IGN Fallout 3: Six Hours of Exploration

[Beelzebud]

Re: Stop - STOP - Stop, Stop If You've Heard / Seen This Bef

Wander off into the isometrically rendered wastelands, into uncertainty, facing only a sunset seen in long shadows and the nuclear-green tint of the light...?

The moment that the naive Vault Dweller finally recognises that, for all of his travails in the 3D world, there was never going to be a true dawn for him; that the promised future was simply a myth, a lie, comfort for children.

LOL wow! Borderline brilliant.

 

[Ureshi]

Not to go on too long...but if players do see a boundary (like a fallen building), they may think that the map COULD go on, and will waste time trying to find a way around it, only to be frustrated. An invisible wall is much more direct, and allows the player to go back to enjoying the game instead of searching for a way through in vain.

Which sounds extremely patronizing, and slightly incredible.

Map boundaries are are a feature of almost every game in some form or another, and as such are familiar and intuitive to anybody who has played games. Invisible walls are a lazy substitute for design, and especially so with a world of credible hazards and boundaries inherently available within a nuclear-decimated landscape. I think it is a much more parsimonious explanation to suggest that this is simply another poor design choice which demonstrates that Bethesda's initial decision to implement a first-person perspective was as much to do with recycling Oblivion technology and expertise and appealing to a new market, as it was to do with any sanctified philosophy of immersion.

Still, accepting your premise that this is a pragmatic choice made on the basis that their target audience is unable to cope with the minor frustration of having to expend time to discover boundaries, it would suggest that the intellectual bankruptcy of the game is complete. This must, then, be a game for ritalin-munching half-wits who have been cursed with the twin misfortunes of both ADHD and near-terminal idiocy.

Either way, it is indicative of devaluation of the Fallout brand, and especially so when considered alongside the other discontinuous designs and disregard for lore and setting.

I am still optimistic that there is a reasonably passable game to be had in Fallout 3, but I am very sure that it will be an extremely pale shadow of the original games. Almost every new story details a further step away from greatness, and indicates that the game is likely to attain only over-hyped mediocrity, at best. What a shame if something so ordinary should bear such an extraordinary name.

Agreed 100%


Offtopic:

LOL wow! Borderline brilliant.

borderline lol

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[Zeld]

I still remember how stupid it felt when you first time walked into invisible wall, with text: "You cannot go any further" appearing on corner of the screen.... And they still got nerve to talk about "immersion". Here's immersion for you, Beth. Pull your head out of your ass and see how different world really is. In real world there ain't boundaries like sigmoid colon and stuff.

 

[ArmorB]

I still remember how stupid it felt when you first time walked into invisible wall, with text: "You cannot go any further" appearing on corner of the screen.... And they still got nerve to talk about "immersion". Here's immersion for you, Beth. Pull your head out of your ass and see how different world really is. In real world there ain't boundaries like sigmoid colon and stuff.

LOL the first ime for me I was sliding down a hill and then 'thud'. I had to jump along the wall for a while before I could get back out of the invisible wall/hillside trap...

 

[shihonage]

Now, 10 tones, even though weak in comparison to most nuclear weapons, has the same explosive potential as the most powerful conventional weapon - The Moab[...]

Of course bending the physics in even the more serious games, is usualy necessary due to various limitations, but in this Fatman case it's blidingly obvious and laughable. Not only that you can launch it from ten meters away and live (which is a potentially life threatening distance even for simple grenades) it also creates a silly mini mushroom cloud, which disolves in a few seconds. It's basicaly a simple rocket launcher juiced up with a nuclear theme[...]

Still, accepting your premise that this is a pragmatic choice made on the basis that their target audience is unable to cope with the minor frustration of having to expend time to discover boundaries, it would suggest that the intellectual bankruptcy of the game is complete. This must, then, be a game for ritalin-munching half-wits who have been cursed with the twin misfortunes of both ADHD and near-terminal idiocy.

These posts made my day.

This possibly implies that I have no life, but I don't care.

 

[mandrake776]

I still remember how stupid it felt when you first time walked into invisible wall, with text: "You cannot go any further" appearing on corner of the screen.... And they still got nerve to talk about "immersion". Here's immersion for you, Beth. Pull your head out of your ass and see how different world really is. In real world there ain't boundaries like sigmoid colon and stuff.

Really? I just went "Oh, ok. That's the edge of the map."

 

[TheGM]

I still remember how stupid it felt when you first time walked into invisible wall, with text: "You cannot go any further" appearing on corner of the screen.... And they still got nerve to talk about "immersion". Here's immersion for you, Beth. Pull your head out of your ass and see how different world really is. In real world there ain't boundaries like sigmoid colon and stuff.

Really? I just went "Oh, ok. That's the edge of the map."

I know right. I guess it is time to turn back.

 

[Per]

Really? I just went "Oh, ok. That's the edge of the map."

That's perfectly reasonable. And yet when speaking on the relationship between graphics and immersion, for instance, being able to go "Oh, OK, that 4-pixel conglomerate is a chair" is laughed off by a number of people.

Wasteland had both chunky chairs and invisible walls on the world map.

 

[mandrake776]

Really? I just went "Oh, ok. That's the edge of the map."

