable damage is a representation of accuracy, and it makes no sense to do minimal damage from a point blank head shot, or critical damage from a grazing shot.

NPCs were taking 30 gunshots like they were spitballs. In FPP the player can see the gun pressed to the target, and still miss? The RNG rolls are to indicate what the FPP view is clearly showing—and they can contradict. In Fallout they can't contradict, because the exact aim cannot be discerned by the player.
 
Sicknessoverload said:
Well in 3 all of the water is irradiated, I think a source of drinking water is more important than making a city.
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Since you seem to be a bit thick I'll make this easier for you to read.

THEY TOOK A THING THAT WOULD REMOVE RADIATION FOR MILES AROUND INCLUDING GROUND WATER! SMASHED IT TO BITS TO MAKE A WATER FILTER THAT WOULDN'T WORK! SILLY SILLY CLOWN FACES.
Atomic Postman said:
If they were stealing a previously used plot mcguffin from a Vault, why didn't they use a water chip again?
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They thought it was an actual potato chip.
 
@Sicknessoverload dude I’m drunk and I can tell what they’re trying tobsay. Youre denseeee bro.

Fallout 3 has so many plot. Holes it’s not even funny. The Enclave in 3 is straight up retardwd
 
Jogre said:
"Objective" definitionally means it can't be shaped by personal taste, opinion or feeling. So to a certain extent, you can only "objectively" measure art in so far as you can state facts about it. Ultimately this comes down to the Is/Ought gap. You can't derive a statement about how something SHOULD be from statements about how it IS. Ought is inherently dependent on a subject with personal judgements, Is is not.

"Fallout New Vegas has a significant amount of bugs due to a limited timeframe" is a statement of fact
"It is bad that Fallout New Vegas has bugs" is a statement of personal judgement, since it is a claim of how something SHOULD be, "New Vegas should not be like this", which is inherently requires a subject capable of reaching judgements. If there were no people but New Vegas still existed, nobody would be able to say that the bugs take away from the experience, since there would be no experience.

Now you might say "Well there are certain standards which human beings find aesthetically appealing" or "There are certain established norms that art follows", and even though I'd have my own criticisms of those ideas, even if we accept them as 100% true, that would still make art standards only Intersubjective (I.E Subjective, but shared among people rather than being atomised and individualistic).

Since "Good" and "Bad" are judgements, and judgements necessarily need a judge to make them, they can't IMO be objective. Objectivity requires the facts to be exactly the same even if there are no humans around to measure them. Good and Bad can't exist without humans.
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Why did you tell me this?
 
Sicknessoverload said:
I think I forgot the Benny arc because I didn't care for that much either lol. I think we can agree to disagree, the main quest doesn't have to be tied to the region for me to enjoy it.

Sorry for the double posting, I'll reply to someone then have reply to another and then to another. So, I'll use Nellis as an example I don't really care for it because all of the quests save for Ant Misbehavin' are extremely boring. The one where you have to go to Helios One to get the array parts, or the one where you have to convince Alice to let the girl go for Jack, and do the little museum bit and the doctor bit. None of that is fun, its fast traveling back and forth.

I'll use Nellis again, Vault 87 is more fun than all of that, It doesn't have the quest marker so you're forced to explore and use your surroundings to get to the G.E.C.K. it's a blast to play.

Well to tell you the truth, I prefer Fallout's lore to Metro's and Wolfenstein's, even if their gunplay is better.
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you know exactly where vault 87 is and how it is designed the moment you play after your first playthrough. and where to find the GECK. which requires you to use Fawkes as the radiation will kill you....

i guess if you choose to fast travel everywhere then it could be considerably boring but some of the enemies in certain locations respawn after a set number of days. this is a problem for bethesda developed games in general with fast traveling everywhere. you just don't use fast travel unless you feel absolutely necessary like it's a very long distance walk between you and your target. and i mean very long distance as the map for new vegas and 3 can be deceiving on how far away it actually is.
 
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