Would anyone take issue with the Enclave in future games?

I have always loved the Enclave. As BigBoss put it (love the username btw, is it a Metal Gear Solid reference?), the Enclave in FO2 were very layered. I think New Vegas brought some of those layers into perspective as well, showing actual remnants of the organization, the ones from the West Coast anyway. Yeah, some players who never played the original FO games might not realize just how deadly and dangerous the group really was, if they judged by the small ragtag group left in the area, but then, those same people probably wouldn't appreciate a lot of things that the New Vegas (and FO3 as well) hints at. It doesn't make the game bad, it means there's stuff for the original fans to enjoy that they will pick up on--that newcommers won't.

What I really liked about the New Vegas remnants is that they kinda show the reasons why Arianna Lahar, my fan fiction and RP character, fled the Enclave. I never posted the story I wrote, but she did take part in an RP a looong time ago, before I had to leave NMA for several months to a year. Sadly, I never got to flesh out her story, but she was ex Enclave from the FO3 era, having deserted Raven Rock. While she believed in the ideals of restoring pre-war America, and uniting the wastelands, and rebuilding humanity, she eventually took issue with their methodology, seeing the Enclave leadership for what they were; cold hearted bastards.

ANYWAY, I really love what you said about the Enclave there, Big Boss. Newbies to the franchise, who played FO3 as their intro to the series, really wouldn't see the complexity behind this organization. In FO3, they are made out to be pretty much pure damn evil, and you honestly don't get to see a real glimpse into the lives of the soldiers who served. Even in FO2, you don't get to see much of this, although you can at least interact with the Enclave when you are disguised as a new recruit--and maybe see that the majority of the people are just regular guys, following the orders of a post-war Hitler.

I really would like to see what happened with the remains of this group, whatever is left in Chicago and other possible outposts they had throughout the wastelands. And I'd like to see this sort of grey area, this not-good-but-not-evil ideology explored more. Breathe new life into the Enclave, don't just bring them back as hostile killers who have no redeeming qualities. This was my biggest disappointment with Fallout 3, because I think they made BOTH factions entirely too black and white. FO3 glossed over the Brotherhood of Steel's faults, and they glossed over the Enclave's redeeming qualities in terms of what they are trying to accomplish--even if their methods are unarguably evil.
 
FOvet said:
I have always loved the Enclave. As BigBoss put it (love the username btw, is it a Metal Gear Solid reference?), the Enclave in FO2 were very layered. I think New Vegas brought some of those layers into perspective as well, showing actual remnants of the organization, the ones from the West Coast anyway. Yeah, some players who never played the original FO games might not realize just how deadly and dangerous the group really was, if they judged by the small ragtag group left in the area, but then, those same people probably wouldn't appreciate a lot of things that the New Vegas (and FO3 as well) hints at. It doesn't make the game bad, it means there's stuff for the original fans to enjoy that they will pick up on--that newcommers won't.

What I really liked about the New Vegas remnants is that they kinda show the reasons why Arianna Lahar, my fan fiction and RP character, fled the Enclave. I never posted the story I wrote, but she did take part in an RP a looong time ago, before I had to leave NMA for several months to a year. Sadly, I never got to flesh out her story, but she was ex Enclave from the FO3 era, having deserted Raven Rock. While she believed in the ideals of restoring pre-war America, and uniting the wastelands, and rebuilding humanity, she eventually took issue with their methodology, seeing the Enclave leadership for what they were; cold hearted bastards.

ANYWAY, I really love what you said about the Enclave there, Big Boss. Newbies to the franchise, who played FO3 as their intro to the series, really wouldn't see the complexity behind this organization. In FO3, they are made out to be pretty much pure damn evil, and you honestly don't get to see a real glimpse into the lives of the soldiers who served. Even in FO2, you don't get to see much of this, although you can at least interact with the Enclave when you are disguised as a new recruit--and maybe see that the majority of the people are just regular guys, following the orders of a post-war Hitler.

