Windows 10

SnapSlav said:
It's not that they'll be making some form of active plot to "get an inch, take a mile", it's more that they'll simply notice a trend, and they'll go along with that trend. The more people "lay back and accept" giving their data freely, the more they'll think "this is just what people want". It's not nefarious, it's just everyone going about their business because no one's raising any fuss whatsoever. It's the same logic behind, say, gun control, prohibition, really ANY idea of how much rights and freedom we have. The fuss is NOT about that some nefarious group will invariably conspire to take our rights away. The fuss IS simply that we must remain vigilant about what we do and do not fulfill as far as responsibilities, and that we always maintain as much control of our own agency as possible. At least, that's what the RATIONAL fuss is about, anyway...
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I don't think any company has nefarious plans, their main purpose is making money through whatever means they are able to. So if they can restrict and control what the customer is using, buying and searching to their business interest, they will try to do it. If nobody would use their services, they would just provide what the market wants. If the market/users have no voice and indulge into a general trend, then companies can use the carrot approach to veer the trend to their comfort, which most of the time is not directed at users well being.

As for the nefarious part, you do not only cure the symptoms, so something like the nsa is the symptom of the whole system being unsafe, because people are fine in handing out their data.
 
Cistern Logic said:
Stone Cold Robert House said:
There are ACTUAL privacy problems in the world, elsewhere.
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Indeed.

I forgot how many cameras there are (3 I think) per acre in the Urban U.S. And those are fixed locations not including satellites, drones and special law enforcement cameras.
I about shit when I Googled my address and saw a clear, recent satellite photo of my front yard. Hell, I could count the clothespins my wife left out on the line! :eek:


We're watched everywhere. In America at least, we've become "One Nation, Under Surveillance.."

This may or may not be true so much depending on where else in the world you live, I reckon.


"Good Night, and Good Luck." ;)
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The only correct thing to do once they decide to observe your home, is to run around naked. All the time.
 
Oppen said:
if it has anything to do with HP in my case, I wouldn't be surprised. It was my worst buy ever.
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I haven't bought a desktop since that Acer back in '98. I build my desktop game systems. My wife and daughter have the laptops and smart phones. I still have a folding Motorola "dumb phone." I guess I'm behind the times, but then so are a lot of cranky old coots in my age group (51). *wink*
 
Cistern Logic said:
Oppen said:
if it has anything to do with HP in my case, I wouldn't be surprised. It was my worst buy ever.
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I haven't bought a desktop since that Acer back in '98. I build my desktop game systems. My wife and daughter have the laptops and smart phones. I still have a folding Motorola "dumb phone." I guess I'm behind the times, but then so are a lot of cranky old coots in my age group (51). *wink*
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Mine is a laptop. I usually just plan to build a desktop, but never overcome my own cheapness, so I neither buy nor build it :P
I had a Nokia 1100 until last year. Only switched to a N8-00 because my circle pretty much became over reliant on WhatsApp, so I had a few bridges burnt if I didn't made the switch.
 
AskWazzup said:
I don't think any company has nefarious plans, their main purpose is making money through whatever means they are able to. So if they can restrict and control what the customer is using, buying and searching to their business interest, they will try to do it.
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That IS a nefarious plan, but you say you don't think they have any. Clearly, you do. Making a better product or offering a better service is a "standard affair" of any business in order to claim more clients than their competition. But colluding with one another to set prices, or actively trying to subvert the natural market trends so that they can establish themselves in control are NOT business practices that involve the natural flow of the market.

Businesses like Microsoft, Google, Apple, and many more are introducing things into their software specifically because they're observing people want it- or are way too easy to accept it. That's taking market date, and providing supply for a perceived demand. That's not a plot or any form of subversion in the slightest. They're not spying, they're collecting market data. The fact that market data is USED for spying purposes (by the government, NOT to be confused with businesses) is out of their control. Again, it's not a nefarious plan.

