If Fallout 4 had actual proper alternate endings.

[omegaspruz]

But Fallout 4 was better written than Skyrim and Fallout 3. For all we know Fallout 5 could be better written, and sorry Bethesda is aware that the next game they make should be a vast improvement. When once everyone of their games were game of the year, the times have changed. They have recently expanded their studio.

That said, on its own Fallout 4 is believable and well written. Although that depends what you are looking for. What are you looking for? What dont you like? You keep mentioning stuff which I described inconsequential, at least of what I have seen so far.

Games again are a lot less spiritual experiences and more about entertainment, fun and joy.

Fallout 4, has moved the serious forward. It crafted its unique place in Fallout world. Its own unique lore. And a lot of the reasons why the game reuses old brands is because of old school fanboys. Why is X0-1 Armor in the game? Because podering to the core fan base. Doesnt bother me that. If anything Fallout 4 is the direct result of all the critisism Fallout 3 got. It abandoned a lot of what Fallout 3 tried to build in order to hastily replace it with the stuff which is more like originals. The core fanbase could be blamed for it. Thats why caps are there, because as much as we say that it doesnt matter, it does.

Obviously Bethesda gets the blame for the endings, obviously. But not for crazy Brotherhood, not completely at least. Among others obviously. Why Triggerman? Because New Vegas, because New Reno.

But I come back to the point, what doesnt make sense? Diamond City? Institute? Institute makes more sense than Big MT, than Sierra Madre. Goodneighbour? Makes sense. Bunker Hill? USS Constitution? What doesnt make sense? Other than plot holes or retcons?

I know which things dont make sense, and I hate the game all the more for it. But those quests are small enough that I can still enjoy the game. Not everything in the originals was gold.

 

[whirlingdervish]

That entire post is based on the dubious conclusion that Fallout 4 being better than Fallout 3 is a thing, or that by itself it's a decent game.

Even on it's own, ignoring that any other fallout game ever existed, Fallout 4 relies on a bunch of really gradeschool writing techniques to further the plot or to try to make us care about things that we just don't care about.

If we ignore all of the turn based titles, it doesn't even have the best gunplay of the 3 first person installments. Removing real guns, ammo types, weapon skills and damage threshold has pretty much turned it into kiting bulletspongey generic baddies over and over and over.


With the exception of the graphics and the handling of power armor in general, I'm unwilling to say that any part of it is better than Fallout 3.
The story is not any better, doesn't make more sense, and re-uses many elements from Fallout 3 that were crap. (Liberty Prime, we're looking at you)

The NPCs are just as wooden, the communities are only marginally more believable (still worse than Skyrim) and forcing us to use the character they wrote without even allowing us to change the guy with a system of skills, makes sure that navigating the story is incredibly shallow and railroady and something you would not see the need to do twice.

 

[omegaspruz]

As a person to whom stories are important and likes to talk and debate stories. Please, what are gradeschool writing technique used to further the plot. I am not trying to be facetious, I am actually interested. If you want to debate it properly, throw in examples as to why something is not believeable, what are many elements of 3 which are reused, how are NPCs wooden. Saying such things doesnt not really make it so. I personally found much more subtlety than Skyrim and in many aspects tha 3.

Ammo crafting removal was weird, i agree. The rest is debatable whether it is good or not. It only becomes a bullet sponge at higher levels, and you can approach each enemy differently and it works. While the gamma gun is great on humans, it heals ghouls and replenishes their health. So yeah, thats a plus in my opinion.

Sadly when all the dust settles, I think Fallout 4 will just be a forgetable game. There will be better Fallouts and its kinda stuck in this limbo with 3 from being the middle child.

Also this:

So far, the only time I have even considered buying this game was after watching people who don't know anything about Fallout play it incredibly poorly on twitch.tv and praise the game highly (only to not stream it again after a few times).

Something competitive in me just screams when I see people being bad at video games, or not knowing anything about the gameworld in an RPG.
I'm left feeling something like "well I could play that way better and actually know what I'm looking at" even if I hated it.

Why are you making judgements about a game from the franchise you are playing if you havent played the game? Fallout 4 is a divisive game, no doubt about that, if someone hated it doesnt mean you will.

 

[GeorgieBest]

But Fallout 4 was better written than Skyrim and Fallout 3. For all we know Fallout 5 could be better written, and sorry Bethesda is aware that the next game they make should be a vast improvement. When once everyone of their games were game of the year, the times have changed. They have recently expanded their studio.

That said, on its own Fallout 4 is believable and well written. Although that depends what you are looking for. What are you looking for? What dont you like? You keep mentioning stuff which I described inconsequential, at least of what I have seen so far.

