OkCupid and Other Dating Sites

[Walpknut]

I find some of that "gender is social" to be baffling and a little sexist. Now I have zero problem with transpeople, it's their life and their choices but when someone tries to oversell it to me that e is a woman because she wears dresses and has huge fake boobs, what about those girls that don't identify as dudes but prefer to dress more masculine and don't wear jewels? Gender is to me just something biological, it shouldn't define your interests or roles in society or aspirations, but maybe they just have explained the whole thing wrong to me.

Wikipedia actually explains it fairly well: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_and_gender_distinction

Generally speaking, the biological term is 'sex'. Even sex isn't very clear: there's intersex people, underdevelopment of sexual characteristics, hormonal differences etc. It's not all that clear-cut. But if you want to refer to a person's biological state of being, that's the term you'd use. With trans people it's generally very offensive to do so, though.

Gender generally doesn't refer to a person's biology, but to the social/cultural context of a person's...sex? So for instance, I could be biologically female but my gender could be male because I conform to those gender roles (dress, fake boobs, the way I act etc).
Generally speaking, though, it's polite to let people define their own gender and refer to them however they want to be referred to. And there's really no good reason not to.

Like I said, I have absolutely 0 problem with them. I just find that particular thesis to be kind of sexist.

 

[Crni Vuk]

SuAside seems to remind me of Quagmire (from Family Guy). Not that that's a bad thing though.

It's simple: I'm attracted to women. And I'm told that nowadays, you'd be hard pressed to identify a post-op tranny as anything else than a woman. Medical science has come a long way.

So why would I have a problem with going out with someone that used to be male but is now a convincing female? Why should I care that "she" has XY chromosomes instead of XX? The only long term problem I can see is not having kids of your own, but there's plenty of solutions for that.

I guess you are right, but it is still a complicated topic. Medicine is still not so far that it can really change a gender, but I am ONLY(!) talking about the biology here. I understand that it can be incredible frustrating and a serious problem for people if they feel that that have the wrong gender. But you can not turn a female in to a male or a male into a female really. I mean looking at the process the people have most of the time to take pills, hormones and eventually more surgeries for a long time, if not the rest of their life. Of course I am not saying they should not try it if they feel that it will help them to have a better life. But I am just saying. When you really want to have a relationship with someone, then you should know what you might get into, and it is just fair to let your partner know that, so he can make a decision. A good relationship can be only build on trust.

 

[Ah-Teen]

Can't say I've used dating sites, I've had a lot of success finding people though common interest sites like meet up. I'm sure it's a way of finding people but I think it would serve better to go out and do things with people, and hey that cute girl in your comic book club turns into a date.

As far as trans, I kind of understand where she's coming from.... since my current girlfriend is pre-op.

Also, trans... fuck you pronoun game, fuck you.

Not blaming you or attacking you. But I gotta ask. How do you do it? How can you be with a tranny?

Basically, I came to the realization that I care more about someone's personality and their mind than their body. Male, female kinda stopped having meaning for me physically.

Now I've considered myself gay for a long while, so it's not weird to be dating someone physically male. I've never had long relationships with women, but I'm not opposed to it though. Physically sex is fun either way.

My biggest worry is the surgery itself.

To answer the peanut gallery,
I don't have a lot of sex since I'm literally on the other side of the planet.

 

[alec]

Don't you just love how Sander is doing his best to steer this topic into the realms of gender/sex? I always enjoy one-trick-ponies performing the only 'trick' they're capable of.
@Ah-Teen: good for you. Does the miltary know of your sexual preference?

 

[Kilgore Trout]

I find some of that "gender is social" to be baffling and a little sexist. Now I have zero problem with transpeople, it's their life and their choices but when someone tries to oversell it to me that e is a woman because she wears dresses and has huge fake boobs, what about those girls that don't identify as dudes but prefer to dress more masculine and don't wear jewels? Gender is to me just something biological, it shouldn't define your interests or roles in society or aspirations, but maybe they just have explained the whole thing wrong to me.

