NCR, Enclave, FEV Curling-13 (and mutants)

[brfritos]

There are lots of trucks in Camp McCarran and the gun seller on the bridge at the 188 trading post got a truck as well. Of course you never see them driving around, but I don't think these are junk trucks that are standing around there since pre-war.

So as long as nobody can contradict this, I'd say these folks came with trucks and stuff to the Mojave / New Vegas area. And this doesn't even sound silly, imo.

It's interesting that ALL military trucks available have flat tires.
All that airplanes staitioned at McCarran are a waste too.
Or can we assume they were used?

I wasn't clear enough, NCR has to have trains, because NCRCF was created for expanding the rail lines.
The reason is clear enough.
I only wish we see some of these passing through, like a convoy of trucks carring something for Hoover Dam.

I know that the "wasted" enviroment is guilty because of FO3 textures, meshes and enviroment, but I hope the next Fallout games shows some development and clean constructions, depending of the location.
Common, it's more than 200 years after the war, that ammount of ruble in the middle of everything, dirty rooms, beds, buildings and such or the dirty clothes that everyone uses, even in the middle of the city, is a little unrealistic.

Or maybe bath and hygiene is not anymore a people's priority.
Gosh, we returned to the middle ages, when everyone was a pig?

[ ]'s

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

I am not saying the NCR doesn't have working trucks, I actually expect they do.
I just don't expect a lot of traders having them.

Exception might be cases like the 'family truck', descendants from truck drivers who have inherited and maintain the truck of their ancestor to continue the family trade.

 

[Lexx]

It's interesting that ALL military trucks available have flat tires.
All that airplanes staitioned at McCarran are a waste too.
Or can we assume they were used?

The flat tired are a good point. Though for now I would guess it's an oversight of some sort.

About that airplanes, I don't think they have been used, no. But one would guess that the NCR tried to get everything possible out of them (like spare parts, metal,...).

 

[brfritos]

I am not saying the NCR doesn't have working trucks, I actually expect they do.
I just don't expect a lot of traders having them.

Exception might be cases like the 'family truck', descendants from truck drivers who have inherited and maintain the truck of their ancestor to continue the family trade.

Oh yes, I know that, I don't expect merchants using trucks too. I know that cars don't exist in FO universe excepting The Highwayman, and if they exist, NCR and other big factions will probable seize them.
But I wish we have some indication that this type of things still exists in working condition or are being created again.

For example, when talking with Chomp Lewis in Sloan one of the courier's questions is what is a dragline, so I'm assuming that they didn't have this in NV and NCR bring it from California.
Also, as the question indicates, the people of the Mojave don't even know that certain technologies still exists.

NCR appears to be much more developed than the game shows, because you need some skills and factories for manufacturing the service rifle in larger quantities, like they do.
Or they are build by the Gun Runners?

I wish that future Fallout's actually show some of this, instead of letting us guessing about.

 

[Lexx]

I know that cars don't exist in FO universe excepting The Highwayman

This is not true. I am too lazy now to search the part in the Fallout Bible, but it's said that at least the NCR has around 1000 cars. That's also the reason why there is a special NPC (Fallout 2) in the NCR, which you can pay to protect the stuff in your car. If you would have the one and only working car around there, for sure he would have reacted a bit different than "yeah, I am here all day, watching over cars."

Or they are build by the Gun Runners?

The Gun Runners are the main suppliers for the NCRs army. Though, I don't think they produce the bodyarmors for the troopers. So they must come from someone else.

 

[Tremer]

I know that cars don't exist in FO universe excepting The Highwayman

This is not true. I am too lazy now to search the part in the Fallout Bible, but it's said that at least the NCR has around 1000 cars. That's also the reason why there is a special NPC (Fallout 2) in the NCR, which you can pay to protect the stuff in your car. If you would have the one and only working car around there, for sure he would have reacted a bit different than "yeah, I am here all day, watching over cars."

New reno had the 1000 cars (big jesus?) and the npc that watch over your car, but i suppose the NCR take the cars.

 

[Quagmire69]

Back to the main topic the NCR is poorly written and just plane bland. No real ideology, no consistency, no cause, no vendetta, no real back story that makes for an interesting faction. I wish their would have been more CL, more Mafia famlies, the whole white glove society thing just seemed to contrived, the omertas differently fit though, instead of the white glove and the chairmen they should have had the Yakuza and the Russians.

 

[White Knight]

Back to the main topic the NCR is poorly written and just plane bland. No real ideology, no consistency, no cause, no vendetta, no real back story that makes for an interesting faction. I wish their would have been more CL, more Mafia famlies, the whole white glove society thing just seemed to contrived, the omertas differently fit though, instead of the white glove and the chairmen they should have had the Yakuza and the Russians.

Why, what does the russians and the Yazukas have to do with Las Vegas? The Chairmen are a reference to Frank Sinatra and the Rat pack, the Omertas were a reference to the less pleasant aspects, Mr. House is a reference to Howard Hughes, The white glove society for me at least represents the glamour of Vegas, that hides something. Everything fits. The russian mafia and the Yazuka wouldn't work at all.