Games again are a lot less spiritual experiences and more about entertainment, fun and joy.

Fallout 4, has moved the serious forward. It crafted its unique place in Fallout world. Its own unique lore. And a lot of the reasons why the game reuses old brands is because of old school fanboys. Why is X0-1 Armor in the game? Because podering to the core fan base. Doesnt bother me that. If anything Fallout 4 is the direct result of all the critisism Fallout 3 got. It abandoned a lot of what Fallout 3 tried to build in order to hastily replace it with the stuff which is more like originals. The core fanbase could be blamed for it. Thats why caps are there, because as much as we say that it doesnt matter, it does.

Obviously Bethesda gets the blame for the endings, obviously. But not for crazy Brotherhood, not completely at least. Among others obviously. Why Triggerman? Because New Vegas, because New Reno.

But I come back to the point, what doesnt make sense? Diamond City? Institute? Institute makes more sense than Big MT, than Sierra Madre. Goodneighbour? Makes sense. Bunker Hill? USS Constitution? What doesnt make sense? Other than plot holes or retcons?

I know which things dont make sense, and I hate the game all the more for it. But those quests are small enough that I can still enjoy the game. Not everything in the originals was gold.

In my opinion being written better than Fallout 3 or Skyrim is a measly achievement comparable to the likes of shitting a turd more comfortably Crafting lore, to me is inconsequential, if its not crafted well and particularly when the actual storyline and quest storylines are even more shoddily written. Also it cannot be more like the originals as there is nothing in the form of C&C (actual roleplaying) with only a vestigial, desecrated corpse of it remaining by the wayside, at best The institute to me is completely bananas motives wise and i think Beth likes it that way Also my heart breaks when looking at the poor, poor Super Mutants, reduced to Pokemon encounters The BOS was serviceable i guess (epic intro - i guess Beth looks up to Hollywood for storylines)
I personally preferred Fallout 3 to 4 (however refer to my starting analogy) as at least it tried to do C&C (in sidequests) and you can almost see the sweat stains from all those shitty writers trying to implement some C&C in their shitty storylines Felt like high-school project C&C However the main storyline was abysmal (allow me though to say that i actually enjoyed the intro - only part) and yes maybe Fallout 4's wasn't as abysmal (and it wasn't) but at best it can be described as adequate(and thats a best case). However the lack of C&C (even greater) combined with the illusion of C&C (VERY BAD! and breaks consumer trust) and the severely increased focus on shooting (hate ceaseless action) plunges the whole experience, for me, into worse depths than fallout 3.
Again though i must say that my story standards are greater than yours (all you want as stated is lulzy fun - which i believe they also under delivered but thats another discussion) so i guess we'll have to agree to disagree since your not even looking for anything great story-wise

PS. great example of hack writing: we're doing androids, you know Blade Runner dude! (No mention of electric sheep at all) lets put a noodle bar in the middle of our only true town

 

[omegaspruz]

But Fallout 4 was better written than Skyrim and Fallout 3. For all we know Fallout 5 could be better written, and sorry Bethesda is aware that the next game they make should be a vast improvement. When once everyone of their games were game of the year, the times have changed. They have recently expanded their studio.

That said, on its own Fallout 4 is believable and well written. Although that depends what you are looking for. What are you looking for? What dont you like? You keep mentioning stuff which I described inconsequential, at least of what I have seen so far.

Games again are a lot less spiritual experiences and more about entertainment, fun and joy.

Fallout 4, has moved the serious forward. It crafted its unique place in Fallout world. Its own unique lore. And a lot of the reasons why the game reuses old brands is because of old school fanboys. Why is X0-1 Armor in the game? Because podering to the core fan base. Doesnt bother me that. If anything Fallout 4 is the direct result of all the critisism Fallout 3 got. It abandoned a lot of what Fallout 3 tried to build in order to hastily replace it with the stuff which is more like originals. The core fanbase could be blamed for it. Thats why caps are there, because as much as we say that it doesnt matter, it does.

Obviously Bethesda gets the blame for the endings, obviously. But not for crazy Brotherhood, not completely at least. Among others obviously. Why Triggerman? Because New Vegas, because New Reno.

But I come back to the point, what doesnt make sense? Diamond City? Institute? Institute makes more sense than Big MT, than Sierra Madre. Goodneighbour? Makes sense. Bunker Hill? USS Constitution? What doesnt make sense? Other than plot holes or retcons?

I know which things dont make sense, and I hate the game all the more for it. But those quests are small enough that I can still enjoy the game. Not everything in the originals was gold.