Wikipedia actually explains it fairly well: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sex_and_gender_distinction

Generally speaking, the biological term is 'sex'. Even sex isn't very clear: there's intersex people, underdevelopment of sexual characteristics, hormonal differences etc. It's not all that clear-cut. But if you want to refer to a person's biological state of being, that's the term you'd use. With trans people it's generally very offensive to do so, though.

Gender generally doesn't refer to a person's biology, but to the social/cultural context of a person's...sex? So for instance, I could be biologically female but my gender could be male because I conform to those gender roles (dress, fake boobs, the way I act etc).
Generally speaking, though, it's polite to let people define their own gender and refer to them however they want to be referred to. And there's really no good reason not to.

Like I said, I have absolutely 0 problem with them. I just find that particular thesis to be kind of sexist.

I don't think it's sexist, although I understand why you might and I think you raise an important point. Ultimately I think there are two related issues here, and they both point the fact that gender is a social construct.

Let's start with the one you raised: "girls that don't identify as dudes but prefer to dress more masculine and don't wear jewels".The issue here is about the boundaries of that gender or how it expresses itself: i.e. how should men and women behave? Now If I were to argue that there is ultimately only one proper way of being manly, and only one proper way to be female, and insist that all women have to wear makeup and jewels and stay home and mind the kitchen, and insist that transwomen who do these things are more female than biological women who don't, that would be sexist as hell (note: I am not saying that). Usually the people saying these sorts of things are claiming that these gender roles are biologically based and thus, effectively fixed for all members of our species, making those who don't conform to those roles freaks.

But I'm not saying that, because I don't define gender roles as a narrow spectrum of behavior set in our DNA; I see it as a social construct which has changed over time and is changing now. A few generations ago, during the Victorian period, maybe, a woman who preferred masculine clothes and didn't wear jewels would have been a scandal but now that's probably not going to bother anyone (unless you live in Saudi Arabia or Afghanistan). In other places and other times, gender has been (and is) understood differently. The boundaries of acceptability in gender roles in Western society have shifted over the last century, and I regard that as generally a good thing because it gives individuals more freedom to be themselves, follow their aspirations and realize their capacities.

Is there a tension between a biological woman who finds traditional gender roles constricting and is trying to break out of them, and a transwoman who seeks to conform to a traditional gender role? Maybe seemingly, but I would argue ultimately not. The point is, the choice of whether or not to conform to more traditional gender roles is a choice, and it's a choice because those roles aren't hardwired into us but are defined by a culture, and those definitions aren't fixed.

 

[Crni Vuk]

I think only very few roles, if any at all, really depend on the fact if someone has a Vagina or Penis. It is just my opinion, but I would say that 90% of it actually depends on the culture, how you grow up, what your parents teach you, what you learn in school, TV etc. Maybe what they call a motherly instinct is one of those few things that can be seen as "pre programed" in our gender. No clue. But I believe, that males and females can share a lot of roles, where the father can assume a more motherly figure and the mother a more father like role, if needed. Definitely a very complex and interesting field.

Does someone actually remember the movie To Wong Foo, Thank for Everything, Julie Newmar!

 

[Akratus]

I agree completely that there's gender as a scientific point, and a gender that someone calls themselves. Some people have come to use gender terms such as genderqueer, or genderfluid or bigender or a whole list of other things that really don't fit the term gender. And I would say that the only terms I believe need be applied, are Male, Female, Transexual or Hermaphroditism. But I would never argue against someone who uses whatever term they want. If it's about what they identify as, and not someone else, I let people be whoever they want, and do whatever they want.

I also want to make the point that yes, calling transexualism unnatural is certainly offensive.

When it comes to dating services, I have used Tinder for a while, and found that the types of people who seek out tinder aren't the ones I would enjoy being in contact with. I don't know if my experience would differ under a dating site. I feel like a potential partner for me would be very out there, and I've accepted the fact that there's a big possibility I'll never find someone that I can love. You see, I had a girlfriend since a while back, and whilst we dated for almost a year, at no point could I genuinely say I loved her. I guess it's just a fat chance to find someone as deranged as me.

 

[Crni Vuk]

yeah well I pretty much gave up finding the "right" person (male or female).

 

[Akratus]

Well I wouldn't give up all hope. Statistics are in your favor, even if it might take the longest time for you to feel it's effects.