I really would like to see what happened with the remains of this group, whatever is left in Chicago and other possible outposts they had throughout the wastelands. And I'd like to see this sort of grey area, this not-good-but-not-evil ideology explored more. Breathe new life into the Enclave, don't just bring them back as hostile killers who have no redeeming qualities. This was my biggest disappointment with Fallout 3, because I think they made BOTH factions entirely too black and white. FO3 glossed over the Brotherhood of Steel's faults, and they glossed over the Enclave's redeeming qualities in terms of what they are trying to accomplish--even if their methods are unarguably evil.
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well said, I too feel that Enclave needs to come out of it's "absolute antagonist" shell and have a more grey role in the game. that means players should get to know the Enclave better, see their good and bad sides. IMO Enclave can become the next NCR, if their story is handled right.
 
Fuck, not this again!
The Enclave has been played out dammit, let it rest.

They never were good guys to begin with, yes there were good people amongst them, but these were the descendants of government officials who dreamed of a coup against the official US government, high ranking corporate execs who made a shit load of money of wars and high energy prices, and their military and scientific cronies.
They saw everyone, including Vault Dwellers as 'lesser' than themselves, they were the only people worthy of calling themselves 'humans' and inheriting the Earth.

Want to focus on former Enclave members who are actually good people, fine.
But the Enclave itself is irredeemable, they are not interested in 'rebuilding the world' and make it a nice place for everyone. They want everyone outside their group to die as quick as possible.
 
They dreamed of a coup agains't themselves ? Unless proved otherwise by actual evidence, they are the government, the government of a country that doesn't exist anymore, as the land was claimed by post-war factions/settlement/nations.
 
naossano said:
They dreamed of a coup agains't themselves ? Unless proved otherwise by actual evidence, they are the government, the government of a country that doesn't exist anymore, as the land was claimed by post-war factions/settlement/nations.
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Got that from the bibles (which I consider more canon than FO3), the Enclave was not made up of the entirety of US government, just specific members within it (the US president is possible), together with influential people from the private sector.
Most likely they wanted to get those they felt weren't hardliners enough or were forced to take into the government, out of office. Basically make the government completely over with their own members. (plus suspension of the constitution et yada yada yada)
 
The Dutch Ghost said:
Fuck, not this again!
The Enclave has been played out dammit, let it rest.

They never were good guys to begin with, yes there were good people amongst them, but these were the descendants of government officials who dreamed of a coup against the official US government, high ranking corporate execs who made a shit load of money of wars and high energy prices, and their military and scientific cronies.
They saw everyone, including Vault Dwellers as 'lesser' than themselves, they were the only people worthy of calling themselves 'humans' and inheriting the Earth.

Want to focus on former Enclave members who are actually good people, fine.
But the Enclave itself is irredeemable, they are not interested in 'rebuilding the world' and make it a nice place for everyone. They want everyone outside their group to die as quick as possible.
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different times, Enclave will either has to change it's ideology or die off slowly in the wasteland like the BoS. I'd choose the former fate if it was up to me. :3 Like how the East Coast Brotherhood changed it's methods when they witnessed the burden of normal people.
 
Banestalker said:
different times, Enclave will either has to change it's ideology or die off slowly in the wasteland like the BoS. I'd choose the former fate if it was up to me. :3 Like how the East Coast Brotherhood changed it's methods when they witnessed the burden of normal people.
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Except they already died. Being nuked twice does that to you. The remnants that weren't on the Oil Rig or wherever the other F3 place was (some air base or something) are too small and scattered to regroup and do anything serious. Their main base(s) were destroyed and they lost all communication with each other. If the Enclave gets the ability to still reform and be the "Power Armored Death Army" again, then they might as well resurrect Frankie and say that he had the immunity to being blown up and was just thrown to the shore by the blast.

EDIT: And throw the Master into the fray as well for "Fan Service" and "References"
 
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The Enclave should NOT be a threat in the future games. If the Enclave is going to appear in future games, the Enclave should either be just like the ones in New Vegas, or we should at least gained more background about this faction.
 
Banestalker said:
different times, Enclave will either has to change it's ideology or die off slowly in the wasteland like the BoS. I'd choose the former fate if it was up to me. :3 Like how the East Coast Brotherhood changed it's methods when they witnessed the burden of normal people.
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They did, altho not slowly, they died in a HUGE EXPLOSION, twice. There shouldn't be any more Enclave, pulling another remnant out of their asses that is not just 5 people or less would be stretching it and a complete stagnation of ideas. Only Fo3 fans want to see the Enclave over and over again, like some form of Galactic empire knock off.
 