In my opinion being written better than Fallout 3 or Skyrim is a measly achievement comparable to the likes of shitting a turd more comfortably Crafting lore, to me is inconsequential, if its not crafted well and particularly when the actual storyline and quest storylines are even more shoddily written. Also it cannot be more like the originals as there is nothing in the form of C&C (actual roleplaying) with only a vestigial, desecrated corpse of it remaining by the wayside, at best The institute to me is completely bananas motives wise and i think Beth likes it that way Also my heart breaks when looking at the poor, poor Super Mutants, reduced to Pokemon encounters The BOS was serviceable i guess (epic intro - i guess Beth looks up to Hollywood for storylines)
I personally preferred Fallout 3 to 4 (however refer to my starting analogy) as at least it tried to do C&C (in sidequests) and you can almost see the sweat stains from all those shitty writers trying to implement some C&C in their shitty storylines Felt like high-school project C&C However the main storyline was abysmal (allow me though to say that i actually enjoyed the intro - only part) and yes maybe Fallout 4's wasn't as abysmal (and it wasn't) but at best it can be described as adequate(and thats a best case). However the lack of C&C (even greater) combined with the illusion of C&C (VERY BAD! and breaks consumer trust) and the severely increased focus on shooting (hate ceaseless action) plunges the whole experience, for me, into worse depths than fallout 3.
Again though i must say that my story standards are greater than yours (all you want as stated is lulzy fun - which i believe they also under delivered but thats another discussion) so i guess we'll have to agree to disagree since your not even looking for anything great story-wise

Considering the stuff I like and hail as the greatest things ever, I highly doubt that your standards are that much higher. You might just be looking for other things. I have never stated that all I want is lulzy fun, I like more intellectual stuff. If i wanted lulzy fun I would be on a just cause forum. But I can still enjooy lulzy fun, cant I? That said, Fallout 3 has very little story, and what story it has gets thrown out of the window the moment enclave storm the purifier. Fallout 4 has a story all the way through. For you to determine decisevely what my story standards are... well admittedly i find it ignorant, arrogant and offensive, not that I am offended but you can have more tact about your phrasing.

Super Mutants, yeah man.... they have been scary presence in Fallout 3, and a great part of the west coast. Fallout 4 yeah they are pokemon, they are this annoying dog pokemon in the bushes at the beginning of the game.

 

[GeorgieBest]

But Fallout 4 was better written than Skyrim and Fallout 3. For all we know Fallout 5 could be better written, and sorry Bethesda is aware that the next game they make should be a vast improvement. When once everyone of their games were game of the year, the times have changed. They have recently expanded their studio.

That said, on its own Fallout 4 is believable and well written. Although that depends what you are looking for. What are you looking for? What dont you like? You keep mentioning stuff which I described inconsequential, at least of what I have seen so far.

Games again are a lot less spiritual experiences and more about entertainment, fun and joy.

Fallout 4, has moved the serious forward. It crafted its unique place in Fallout world. Its own unique lore. And a lot of the reasons why the game reuses old brands is because of old school fanboys. Why is X0-1 Armor in the game? Because podering to the core fan base. Doesnt bother me that. If anything Fallout 4 is the direct result of all the critisism Fallout 3 got. It abandoned a lot of what Fallout 3 tried to build in order to hastily replace it with the stuff which is more like originals. The core fanbase could be blamed for it. Thats why caps are there, because as much as we say that it doesnt matter, it does.

Obviously Bethesda gets the blame for the endings, obviously. But not for crazy Brotherhood, not completely at least. Among others obviously. Why Triggerman? Because New Vegas, because New Reno.

But I come back to the point, what doesnt make sense? Diamond City? Institute? Institute makes more sense than Big MT, than Sierra Madre. Goodneighbour? Makes sense. Bunker Hill? USS Constitution? What doesnt make sense? Other than plot holes or retcons?

I know which things dont make sense, and I hate the game all the more for it. But those quests are small enough that I can still enjoy the game. Not everything in the originals was gold.