 

[BigBoss]

yeah well I pretty much gave up finding the "right" person (male or female).

Man... alright.

There is no fucking right person. You just gotta find someone who you can love and that's that bro. If you go looking for the "special one" or something like that, you'll end up lonely, miserable, and climbing yourself into a bottle (like I am, but that's unrelated to my love life). There is no special one. Whose to say that that girl on the other part of the world is better for you than the one you have that you see oftenly (hypothetically. Don't go asking all the girls you know out now). But, when left to life and life alone, finding is slooooow as fuck. Unless you just so happen upon some kind of fucking "love miracle" (which don't exist. Romantic movies are total bullshit. After the ending of all of them, they should skip to five, eight years down the line in a scene where the cops are being called for domestic (non-physical) violence. Celebrities try to meet like that all the time. Almost fucking never works out, and when they do stay together, they're both miserable. That's real).

Finding real love is about finding someone to fall in love with that'll love you back. It's not about "love at first sight". It's about getting to know them, and growing to love everything about them.

Hoe-lee shit. Listen to me ramble on about finding love like some fucking 40 year old cynic. Wow I feel like I'm fucking dating a 16 year old back in high school again. Anyways, that's what love is man. Not this bullshit the media portrays. I wouldn't give up hope bro.

But like I said, finding love in average daily life can be slooow, or next to impossible if you live the same schedule out every day. That's why you gotta kind of put yourself out there. Don't be afraid to ask girls (after you've known them for at least a week or two), or fuck, even going on dating websites. Dating websites are kinda 50/50 though. 50% chance you meet a controlling lunatic, 50% chance you fall in love. But that's what taking risks are I guess.

Remember though. People say "fall" in love for a reason. No one's going to love you the first fucking day they meet you, or maybe even for the last ten years they've known you they haven't even thought twice if you're a match for them. Ya gotta put yourself out there. If it doesn't work, fine. There's more fish in the sea (that is an overly used saying, isn't it? It's almost always douche bags using that saying, but, it's true). If it does and you end up growing to care about that woman and do anything for her, great! More power to ya! Just make sure they love you back, or you're in for some painful days ahead of ya.

 

[Crni Vuk]

what if you can't really love? Or let's say not the way like others do. I have a lot of mental related issues. Its hard to find someone that "loves" you when you have sometimes the feelings of a rock, because you act very dull. I have literaly phases where I want to see no one, absolutely no interaction with any human beeings because it is simply to much stress on my mind. I dont hate people, I am not crazy or a lunatic, but I guess it's simply not possible for some of us to create really very strong bonds with other people. And yes, I know why it happens, I have a very violent past to say that.

 

[BigBoss]

Bro, look who you're talking too.. violent past? I was in the 3rd Street Rogues here in Albuquerque (Northsiders. 14, XIV, Red ragz and clothes, shit like that).

Shutting yourself out? After my father died I pretty much kept myself in my room (only coming out to piss and grab food) for two years.

That doesn't meant it's impossible for me to love. In fact I actively seek it out now. I worry that if I don't, I'll be drinking myself stupid for the rest of my life out of sympathy for, well, myself.

Just because you're not quick to express emotion doesn't mean you'll never find love, or can't love. Even sociopaths can feel love (granted, it's a kind of sick love, but still). It's scientifically proven that the feeling we call "love" is hardwired into all of us. So I really wouldn't worry about that man. But like I said, you have to leave your comfort zone (and believe me, I know how hard that can be) which could be your room, house, or whatever, and put yourself out there.

 

[Byzantine]

With that being said I do regard the current Tumblr-scene as utterly ridiculous with its sexual orientations and stuff.

Needless to say, this thread's taken an interesting turn since its original post.

I do browse occasionally on dating sites like OkCupid and Oasis Active, but my studies at the moment have kept me from seriously dating other people. When it comes to online dating, you'll always get a mixed bag. I've come across some folks who were incredibly sweet, but there have been guys who were downright pigs with only one thing on their mind. Still, it provides a valuable service, I think.

 

[BigBoss]

Wait? When you mention guys, are you saying you're a woman on a dating site, or a tranny on a dating site. Because, believe me, to guys it is two completely fucking different things.