 

[Atomkilla]

NCR poorly written? How's that?
NCR, compared to Legion at least, in rich in content, very rich. It has its backstory, which isn't illogical, its motives, ideology that, somewhat different, has been out there for more than 400 years. Many NCR members have their own motives and opinions about various things in the game, and most of them are really well done.

I don't see how NCR is poorly written. Sure, it lacks some aspects, and can be inconsisten or confusing at times, but that's not some big flaw. In reality, which (modern) game doesn't have such problems?

 

[Quagmire69]

NCR poorly written? How's that?

Full of contridictions that i have already mentioned.

Lets face they don't have much of a purpose besides self preservation.

Lets face the Legion have far more purpose and ideology. Their ready to die for Caesar, the NCR just bitch about how they don't want to die. Hows that for bland, thats all they do is bitch. The Legion people just concentrate on making the best with what they have got. Thats whats great about them. With them its like, well the worlds been destroyed lets make something new. Thats why their a much more compelling group even though you might not want them to when if this were real life. Their just more fun to side with.

 

[brfritos]

NCR poorly written? How's that?

Full of contridictions that i have already mentioned.

Lets face they don't have much of a purpose besides self preservation.

Lets face the Legion have far more purpose and ideology. Their ready to die for Caesar, the NCR just bitch about how they don't want to die. Hows that for bland, thats all they do is bitch. The Legion people just concentrate on making the best with what they have got. Thats whats great about them. With them its like, well the worlds been destroyed lets make something new. Thats why their a much more compelling group even though you might not want them to when if this were real life. Their just more fun to side with.

You mean that you actually like the Legion more than NCR, right?
Well, I like black shoes more than collered ones, but hey...it's juts that, an opinion.

[ ]'s

 

[Quagmire69]

You mean that you actually like the Legion more than NCR, right?

I would prefer that House wins actually. But as far as whose the most fun and the most compelling yes. The NCR troops and citizens alike are by far the most annoying, self centered, obnoxious people in the game, just look at the speech chief Hanlon gives as to why hes betraying his country just because the rangers are no longer be given preferred status. Constantly gripping about their own personal problems and tragedies. You have to admire the legions purpose, their troops don't complain, they know why their at war and they fight to win. Their courageous, loyal, honorable. Societary wise they are not whats best for Vegas, and humanity will do far better under either House or the Courier. Its like this novel I'm reading on Genghis Khan, in a lot of ways I don't want the Mongols to win but I can't help but marvel at a society people who exude such courageous qualities.

 

[Yamu]

You mean that you actually like the Legion more than NCR, right?

The NCR troops and citizens alike are by far the most annoying, self centered, obnoxious people in the game, just look at the speech chief Hanlon gives as to why hes betraying his country just because the rangers are no longer be given preferred status.

That's really what you got out of that speech? Really? Hanlon was doing what he was doing because he saw it as the quickest way to get the NCR out of their untenable situation in the Mojave with the least loss of life, not because of any petty inter-military jockeying.

 

[Crni Vuk]

NCR poorly written? How's that?

Full of contridictions that i have already mentioned.

Lets face they don't have much of a purpose besides self preservation.

Lets face the Legion have far more purpose and ideology. Their ready to die for Caesar, the NCR just bitch about how they don't want to die. Hows that for bland, thats all they do is bitch. The Legion people just concentrate on making the best with what they have got. Thats whats great about them. With them its like, well the worlds been destroyed lets make something new. Thats why their a much more compelling group even though you might not want them to when if this were real life. Their just more fun to side with.

That is more because the game has shown the Legion that way. We can not assume that there would not be people which do NOT want to die for Caesar, or think he is eventually wrong or simply do not want to be in some war - Particularly when you consider how the simple Legionnaire is equipped and the mortality rate. While Vegas is trying hard to show some kind of fanaticism in the Legion it is simply not realistic. Even with the best brainwashing be it from the Nazis or The Communists most people actually prefer NOT to be wars and avoid it if possible. And funny is that in some situations (albeit rare) you will get conversations with people where they show some doubts about Caesar even Caesar himself is worried about it at some point showing himself to the troops as weak.

One of the problems I have with the Legion is that it shows almost no diversity which you would expect in some army with thousand if not hundred thousand of men. In the NCR you have from patriotism to anger, fear and disappointment a wide range of mixed feelings which makes them more realistic then the Legion. You might send new recruits in combat being all proud about it. But war can very fast change the opinion of people. Like mentioned many times. What Vegas is missing is a town controlled by the Legion with their typical citizens, guards and veterans.

 

[Stanislao Moulinsky]

Back to the main topic the NCR is poorly written and just plane bland. No real ideology, no consistency, no cause, no vendetta, no real back story that makes for an interesting faction.

In short, they are like the average real world democracy. Which was the point behind the creation of this faction, I think.