In my opinion being written better than Fallout 3 or Skyrim is a measly achievement comparable to the likes of shitting a turd more comfortably Crafting lore, to me is inconsequential, if its not crafted well and particularly when the actual storyline and quest storylines are even more shoddily written. Also it cannot be more like the originals as there is nothing in the form of C&C (actual roleplaying) with only a vestigial, desecrated corpse of it remaining by the wayside, at best The institute to me is completely bananas motives wise and i think Beth likes it that way Also my heart breaks when looking at the poor, poor Super Mutants, reduced to Pokemon encounters The BOS was serviceable i guess (epic intro - i guess Beth looks up to Hollywood for storylines)
I personally preferred Fallout 3 to 4 (however refer to my starting analogy) as at least it tried to do C&C (in sidequests) and you can almost see the sweat stains from all those shitty writers trying to implement some C&C in their shitty storylines Felt like high-school project C&C However the main storyline was abysmal (allow me though to say that i actually enjoyed the intro - only part) and yes maybe Fallout 4's wasn't as abysmal (and it wasn't) but at best it can be described as adequate(and thats a best case). However the lack of C&C (even greater) combined with the illusion of C&C (VERY BAD! and breaks consumer trust) and the severely increased focus on shooting (hate ceaseless action) plunges the whole experience, for me, into worse depths than fallout 3.
Again though i must say that my story standards are greater than yours (all you want as stated is lulzy fun - which i believe they also under delivered but thats another discussion) so i guess we'll have to agree to disagree since your not even looking for anything great story-wise

Considering the stuff I like and hail as the greatest things ever, I highly doubt that your standards are that much higher. You might just be looking for other things. I have never stated that all I want is lulzy fun, I like more intellectual stuff. If i wanted lulzy fun I would be on a just cause forum. But I can still enjooy lulzy fun, cant I? That said, Fallout 3 has very little story, and what story it has gets thrown out of the window the moment enclave storm the purifier. Fallout 4 has a story all the way through. For you to determine decisevely what my story standards are... well admittedly i find it ignorant, arrogant and offensive, not that I am offended but you can have more tact about your phrasing.

Super Mutants, yeah man.... they have been scary presence in Fallout 3, and a great part of the west coast. Fallout 4 yeah they are pokemon, they are this annoying dog pokemon in the bushes at the beginning of the game.

Dude i may come off as arrogant but in my opinion few games (in the history of games) even pass the good storyline mark (from my experience of course - i havent played all games ever). Im comparing to basic literature - good literature would make F4 implode - deal with it). To me (always my opinion no need to get alarmed that i find your taste in storylines shit:p it doesnt matter) Just Cause doesnt even qualify as having a story Of course you can enjoy lulzy fun whats with everyones goddamn chip on their shoulders Also the mark of a good storyline is not a storyline that goes all the way through (your melting my brain here).

Those are my standards, im not asking you to adopt them Also i might be looking for other things? What passive aggressiveness is this and what does it mean i was looking at the storyline Also man intellectual stuff in Fallout 4 i hope you dont tell that stuff to your girlfriend

 

[Jubal Quintus]

Which is actually fairly nonsensical, since physically backed monetary systems haven't been a thing in the U.S. for decades now, let alone by the times the bomb dropped in 2077.

The idea that everyone would go back to using such a system, when the reason why it was dropped was because there simply isn't enough of any precious resource to back a large scale economy that way, especially when we consider the fact the Fallout world went through that thing called "The Resource Wars", which resulted from nearly all of earth's precious resources being used up, meaning there was even less of things to back money with, only shows that the people of the west coast either had no understanding of how economics works, or are simply just complete morons who don't care.

Realistically, people would establish a monetary system like they had before the war. A fiat economy based on the people understanding the fact that they need a monetary system to trade on the large scale, due to the proven failings of the barter system, and the understanding that theres not enough of any single resource to realistically back any sort of large scale economy using a physical item, along with the acceptance that caps are worth as much as they are, along with the other quality that caps have that make them a good currency.(low weight, easy to carry, lots of them around, not easily reproduced, etc. etc.)

The fact that by the time of NV the NCR has switched to a fiat based economy shows that even they eventually realized it was the smarter idea. It only took nearly 200 years after the people on the east coast realized this, and the BoS destroying what little gold supply they had, but hey, no better time then the present to catch up!

Well considering that here, in this day and age, there is a fairly sizable group of the US American voting public that would like to go back to the gold standard, I don't find it that big of a stretch. As for the precious resource that was backing the cap, it was water. In a desert that's a pretty obvious choice. Further, the wasteland of Fallout 1 is a land on the verge of becoming a nation-state. These few scattered villages and towns are just stepping out of the isolation that they were forged in, so there is a degree of homogenizing that taking place and is further examined in Fallout 2. With full experience of our world and the endless access to knowledge provided by the internet it's easy for us to say what is or isn't a bad idea, but when you consider the circumstances and limited access to information that the wastelanders had it's easy to see why they choose what they did; additionally, it's a very easy concept to explain to Joe McDirt Farmer in Shady Sands who might otherwise balk at the idea of a currency.