 

[Byzantine]

I'm a male on a dating site looking for other males, hence my use of "guys". What, by the power of Grayskull, made you think that I was a transvestite?

 

[BigBoss]

Well, the fact that I'm drinking a 40 (Olde English). Sorry man. Read my signature, I don't know what the fuck is going on half the time.

 

[Crni Vuk]

Just because you're not quick to express emotion doesn't mean you'll never find love, or can't love. Even sociopaths can feel love (granted, it's a kind of sick love, but still). It's scientifically proven that the feeling we call "love" is hardwired into all of us. So I really wouldn't worry about that man. But like I said, you have to leave your comfort zone (and believe me, I know how hard that can be) which could be your room, house, or whatever, and put yourself out there.

Mental instability is not something people are usually looking for when they search for a potential partner or mate. This has nothing to do with a comfort zone. I can not explain it really, but I am getting physically and mentally tired when I have to much contact with people. This is not something that I want you know.

Also, sorry that hear that you had such trouble in your life.

 

[Akratus]

Just because you're not quick to express emotion doesn't mean you'll never find love, or can't love. Even sociopaths can feel love (granted, it's a kind of sick love, but still). It's scientifically proven that the feeling we call "love" is hardwired into all of us. So I really wouldn't worry about that man. But like I said, you have to leave your comfort zone (and believe me, I know how hard that can be) which could be your room, house, or whatever, and put yourself out there.

Mental instability is not something people are usually looking for when they search for a potential partner or mate. This has nothing to do with a comfort zone. I can not explain it really, but I am getting physically and mentally tired when I have to much contact with people. This is not something that I want you know.

Also, sorry that hear that you had such trouble in your life.

I had possible mental issues that affected my relationship. I had my first girlfriend about a year back now, and in no way was it a positive experience for me. I'm one of those people who incessantly criticizes someone (in my head) for not having what I consider to be as good taste in culture as me, or as eloquent a way to describe their opinions other than constantly saying 'I like this' or 'I don't like that', or 'this is stupid' etc.

Now I'm an atheist, and the lady I dated was of the pagan/wiccan faith. I disliked that very much, but I filed it away in my mind. She likes movies I consider to be bad like Eragon, which is her all time favorite. I filed it away.

Slowly we started to like hanging around less and less. And one day I broke things off and she was pretty flabbergasted. To me it was all logical, because I was thinking about how the relationship didn't work and I didn't appreciate the relationship for quite a long while since then. And I had tried to communicate this to her ever so slightly at some points, but she was pretty oblivious to it, and you can't change someone anyway. That I think, was my biggest mistake. I assumed that what I didn't like about her, I could change. That is extremely stupid in hindsight.

At one point she said that she doesn't know what's going on in my head.

I think it could never have worked. I need someone who can talk for an hour about the little things they love and don't love and like and don't like about something they like a whole lot, like I can about say, Warhammer 40000. And I end up seeing anyone who can't even do that about the thing they love the most as shallow. For her it was just: "I love dragons. I really love dragons. Why? I just think they're cool and I really love them."

I think it also doesn't help that I hate ever single social circle I have access to, and not a day goes by that I don't hit myself in the head for not trying to succeed in my education almost at all, at least untill it was too late. If I think back now I'm thinking I could probably have met the kind of people in who's contact I could relish, and now I'm pretty depressed about the people I have to force myself to interact with on a daily basis. But then again, maybe higher education could never have worked for me either, seeing as how I'm pretty left handed when it comes to technical thinking, such as in math, to pick just one example.

 

[Crni Vuk]

yeah, we definitely have quite a few things in common. Though, to say this, I am not socialy awkward or something, or least not more then anyone else I guess. But there are phases where interaction with other human beeings becomes so tiresome and troublesome that its a real problem to my mood and mental stability. This makes it extremly hard to keep friends and people around, because it simply is not a normal behaviour as far as people and interaction goes.

 

[Sub-Human]

I can not explain it really, but I am getting physically and mentally tired when I have to much contact with people. This is not something that I want you know.

That's what they call an introvert. Most people are introverted to some extent, so it's not even an issue.