 

[White Knight]

You mean that you actually like the Legion more than NCR, right?

I would prefer that House wins actually. But as far as whose the most fun and the most compelling yes. The NCR troops and citizens alike are by far the most annoying, self centered, obnoxious people in the game, just look at the speech chief Hanlon gives as to why hes betraying his country just because the rangers are no longer be given preferred status. Constantly gripping about their own personal problems and tragedies. You have to admire the legions purpose, their troops don't complain, they know why their at war and they fight to win. Their courageous, loyal, honorable. Societary wise they are not whats best for Vegas, and humanity will do far better under either House or the Courier. Its like this novel I'm reading on Genghis Khan, in a lot of ways I don't want the Mongols to win but I can't help but marvel at a society people who exude such courageous qualities.

Honour? They sell women as sex slaves and they have no quarrels with killing civillians. Courageous? They either fight or they are killed, they don't do it because their brave. The Legion may not be two dimensional as NV shows, but they certainly aren't any of the things you describe them as. In fact, most of the named Legion NPCs you meet, are arrogant, sadistic and insult you the first time you meet them.

 

[Quagmire69]

How is the NCR honourable. They talk about all this equality shit, but they treat people they see as beneath them just as shity as the BOS, the Enclave, or Legion, and think nothing of letting bramin barons treat thier own people like slaves. Wheres the honor in what they did too Boone, frankly I see him as perhaps the biggist victim of the NCR, if he were a legion soldier and his wife was killed those responsible would be nailed to crosses. Instead of being a burned out reck he'd be a centurian, or at least a great hero.

The NCR are just if not even more vindictive. If it had been Ceasar who attacked Navarro do you think he would be so obssesed with revenge that he would be trying to hunt down the survivors children. I could imagine him saying:

"The Enclave is dead, America is dead, but its warriors fought bravely and deserve a place in the knew order and would be welcome around the fires of my camp".

I think he as well as the legion show far more respect for brave enemies. They often compliment the Rangers for thier tenacity, how many NCR officials say about thier enemies. In my opinon having the ablility to admire you enemies for thier bravery is the hight of honor.

 

[Crni Vuk]

what ever the NCR is. But the Legion has no honor either. How so ? They only follow Caesar. And his word is the law. As simple as that. He talks all nice with tribes as long he needs them and simply assimilates them later. See the Khans. It is one way how to get them out of the alliance with Caesar. He is a schmock. A powerful schmock. But still a schmock. And his faction doesn't even make sense without him.

 

[Stanislao Moulinsky]

How is the NCR honourable.

Who said it was?

Wheres the honor in what they did too Boone

Uh? What did the NCR do to Boone?

if he were a legion soldier and his wife was killed those responsible would be nailed to crosses.

Except [spoiler:c1d20eefd3]it was Boone that killed her and he did so only because the "honourable" Legion bought her and her unborn son to enslave them for life.[/spoiler:c1d20eefd3]

The NCR are just if not even more vindictive. If it had been Ceasar who attacked Navarro do you think he would be so obssesed with revenge that he would be trying to hunt down the survivors children. I could imagine him saying:

"The Enclave is dead, America is dead, but its warriors fought bravely and deserve a place in the knew order and would be welcome around the fires of my camp".

Yeah, right. Caesar burned down some villages and settlements while killing all its inabitants that didn't surrender just to make an example out of them. I'm sure he would just let live the survivor of an organized and dangerous faction that could pose a threat if he let them reorganize. You know, exactly like what happened with the Enclave, that after the destruction of the Oil Rig and Navarro regrouped on the east coast planning to do other eeeevil stuff.

And what about the captured enemies (even the respected rangers) that are brought in his camp just so they can entertain the legionaries in the arena?

 

[White Knight]

How is the NCR honourable. They talk about all this equality shit, but they treat people they see as beneath them just as shity as the BOS, the Enclave, or Legion, and think nothing of letting bramin barons treat thier own people like slaves. Wheres the honor in what they did too Boone, frankly I see him as perhaps the biggist victim of the NCR, if he were a legion soldier and his wife was killed those responsible would be nailed to crosses. Instead of being a burned out reck he'd be a centurian, or at least a great hero.
The NCR are just if not even more vindictive. If it had been Ceasar who attacked Navarro do you think he would be so obssesed with revenge that he would be trying to hunt down the survivors children. I could imagine him saying:

"The Enclave is dead, America is dead, but its warriors fought bravely and deserve a place in the knew order and would be welcome around the fires of my camp".
I think he as well as the legion show far more respect for brave enemies. They often compliment the Rangers for thier tenacity, how many NCR officials say about thier enemies. In my opinon having the ablility to admire you enemies for thier bravery is the hight of honor.

Where has it been stated that Brahmin Barons treat people like slaves? They have considerable influence in the NCR senate, and they tend buy out the smaller ranches or force them to sell, but other than that theirs no reason to say they treat people like slaves.