 

[omegaspruz]

What? Of course, yes. Books, Movies, theatre are miles better than most game storylines. What are you talking about? But we are discussing video games at the moment, mr smartass.

But I am more than happy to debate literature and how shit it has progressively become.

 

[GeorgieBest]

What? Of course, yes. Books, Movies, theatre are miles better than most game storylines. What are you talking about? But we are discussing video games at the moment, mr smartass.

But I am more than happy to debate literature and how shit it has progressively become.

Well sorry good sir allow me to change my standards to suit your argument I wish for games with good storylines so i compare them to something good (is that mindblowing to you). Even compared to Red Dead one of the few recent games i can think that has a good storyline and script (for videogames remember..you like that) Fallout 4 feels like a parody play

Also for anyone capable of debating literature, calling fallout 4 intellectual stuff is a severe faux-pas

PS. Other "recent" games i've played I think have good storylines: 1@Bioshock (faulters a bit in the end but FORGIVEN)
2@Metal Gear Solid 1 to 3 (yes some wacky weird stuff as only fabled Japanese scholars can provide BUT some strong themes and good story parts in all three games especially and we may start a fight over it MGS 2 (yes i didn't like the arm who in his right mind would! Yet some of the other parts were so ambitious in what they were trying to say (for videogames of course) that FORGIVEN)
3@ Gta 5 (well better than Fallout 3 or 4 for sure - stylish is a word for it better than fallout 3 and 4 because the script at least possesses some lines of levity and for a game centered around setpieces the setpieces actually deliver (mostly) No serious substance to it but doesn't overreach and delivers style and wit at points thus FORGIVEN.
4@ Assassins Creed 2 ( 1 doesn't count because the actual game is so abysmal your only playing for the story after a point. Probably overreaching at this point yeah scrap that i wanted ass 1 story in ass 2 - ASS 2 NOT FORGIVEN)
5@ L.A. Noir it was a bit of a hackjob from L.A. confidential (and again the book remains unread) the storyline and characters though were solid (but why so much time spent on a serial killer we knew was framing people) thus FORGIVEN.
6@ Batman Arkham City: much easier to do of course as it's based on comics (not exactly the masters of literature, although Batman does have a few good stories under his belt) but again some admiration should be given to the slavish attention and care Rocksteady put into layering the lore of Batman into the story and world and making a narrative with a bang-on the-bucks ending.
7@ Witcher 2 (definitely better than Fallout 3&4's story - can't be bothered to explain why try it. Haven't played witcher 3 yet)
8@ Fallout New Vegas - my problems with this lie mainly in the goddamn engine, graphics, atmosphere which were honestly sub-par the day they came out - i stress non-storyline reasons because yes like Ass 1 was disqualified, if something else is extremely bad in a game it drags the story down as well (they are One). I think that for some it may just be impossible to play (characters look horrid - note - not just badly done but physically repulsive) The story has quite a few strong points ( particulartly NCR which i guess is closer to home) and i liked House was intrigued and wanted more (testament to good writing) Stuff like the Legion saying they train in unarmed combat so so much cause firearms fail (duh!) when they're going to war with an armed army yeah no comment but at least the Legion assassins have firearms when you fight them (pretty good ones too) so i'll try to excuse the derp Caesar's shit on dialectics too, duuude ease up on the corn, but i guess it could be in character since he has a tumour and all:p Main problem i see is over expansion and some lack in deliverance (perhaps needed more time to refine it) but the average dialogue script and C&C interactive-dialogue in NV pisses all over Fallout 3&4 and shits on their graves You can rest assured that intelligence options Will actually be intelligence options (and thats a damn fine stamp of quality assurance in my books) Therefore yes New Vegas, with a successful attempt at presenting an ethics-ridden, radiation-raped, post-nuclear wasteland and score some maturity points over the story and quest-narration of its towns and inhabitants, and although bogged down by an insanely shitty engine, does,imo, pass the mark. I truly wish though that it had at least an average-length development time and made on a non-shit engine - i think it would have probably been really really good.

So yeah these are just 10 recent games off the top of my head (although it definitely took longer than that to write) that have a considerably better storyline than Fallout 4 (and i mean considerably) and are of course not Just Cause. I only wish more Rpgs were in there (as thats why i like them) but when i think of the likes of Fable and the such my stomach starts churning wildly and i have to stop. Sorry for the wall of text and if you've been studious or bored enough to reach this part i hope you enjoyed it just wanted to make my point that some games do have a good storyline (yes they could be better - everything can be better - at least these pass) and good storylines shouldn't go unnoticed or bunched up with all the others just because they are videogame storylines. Videogames deserve better

 

[omegaspruz]

What? Of course, yes. Books, Movies, theatre are miles better than most game storylines. What are you talking about? But we are discussing video games at the moment, mr smartass.

