Microsoft has bought Zenimax/Bethesda

[Jabberwok]

I honestly utterly despise Bethesda worlds since Oblivion and never got the appeal of them. A large chunk of the locations in their world is copy and pasted dungeons with a random assortment of enemies filled to the brim with their overused to shit enviromental storytellin bullshit, or locations that might as well be living on their own bubble because locations like these in Bethesda games don't even acknowledge each other's existence.

Several New Vegas locations are definitely filler to fill the map, not having much of importance in them, but at least it doesn't have copy and pasted dungeons, or locations not acknowledging each other's existence. In fact, the game goes out its way to make locations acknowledge each other, at least ones close to each other like Sloan and Quarry Junction and Novac and that power plant with the ghouls.

It's like people have to find anything to praise Bethesda games for and since the writing and characters are so terrible, they have to trick themselves into thinking their world design is actually good, and not just a theme park with a random assortment of locations.

So no, i don't want a Fallout game with the world design of Bethesda, get that shit out of my Fallout game. I want a cohesive world with locations that look like they weren't made in random location creater program.

Agree. Oblivion had the advantage of some decent-sized cities with different architectural styles. And different climates across the map. Outside of that, still a bunch of random junk, and recycled dungeon assets. Seems like Skyrim scaled back on the cities in favor of even more random dungeons. Let's make a huge, open worldspace the defining part of our game, but put most of our gameplay in tiny rooms that all look the same.

 

[Mr Fish]

Skyrim's improvement over Oblivion isn't that earth-shattering, not even for its time so part of me think that they needed to squeeze as much hype as they could into it and so what would impress people? You like dungeons? Well we got dungeons and then... More dungeons! Twice the dungeons, twice the fun! Fallout 4 is the only Bethesda game who's world design I've actually liked. Fallout 3 was too drab and filled with the same stuff copy pasted. Oblivion was just a giant forest with some ruins here and there. Morrowind has not aged well at all. Deus Ex is comparable in graphical fidelity and I love its art design despite being so old but Morrowind is just straight up ugly and I will not accept mods as an excuse to this. And finally Skyrim. More varied than before, but pretty much just more forest with some snowy areas and tundra here and there. So either empty land or foresty land. Joy.

Fallout 4's world on the other hand is pretty varied. From the coastal line to the inner parts of boston to the flooded district to the west to the swamps down south to the glowing sea south-west. And a lot of dungeons actually have something to make them stand out from one another. I can memorize the world and actually know where I'm heading. So that's the one time I think they've done a world well.

 

[Gizmojunk]

Morrowind is just straight up ugly and I will not accept mods as an excuse to this.

There is nothing in mods that the studio could not have done, but they design for the state of the platform. Graphical mods rely on high(er)-end machines to render the game at a playable speed; so I will accept mods as a nice retro-fit.... like having a Garmin and satellite radio in a Ford Model-T.

*Fallout [team] was seriously considering a polygonal 3D engine... they just could not get it to run comfortably on the consumer desktops of the day. Had they done so... we might have seen Fallout go the way of Decent to Undermountain, but also perhaps have had mod-able 3D assets.

 

[Morgan_]

They should just buy Larian Studios while they're at it. Would be neat to see what direction they go in if they did a Fallout.

 

[gustarballs1983]

So does it literraly mean that Tim Cain & Brian Fargo will now have acces to Fallout IP back? Thank-You very much Bill G.

 

[Jabberwok]

They should just buy Larian Studios while they're at it. Would be neat to see what direction they go in if they did a Fallout.

Ugh, please no. I would rather not have the entire RPG industry owned by a single publisher. In fact, I would prefer for Larian to work on their own IP, not be yet another factory for someone else's. Besides, Larian at its best is zany, and Fallout at its best is low on the zane scale.

 

[Morgan_]

Fallout: Battle Royale

They even have a building mechanic.

 

[RangerBoo]

When people say Bethesda makes good worlds what they actually mean is "it's like I always have a new location to kill people at!".

Bethesda's world design philosophy is completely at odds with what Fallout is.