If you were to compare Microsoft and Apple to Comcast and Time Warner, you would see VASTLY different business practices between the 2 groups. Microsoft and Apple directly compete with one another, so they're always trying to offer better products and services to try and win over more customers than the other. Comcast and Timer Warner, by contrast, have agreed territorial boundaries, agreed pricing models, agreed levels of service, so they both get to monopolize their respected territories. The latter group is a CLEAR case of businesses utilizing subversive, anti-consumer agendas to maintain their stranglehold on their respective markets. The former (the group this topic is so intimately concerned with) is an example of the opposite. They may be introducing more and more programming of a nature that many of us find somewhat objectionable, but it's just the nature of the beast. Restaurant owners notice items on the menu that do not sell and decide to remove them from the menu to save money on ingredients. It's the same thing, except you extrapolate the practice to buyer information, not seller inventory information. It may seem problematic- and for sure we as discerning consumers MUST continue to be vigilant one what we believe to be proper business etiquette -but it's really nothing beyond your day-to-day trying to stay relevant and afloat as a business.
 
SnapSlav said:
That IS a nefarious plan, but you say you don't think they have any. Clearly, you do. Making a better product or offering a better service is a "standard affair" of any business in order to claim more clients than their competition. But colluding with one another to set prices, or actively trying to subvert the natural market trends so that they can establish themselves in control are NOT business practices that involve the natural flow of the market.
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I think it will be wasted time to try and debate the meaning of nefarious, so let it be nefarious. In any case, it might not be natural business practices, but that didin't seemed to stop microsoft, or apple:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Apple_Inc.

SnapSlav said:
Businesses like Microsoft, Google, Apple, and many more are introducing things into their software specifically because they're observing people want it- or are way too easy to accept it. That's taking market date, and providing supply for a perceived demand.
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Maybe you just missed it, but those two sentences do not appear to be in harmony.

SnapSlav said:
That's not a plot or any form of subversion in the slightest. They're not spying, they're collecting market data. The fact that market data is USED for spying purposes (by the government, NOT to be confused with businesses) is out of their control. Again, it's not a nefarious plan.
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I didin't say they were spying, i was saying that because of the increased data slurping, you get problems like the nsa scandal. Although while browsing the apple article linked above, i found and interesting piece:

Leaked NSA documents obtained by The Guardian [SUP][158][/SUP] and The Washington Post [SUP][159][/SUP] in June 2013 included Apple in the list of American companies that allegedly cooperate with PRISM, which authorizes the government to secretly access data of non-American citizens hosted by American companies without a warrant. Following the leak, government officials acknowledged [SUP][160][/SUP] the existence of the program. According to the leaked documents, the NSA has direct access to servers of those companies, and the amount of data collected through the program had been growing fast in years prior to the leak. Apple has denied [SUP][161][/SUP] having any knowledge of the program.

After apple started to bend over to china, to include backdoors, the text above doesn't sound so out of this world.

SnapSlav said:
They may be introducing more and more programming of a nature that many of us find somewhat objectionable, but it's just the nature of the beast.
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It may be, but if the open source movement would have succumbed to that claim in the late 80' early 90', the world of personal computing and the whole internet might look very different today (especially when about three quarters of the internet runs on open source software).
 
AskWazzup said:
Maybe you just missed it, but those two sentences do not appear to be in harmony.
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Nope, you failed to understand the precision of my words. Typo of writing "date" when I meant "data" notwithstanding, of course.

As for the rest, not gonna bother. It's just not worth my time.
 
Still haven't had a notification. I know they're releasing it in 'waves' and I live in British Deliverance but god they're taking it slow.
 
Well I got on the list as recently as a few weeks ago, so I'm under no illusions that I'll be getting it particularly soon.
 
So far, so good. All of my installed games work. The Gamebryo game script extenders and memory address mods work fine. *phew*
 
I've signed up the very day it started popping up, so like what? 2 or 3 months ago? Still didn't get anything. :)
 
Don't forget to send naked pictures of your self with your mails, so the poor guy at Microsoft reading your stuff has something to look at :V
 
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