But I am more than happy to debate literature and how shit it has progressively become.

Well sorry good sir allow me to change my standards to suit your argument I wish for games with good storylines so i compare them to something good (is that mindblowing to you). Even compared to Red Dead one of the few recent games i can think that has a good storyline and script (for videogames remember..you like that) Fallout 4 feels like a parody play

Also for anyone capable of debating literature, calling fallout 4 intellectual stuff is a severe faux-pas

Wow I may get a lot of shit for it, but dude for someone who reads a lot, you definately have no idea how to read properly. Didnt come of as bad as I though. I do hate arrogance just so you know. Never have I said that Fallout 4 is be all of everything. Not once, nor do I think so. But if you play the game, listen to the dialogue and connect the dots its not Just Cause, its better than Fallout 3, its better than a lot things. But people love to hate it, and I am here trying to balance out the scales so to speak. It deserves a chance. Why do I even bother? I have insomnia thats why.

I also enjoy writing on the side, and knowing how hard it is to put a working story together, the writers no matter how bad they are, have my sympathies. So while Kid in the fridge, talking about fallout 4, is unacceptable, some blanks in the institute can be overlooked for my enjoyment, but should be pointed to Bethesda to improve in the subsequent installment. But why am I telling you this, youd think they are shit as well. Oh, right I still have insomnia.

What I said, not that you know how to read, was this:

"I know which things dont make sense, and I hate the game all the more for it. But those quests are small enough that I can still enjoy the game."

 

[GeorgieBest]

What? Of course, yes. Books, Movies, theatre are miles better than most game storylines. What are you talking about? But we are discussing video games at the moment, mr smartass.

But I am more than happy to debate literature and how shit it has progressively become.

Well sorry good sir allow me to change my standards to suit your argument I wish for games with good storylines so i compare them to something good (is that mindblowing to you). Even compared to Red Dead one of the few recent games i can think that has a good storyline and script (for videogames remember..you like that) Fallout 4 feels like a parody play

Also for anyone capable of debating literature, calling fallout 4 intellectual stuff is a severe faux-pas

Wow I may get a lot of shit for it, but dude for someone who reads a lot, you definately have no idea how to read properly. Didnt come of as bad as I though. I do hate arrogance just so you know. Never have I said that Fallout 4 is be all of everything. Not once, nor do I think so. But if you play the game, listen to the dialogue and connect the dots its not Just Cause, its better than Fallout 3, its better than a lot things. But people love to hate it, and I am here trying to balance out the scales so to speak. It deserves a chance. Why do I even bother? I have insomnia thats why.

What I said, not that you know how to read, was this:

"I know which things dont make sense, and I hate the game all the more for it. But those quests are small enough that I can still enjoy the game."

Well done man, yes its not just cause Dude just one question? What are you actually doing? Balancing the scales? What does that mean..how old are you? You share your opinions in a forum your not here to balance any scales dude..do u think your Batman mate
Ps. Batman would never save Bethesda

Also man yes cool thats your opinion and this is mine..what exactly makes you so mad that my opinion isnt yours

Ps. Who said you did? You know for someone with such advanced reading comprehension tskk tskk Did i say you think Fallout 4 is our omniscient Lord and Father Nope must be your imagination Do you think intellectual stuff=GOD? i dont know it scares me
As a fun game lets lists all those things fallout 4 is better than

 

[omegaspruz]

No you make me mad with your arrogance and inability to read correctly. But you are right, a troll like you shouldnt get any more attention than you already got. Have a good day.

 

[GeorgieBest]

No you make me mad with your arrogance and inability to read correctly. But you are right, a troll like you shouldnt get any more attention than you already got. Have a good day.

This is what you regress into Nice

RUN FOREST RUNNNNNN!!!

My God they break so easily you'd think they were made of foufou

 

[GeorgieBest]

What? Of course, yes. Books, Movies, theatre are miles better than most game storylines. What are you talking about? But we are discussing video games at the moment, mr smartass.

But I am more than happy to debate literature and how shit it has progressively become.