That's perfectly reasonable. And yet when speaking on the relationship between graphics and immersion, for instance, being able to go "Oh, OK, that 4-pixel conglomerate is a chair" is laughed off by a number of people.

Wasteland had both chunky chairs and invisible walls on the world map.

Bunch of pedants. You know you're playing a game. The only games that can get away with the entire game map being limited like that are extremely linear games. Fallout had nothing beyond the map, Warhawk has "damage zones" and I think those are all acceptable choices. Honestly I'm more ok with the idea that this is as far as I can go in a game rather than having the entire game world exist in valleys or on islands.

 

[HoKa]

Ahh. The joys of FPS immersion.

 

[Humpsalot]

so this guy played for SIX hours and the only thing new he found out was that a huge naval ship is used for shelter and people don't like Roy Phillips?

Im trying to remain hopeful and this is what you give me?

I could have told you that there was going to be people in that ship and Roy Phillips is not well accepted.

 

[Jiggly McNerdington]

Tell you what would be a good mod if/when they release the toolset. Change it to say "You must gather your party before venturing forth".

 

[aenemic]

so this guy played for SIX hours and the only thing new he found out was that a huge naval ship is used for shelter and people don't like Roy Phillips?

Im trying to remain hopeful and this is what you give me?

I could have told you that there was going to be people in that ship and Roy Phillips is not well accepted.

in what way is this bad? sure, would be interesting with even more information. but what this proves is simply that the game is huge and that there's a lot to do and lot of different ways to go.

the best information we got from this article imo is that the area he went through to get to Rivet City was damn hard with lots of high level enemies. no level scaling here at least.

 

[Bernard Bumner]

Bunch of pedants. You know you're playing a game. The only games that can get away with the entire game map being limited like that are extremely linear games. Fallout had nothing beyond the map, Warhawk has "damage zones" and I think those are all acceptable choices. Honestly I'm more ok with the idea that this is as far as I can go in a game rather than having the entire game world exist in valleys or on islands.

But the argument isn't actually about suspension of disbelief, it is about the hypocrisy or inconsistency of Bethesda making appeals that a first-person perspective is required for immersion into the game world whilst simultaneously implementing the clumsiest and most intrusive form of map boundaries possible. Having said that, there clearly is also a problem with delivering such a poor piece of design.

It cuts the heart of, a) the veracity of their statements about the perspective change; b) their ability to implement their stated design philosophy as characterized by that change; c) their ability to deliver basic, decent, believable level design.

Taking away the Fallout epithet for a moment, and making an objective, even pragmatic, assessment. Does this kind of clumsy design sound like the best solution? Okay, I realise that there is an element of ...and when did you stop beating your wife? in that question, but it isn't as though a more satisfactory implementation is beyond the realms of technology.

As with so many other design decisions, it seems to be a bit of a botch. Not only that, but it seems to fit very well the characterization of Bethesda as promising one thing, but delivering another - all mouth and no trousers.

If you promise the world but deliver only a malformed planetoid, then you have failed. On your own terms.

 

[sai | GLYPH]

so this guy played for SIX hours and the only thing new he found out was that a huge naval ship is used for shelter and people don't like Roy Phillips?

but what this proves is simply that the game is huge and that there's a lot to do and lot of different ways to go.

Actually it indicates the opposite if... in 6 hours of gameplay, this preview allegedly offers little in the way of new material. It indicates
...that actual role playing may be very linear, as this preview largely retraces the same old things, and that the game may lack in variety.

 

[Wazza]

All these issues.


And yet...


It'll still sell like hotcakes because it was made by Bethesda/looks like Oblivion with guns/you play with nukes/etc. In other words - all the little kiddies who're going to want it purely because it was nearly banned in some certain countries.

And so potentially ends the glorious reputation built up by the first two instalments in one swift stroke. Bloody depressing.

The nuke catapault is reminding me of the "Seriously, WTF are you doing with the series?!?" grumble that I had when I saw that slap-in-the-face bulldust movie Starship Troopers. Anyone who's read the books and saw it would've done a double-take when they saw A NUCLEAR GRENADE being used. Similar thing's happening right here it seems.

If anyone gets hold of modding tools, or improvises from existing ones... please, I'm begging you - change the damn thing. I'd accept a fricking Cow Pattie Launcher over this thing right about now...

 

[thefalloutfan]

All these issues.


And yet...


It'll still sell like hotcakes because it was made by Bethesda/looks like Oblivion with guns/you play with nukes/etc. In other words - all the little kiddies who're going to want it purely because it was nearly banned in some certain countries.

Or maybe, just maybe, there are people who just want to play a damn game after work without being so philosophical about gaming?

 

[Ureshi]

All these issues.


And yet...


It'll still sell like hotcakes because it was made by Bethesda/looks like Oblivion with guns/you play with nukes/etc. In other words - all the little kiddies who're going to want it purely because it was nearly banned in some certain countries.

Or maybe, just maybe, there are people who just want to play a damn game after work without being so philosophical about gaming?

No, thank you.

 

[thefalloutfan]

Too bad, that's me.

 

[Buxbaum666]

Or maybe, just maybe, there are people who just want to play a damn game after work without being so philosophical about gaming?

Isn't that what shooters and arcade-style games are for? I don't see a place for RPGs there. Oh, wait, we're talking Fallout 3...