Pretty much this. While Bethesda worlds are large a lot of their locations feel like theme parks or road side attractions meant to distract the player. A lot of the locations are memorable due to how nonsensical they are. Dunwich, Megaton, Little Lamplight. All of them are nonsensical and just feel like a road side attraction. In contrast to New Vegas where a lot of the locations are memorable due to the characters, quests and happenings of the surrounding area. Goodsprings was memorable as not only was it the town you start the game in but also becuase of the conflict going on between the Powder Gangers and the towns and settlements surrounding the NCRCF such as Goodsprings. Nipton was memorable as it was, for many of us, our first encounter with the Legion. RepConn was memorable due to the Bright Brotherhood and the Nightkin. It was also the first instance for many of us where we realize that the Nightkin may not be right in the head.

I don't know about the rest of you but I rather take a small world where there are locations that make sense for the world and setting then a large world filled with filler and nonsensical bullshit.

 

[Atomic Postman]

The distinction for me has always been that in a vacuum of writing, Bethesda's worlds are better. The Capital Wasteland and The Commonwealth are more enjoyable to traverse than the Mojave. Bethesda is good at putting 10-15 minute exploration loops in their world, but the issue is of course is that is literally all there is. I distinctly remember enjoying the minute to minute lonely wandering and picking over ruins in Fallout 3, but feeling nails start pressing into my frontal lobe whenever there was any written content.

Conversely, walking the Mojave in Vegas felt like an arduous chore. Empty walking between my destinations (which I really wanted to get to and enjoyed) so I could speed over to the next faction or questline.

I'd prefer the latter over the former every single time but the most obvious and empty platitude is that the ideal would be a combo of both. I'd say you could make a fair argument that Appalachia from 76 is the best worldmap Fallout has ever had, but to be fully cooked it needs writing by Sawyer and Avellone

 

[.Pixote.]

We live in interesting times...Microsoft has done this all before, buy up studios, make them shit out games, the games flop, and the studios are killed off one by one. It would take a lot of flops to kill off some of these studios, but at the end of the day if the returns can't match the expectations then out comes the guillotine.

 

[JKRDU]

Fallout: Battle Royale

They even have a building mechanic.

They already have one, minus the building mechanics, but battle royale.

 

[Norzan]

Empty walking between my destinations

How is that any different than walking between destinations in Bethesda games? There's also a lot of nothing between locations in those games. And no, those shitty ruins with nothing in them don't count.

Or you any of those that perpetuate the retarded meme that the Mojave is somehow empty? Which is utter fucking bullshit i might add.

 

[KingArthur]

How is that any different than walking between destinations in Bethesda games? There's also a lot of nothing between locations in those games. And no, those shitty ruins with nothing in them don't count.

Or you any of those that perpetuate the retarded meme that the Mojave is somehow empty? Which is utter fucking bullshit i might add.

Patrolling the Mojave almost makes me notice the nine month time constraint.

 

[TheGM]

The Capital Wasteland and The Commonwealth are more enjoyable to traverse than the Mojave.

Or you any of those that perpetuate the retarded meme that the Mojave is somehow empty? Which is utter fucking bullshit i might add.

He's a known mindling contrarian and mistakes getting into a fight every 10 feet as you cross the endless amount of hills in Fallout 3 with it being an exciting experience. nothing says fun like another bullet sponge Albino Scorpion AMIRITE FOLKS!

 

[Morgan_]

FO4 was really good when first playing, but has very little replay value. The thing I disliked the most about FNV was the invisible walls. That shit did not fly.

 

[Gizmojunk]

My memories of NV are sniping ghouls from atop a small hut (rather like I used to do to enemies in Oblivion atop the columns in the arena), and whenever I would explore.... I would find that my PC had walked through one of the [many?] invisible holes in the map perimeter, and rarely be able to find the way back.

I also remember invisible collision meshes everywhere; under railings & banisters, and covering ant holes. I remember trying to burn out a hole, and instead set the PC on fire because the flames hit the invisible collision mesh at ground level; mines float on them. Can't shoot under the banisters, because the thin air is solid.

I once clicked on a cigarette on the floor by the bar. Doing that made the entire casino hostile.

 

[iridium_ionizer]

So would Awoken, TES 6 and whatever this AAA RPG from inXIle is, compete with each other?

Well actually, since they want people to go and subscribe to Game Pass they'd get access to all three of those games either way so I guess it doesn't matter on the xbox side of things. And I'm sure there's going to be differences between them to attract different crowds.

If anything changes in the content of those games as they are developed, I would think they would become MORE differentiated due to Microsoft's guidance. They will probably have release dates that are more spread out than would have happened without these acquisitions. But yeah, Microsoft doesn't need them all to become mega-hits they just need the games to be big enough that they continue to promote their X-Box / Windows PC ecosystems.