Well sorry good sir allow me to change my standards to suit your argument I wish for games with good storylines so i compare them to something good (is that mindblowing to you). Even compared to Red Dead one of the few recent games i can think that has a good storyline and script (for videogames remember..you like that) Fallout 4 feels like a parody play

Also for anyone capable of debating literature, calling fallout 4 intellectual stuff is a severe faux-pas

Wow I may get a lot of shit for it, but dude for someone who reads a lot, you definately have no idea how to read properly. Didnt come of as bad as I though. I do hate arrogance just so you know. Never have I said that Fallout 4 is be all of everything. Not once, nor do I think so. But if you play the game, listen to the dialogue and connect the dots its not Just Cause, its better than Fallout 3, its better than a lot things. But people love to hate it, and I am here trying to balance out the scales so to speak. It deserves a chance. Why do I even bother? I have insomnia thats why.

I also enjoy writing on the side, and knowing how hard it is to put a working story together, the writers no matter how bad they are, have my sympathies. So while Kid in the fridge, talking about fallout 4, is unacceptable, some blanks in the institute can be overlooked for my enjoyment, but should be pointed to Bethesda to improve in the subsequent installment. But why am I telling you this, youd think they are shit as well. Oh, right I still have insomnia.

What I said, not that you know how to read, was this:

"I know which things dont make sense, and I hate the game all the more for it. But those quests are small enough that I can still enjoy the game."

Also, sorry, but to beat on a dead horse, for clarification's sake, that paragraph is completely bo**ocks to anyone who's actually read a book in the past ten years. As i said previously basic, popular literature (not everything before you harp about twilight but a lot) is volumes better than fallout 4's story which to be frank isn't a story but a series of set pieces for the quest designs they thought up (it is remarkably clear that story writing was left on the back-burner). Some improvements in characters (i'd say that's where their best effort is). But writing stories is not the insurmountable road to Nirvana, it is a task millions of people do, and there are many basic guidelines/structures to learn/follow/adapt/refine (Provided you have the idea/theme/story/concept in the first place) IT is not the hardest thing in the universe and writers shouldn't be held on special pedestals because they tried their damnest (any human being deserves decency im discussing their work here). My conclusion: they just did not prioritize on a good story like at all (and this blame does not fall on the writers whoever they are)

Also when someone says that if they wanted lulzy stuff they'd be on the just cause forum, but NO they like intellectual stuff, and so are in the fallout 4 forum, does that mean they consider fallout 4's story intellectual? (remember it goes all the way through) Riddle me this, great purveyors of Logic

 

[GingerSwanGNR]

Quantity > Quality I guess.

Bethesda, delivering fast-food-gaming since the 1990s.

tbh, Morrowind was fantastic. Their good writers like Kirkbride left, and now we're stuck with Emil Paerfwertnio or whatever his name is

 

[Crni Vuk]

To be fair though, Morrowind was barely more RPG than Oblivion or Skyrim. The oportunities for role playing and decision making was not higher compared to the Elder Scroll games which followed Morrowind. And some say, it actually contained even less of role playing than previous TESO games. But I can't comment on that, since Morrowind was my first Bethesda game ever.
The redeeming fact of Morrowind however, is the great freedom you have within the world. It contains without a doubt more depth than anything Beth has done after Morrowind. It also contains a lot fewer limitations and much less railroading compared to Oblivion and Skyrim. And they created a more believable setting. All of the factions, areas and towns actually feel like they have a purpose. Like it belongs to the world. That you have some kind of economy, social and political system in the background. Which, yeah, came from the fact that Morrowind had in general better writing. Even though the Wiki-style dialog could be exhausting. But I would take that any day over Skyrims oneliners or Fallout 4s dialog wheel.
But it was still all just on the surface. An Illusion just like Oblivion and Skyrim. But like said, it did a better job at convincing you to be in a coherent world with it's own rules. Oblivion and even more Skyrim, are designed as theme parks with different kinds of amusements, which are often enough not even directly conected to each other.
If I had to pick between Morrowind, Oblivion and Skyrim, which game was more memorable. Then I would definetly pick Morrowind. But despite of the many great qualities the game has, at the end of the day, it is still a rather mediocre RPG. When you consider choices & concequences and role playing a strong part of RPGs. While you can choin factions in Morrowind, the world itself doesn't really give you any way to actually play the role of a thiev, warrior, wizard, merchant, priest etc. you get the picture. You're always just "the" adventure of some sort.

 

[Vergil]

the world itself doesn't really give you any way to actually play the role of a thiev, warrior, wizard, merchant, priest etc. you get the picture. You're always just "the" adventure of some sort.

You can be born under the thief sign, level up thief related skills and join a guild of thieves or just be a general burglarer and break in and steal from people's houses.