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* shudder * now you made me imagine Enclave versions of stuff like the planet devastators, galaxy gun, Eclipse 1 & 2, and the Sun Crusher.
I wouldn't actually mind a couple more super weapons that fit in the lore of Fallout as long as it is not a repeat of previous used ones. So not another weaponized FEV attempt, HELIOS One orbital laser, or missile base like the Divide. (I make an exception for the BOMB space platform as I still want to see it in a Fallout game)
 
I don't understand the obsession with bringing back the Government Remnant again and again. With the loss of the Poseidon Oil Rig, the organization's back was broken and wholly ignoring the silliness of Bethesda's Fallout 3, it was mentioned in Fallout 3(V.B.) that the organization had pretty much deteriorated when if my memory serves me correctly you run into Arcade Gannon(is his VB form).
 
The Dutch Ghost said:
* shudder * now you made me imagine Enclave versions of stuff like the planet devastators, galaxy gun, Eclipse 1 & 2, and the Sun Crusher.
I wouldn't actually mind a couple more super weapons that fit in the lore of Fallout as long as it is not a repeat of previous used ones. So not another weaponized FEV attempt, HELIOS One orbital laser, or missile base like the Divide. (I make an exception for the BOMB space platform as I still want to see it in a Fallout game)
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Yeah, the whole early space era part of the Fallout setting is something that has always interested me but they haven't focused on it in any significant way (don't even think about bringing up Mothership Zeta).
 
Rather the same here, I really wanted something to be done with the Pre War space program such as the planned mission to Mars and the Enclave's plans of space colonization.
I really wanted to see Van Buren's third chapter in which the player goes into space in a pre war rocket in order to prevent BOMB001 from firing its missiles.
 
That's why my fallout concept had the whole space vault thing, but it might have stretched it out a tad.
 
Most likely Enclave will appear in the new games, if not Fo4, then Fo5..7 etc. Why? It has become a kind of a "trademark", being an integral part of the Fallout universe, having lots of haters and fans it can add more attraction to the further games.

If a were a script-writer, I'd certainly use Enclave for making the game commercially beneficial. In the Fo4 I'd put only some clear hints at the existence of other big Enclave bases (Chicago etc.). There would be only explorer-robots and spies (player could become one of them and reveal some secrets about Enclave, find storages in the Wasteland, learn more about pre-war world and beginning of the war). In Fo5 Enclave would appear as a very powerful faction again, much more powerful than in Fo2/3 and not so ondimensionally "evil", they would take own mistakes into account and become less aggressive, more sly, start creating something instead of only destroying. But it wouldn't mean they gave up previous plans, they just corrected it a bit.

It's a sci-fi world! There are multiple ways of the Enclave return, right up to their emigration into another universe for making new bases there or use of the time machine. Everything is possible.
 
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I would take no issue, however, there must be 3 conditions

1) They must not be the antagonists. We already had 2 games where they were the bad guys, one of which was a rehash of the other time, just not as cool.

2) They must not be a major faction

3) They must not be a military power.

It would be interesting if a splinter group of the Enclave were to take a sort of Followers of the Apocalypse like vocation, where they attempt to atone for their war crimes by using their advanced tech to heal people. Although unlike the followers, this splinter group would try to cure ghoulism and mutation. Non-lethally, but one could still imagine that their practices would be frowned upon by some.
 
Nope, BOMB001 was planned long before Iron Sky probably was even an idea.
Goes all the way back to 2002/2003.

Plus it is not a station full of Enclave soldiers, just a relic from before the great war.
 
No it is a space station armed with nuclear missiles that was never activated and used during the great war.
They never got around to installing the main generator in the station, leaving it only with emergency power.
The main bad from Van Buren, Dr Presper, wanted to go to BOMB001, install the main generator and then wipe out a lot of settlements in the South West in order to restart civilization as he felt that what had arisen since the great war had become to corrupted beyond recovery (NCR being controlled by the Brahmin and Agri Barons and caravan houses, the BOS waging a war to get control over technology in order to restore their waning power, and more such places)
Then with people that he had cryogenic-ly frozen in the Boulder Dome he wanted to begin anew.
 
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