Exactly. Say what you will about Microsoft, even Halo after it went to shit was more “consumer ready” than Bethesda bugfests.

On the brighter side of things, the debacle that was Fallout 76 may have saved Microsoft $1 billion off the sticker price of Zenimax. But yeah, I would expect that while Microsoft may be a little hands off on the development end of things at first, the marketing for Bethesda games will probably get way streamlined and the QA/QC bug-testing will probably improve to at least industry standard.

We live in interesting times...Microsoft has done this all before, buy up studios, make them shit out games, the games flop, and the studios are killed off one by one. It would take a lot of flops to kill off some of these studios, but at the end of the day if the returns can't match the expectations then out comes the guillotine.

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mergers_and_acquisitions_by_Microsoft#Acquisitions, sort by Business, and find those in the Video Games category.

There was an initial buying spree of video game development companies at the beginning of the original X-Box life. Each one has a different story. Some of them like Bungie were able to buy themselves back at the end (minus their IP), but many of them languished and died. Hopefully Microsoft manages them (and fosters their talent) better this time.

 

[Mr Fish]

Conversely, walking the Mojave in Vegas felt like an arduous chore. Empty walking between my destinations (which I really wanted to get to and enjoyed) so I could speed over to the next faction or questline.

One of the main reasons why I don't play FNV much anymore. I would love to have a world map mode where I could just skip the bullshit.

 

[Atomic Postman]

How is that any different than walking between destinations in Bethesda games? There's also a lot of nothing between locations in those games. And no, those shitty ruins with nothing in them don't count.

Or you any of those that perpetuate the retarded meme that the Mojave is somehow empty? Which is utter fucking bullshit i might add.

If you had basic reading comprehension you'd understand the distinction I was making. The Mojave is full of worthwhile written content all over the place but it's seriously lacking for dungeons. The landscape primarily serves as connecting tissue for story content. Capital Wasteland and The Commonwealth basically only have the dungeon sequences that litter the landscape with zero worthwhile story content. I haven't played Fallout 4 since 2015 but my primary memories of that game were coming across ruins and doing the same fun but ultimately totally shallow explore/combat/loot loop that had started in Fallout 3, built on in Skyrim and gotten more mileage in 4, and after many hours coming across terrible thin strands of story content.

Because I'm sure you'll already be frothing at the mouth, of course the former is better than the latter but my entire point was that I wish we could marry the two types of world design. The Mojave was literally packed with worthwhile RPG content but I wish clearing Vault 34 or NCRCF was the same kind of fun skinner box dungeon sequence as clearing the multi-level automotive factory place in 4 or other places like that which might as well have existed in total vacuum story wise.

 

[Norzan]

Empty walking between my destinations

The Mojave is full of worthwhile written content all over the place but it's seriously lacking for dungeons.

Saying there's empty space between locations is NOT saying the game doesn't have enough dungeons.

If you had basic reading comprehension you'd understand the distinction I was making.

This is not the first time that you very poorly worded your argument. Don't say others don't have basic reading comprehension when you lay out your arguments like shit.



The problem of littering your world with dungeons is that it makes the world absolutely ridiculous. How many broken power plants, supermarkets and other broken buildings can a single region have? It's absolute nonsense. It also makes the dungeons start to blend with each other after a while, killing any uniqueness these places could have. This is a problem completely separate from writing. And a reminder that the Capital Wasteland and the Commonwealth are nowhere as big as the map in Fallout 1 and 2, making the amount of these buildings even more ridiculous given how small the area is in reality.

So no, Bethesda's worlds aren't better, they are theme parks that nonsensically litter the world wtih dungeons to fuel Bethesda's gameplay loop of "explore, kill and loot" because of the dopamine rush. But at the end of the day it makes the world extremely forgettable because all these locations might as well be the same place with slightly different layouts.

You know hard as shit it would be to combine both? You know why Bethesda overuses this design? Because it's easy as shit since you don't need to write anything for these locations outside of very basic stuff. There's a reason New Vegas has a lower number of dungeons compared to the Bethesda Fallouts, because writing compelling stories to every single one would be insane and take so much work. Plus level design that doesn't repeat like they do in Bethesda dungeons.

Fallout 1 also has a lower number of dungeons because the devs knew writing compelling content for each is hard and that game is arguably the best in the series. Your game having a ton of dungeons is not a good thing by default.