You can also do the same for the couple of magic related birthsigns and then decide what disciplines of magic you want to train in and then join either the Mages Guild or House Telvanni

With the Warrior you have the related birthsign and skills and then theres the Fighter's Guild, The Imperial Legion or the other two great houses you can choose from to continue down the path of being a warrior whether its a member of a great house, a Fighter's Guild merc or an Imperial soldier.

Merchant-wise you have the speechcraft and mercantilism skills and a haggling system. You can buy and sell across the island of Vvardenfell for profit. Sure you can't open up a shop but you can be a traveling merchant if you want to.

As a priest you have either the Imperial Church you can join or you can join the Tribunal Temple. I've never done the Imperial Church but I know for a fact that becomming a member of the Temple of the Tribunal you go through a lot of very interesting lore and make pilgrimages to places like an actual member of the faith would.

Morrowind has loads of Roleplaying options available to you complete with diverse factions, quests, skills and relationships between those factions.

 

[ZigzagPX4]

Yahtzee discussed the difference between Deus Ex and Deus Ex: Human Revolution once - the former is an action RPG, and the latter is an action game with RPG elements. The same evolution has happened with The Elder Scrolls, from Morrowind to Skyrim.

But I've never gotten the impression that Morrowind was supposed to be a fully-fledged RPG. It was always about the world and interacting with it, exploring with it, and getting it to react to you.

 

[Ragemage]

This really reminds me of New Vegas's ending slides. I wish the game had actually had something like this rather than the schlock we got. Good job.

I must say though, you thought Fallout 4 had better writing than Fallout 3? I'm sorry but I have to find that a little laughable. Is Fallout 3's writing bad? Oh absolutely. Is it full of plot holes and inconsistencies? You betcha! But for every plot hole Fallout 3 had, Fallout 4 has 2 more. The plot of Fallout 4 makes literally no sense and is so contrived and convoluted that by the time I finished the game my head was reeling with how much made no sense. Kellog's non-aging technology never being used again, the fact that this technological society of people has had 200 years to make literally anything they wanted and yet somehow still hasn't come up with a cure for cancer despite the fact they made teleportation, the reason why Super Mutants patrol the Commonwealth (I know why but I'm trying to avoid spoilers here), Virgil's magical mystery cure and why that dumbass didn't use that cure to make more rather than wasting the only dose he had on himself, etc etc etc etc.

Just too many to go on. I could probably make 3-4 paragraphs just naming plot holes, let alone what's wrong with each plot hole. Fallout 3's only main quest plotholes were how the water purifier worked, how Eden's plan made no sense, and how Colonel Autumn was a complete idiot when it came to handling the protagonist.

 

[Ragemage]

You can be born under the thief sign, level up thief related skills and join a guild of thieves or just be a general burglarer and break in and steal from people's houses.

You can also do the same for the couple of magic related birthsigns and then decide what disciplines of magic you want to train in and then join either the Mages Guild or House Telvanni

With the Warrior you have the related birthsign and skills and then theres the Fighter's Guild, The Imperial Legion or the other two great houses you can choose from to continue down the path of being a warrior whether its a member of a great house, a Fighter's Guild merc or an Imperial soldier.

Merchant-wise you have the speechcraft and mercantilism skills and a haggling system. You can buy and sell across the island of Vvardenfell for profit. Sure you can't open up a shop but you can be a traveling merchant if you want to.

As a priest you have either the Imperial Church you can join or you can join the Tribunal Temple. I've never done the Imperial Church but I know for a fact that becomming a member of the Temple of the Tribunal you go through a lot of very interesting lore and make pilgrimages to places like an actual member of the faith would.

Morrowind has loads of Roleplaying options available to you complete with diverse factions, quests, skills and relationships between those factions.

Ah Morrowind, my one true love. Such an amazing roleplaying game, back when Bethesda knew what they were doing. It's so sad to me really. They started out with perfection, Morrowind was everything an RPG should be. Skills that mattered, skill checks, many different factions you can join and slowly work your way through the ranks in rather than becoming the leader after 3 missions (I remember the Thieves Guild alone in Morrowind took at least 20-30 missions before you became their leader) The fact that everyone is killable and no one is marked essential, even main quest givers. And if you do kill a main quest giver, you can continue with the story through a secret back route. Let's not forget the Great Houses, who really help affect what kind of character you're going to make. Or you can just avoid the Great Houses all together and do your own thing without them. You can join a religious organization or not, the choice is really entirely up to the player as to what they want to be, and it's fantastic. I don't know how they went from one of the best RPGs out there (it's my personal favorite next to Dragon Age Origins and New Vegas) to *shudders* Fallout 4.