Prepare For the Future site updated
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Bernard Bumner
Still Mildly Glowing
Brother None said:
Radiation Ltd. of London made cookers in the 1950-60s - my mother still has her own mother's Radiation 'Regulo' Cookbook, which brings a smile to my face when I see it... It is a horribly naive piece of branding, but it certainly exemplifies the positive connotations still attached to radiation at that time.
(I know that cookers purposefully produce radiation, as opposed to early television sets, where it was a rather unfortunate byproduct...)
13pm
Water Chip? Been There, Done That
Brother None said:
Stupid pubertal teenager jokes are also included. I really hated that idiotic hairy chest growing up video. Oh yes, target audience... That what really reminded me of FO
oS.Other thing I can comment on, is the stupid way the things react to the mini-nuke's explosions. What the hell? How could those poor brahmins just fall to the ground without any limbs flying around after such an explosion? How could the PC lose only his hand and a half of the leg? How could the radscorpion survive such an explosion?
Man, it isn't even funny. Or visceral. Or whatever. It is just stupid.
Not to mention ugly 6-year-outdated animations, annoying VATS cinematic and portable shelters.
Utter shit.
ookami said:Heh. I guess someone should alert Bethesda that it's a pop-culture reference so they can get rid of it. Wouldn't want anything like that in there, it's too much like Fallout 2's 'silliness' (even though it was in the first Fallout game).
The thing was that most of the pop references in Fallout were pretty much blended seemlessly into the game, you only got it if you knew about it. Otherwise, you didn't pay any attention to it.
In Fallout 2 most of the references were obvious and some completely took you out of the game. I didn't get the crashed whale referrence until almost 4 years after I first beat the game which clicked when I read hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy. There were also REPEATED mentions of Star Wars, Star Trek and Monty Python in the game.
I think THAT is what the guys at Beth are talking about. Keep the feel of the original, but don't go overboard with it. There is a fine line between having fun with pop-culture and being tongue in cheek. Take for example Farscape which has funny moments and several pop culture references, for the most part its fine and doesn't break the 4th wall...but there are a few episodes where its just too much, and it just pulls you out because you KNOW its just too much. When it comes to things like this its all about balance.
Lincoln has his head cut off as a nod to the Simpsons...that's fine. I'm assuming there's going to be a quest to retrieve it from a young boy who did the deed...probably named Trab or some silly thing like that. (If it does happen who will not be tempted to off the little Bart Simpson stand-in?) Which in of itself should be a fun little side-quest that takes nothing away from the game. But if you get the kid home and he lives on evergreen terrace, has a fat dad who is a blind poet (homer) then they will have crossed the line.
I'm looking forward to see what will be done. So far its actually looking like a good game. Not sure if I'll rent it or buy it outright, but it won't be the odd divergence from Fallout folklore that will make me dislike the game. I think that this game should be judge on its own merit first, and adherence to fallout canon second.
Bernard Bumner
Still Mildly Glowing
Moester said:
Why? On the basis that we already know (suspect) it that it fails the test of verisimilitude, and should therefore revise our expectations?
It should be judged first and foremost as what it claims to be - a sequel to Fallout. After that, if it fails to live up to the name, then I might reassess it in terms of inherent positives and negatives. (Assuming that I will play it.) Don't set the bar so low...
[blockquote]The thing was that most of the pop references in Fallout were pretty much blended seemlessly into the game, you only got it if you knew about it. Otherwise, you didn't pay any attention to it.
In Fallout 2 most of the references were obvious and some completely took you out of the game.[/blockquote]
The pop-references and in-jokes were much more numerous in Fallout 2. It isn't just a question of subtlety, it is also moderation; the overall tone is meant to be almost unremittingly bleak, and too much humour of any colour or type can compromise that.
Fallout 1 intro
Check out 50 seconds into the original Fallout 1 video as the camera pans away from the TV
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkBNKa2KXZE[/youtube]
Here's a PSP Faceplate pic from a Photoshop contest back in 06
Man some of you are so quick to jump on the hate wagon.
Check out 50 seconds into the original Fallout 1 video as the camera pans away from the TV
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WkBNKa2KXZE[/youtube]
Here's a PSP Faceplate pic from a Photoshop contest back in 06
Man some of you are so quick to jump on the hate wagon.
If nothing else, I have to say Bethesda certainly has the retro art style down. I'm still cautiously optimistic about this game, though I'd definitely rent it before buying it.. I have to say, though, the Nuclear Catapult does look really out of place, but it's not a massive concern as I could certainly decide to just not use it...
I think one of the major problems could be those Bloatflies though... not sure if many of you have ever played Morrowind, but the Bloatfly seems very much like the Fallout version of a Cliff Racer, which could easily be one of the most retarded design decisions they've made.
For those who don't know, the Cliff Racer is this irritating bird-lizard thing that flies around randomly in various areas in Morrowind, until it notices you and makes a god-awful "SCRREEAWWW!!!" noise, after which it will proceed to follow you around directly above you no matter how fast you move, slowly lowering towards your character inches at a time while still making that damned noise, until it gets close enough to start whacking you around with its tail. Also, if you manage to pick up more than one they will all do that exact thing in a giant mass of floating design idiocy that you can't escape until you kill each and every one. (or quit the game)
So basically if the Bloatfly (or any other flying creatures) acts anything like that, it could easily be a game-killer, or at the least one of those things the mod community has to "clean up" because somehow the designers and playtesters at Bethesda didn't think this was a bad idea.
I think one of the major problems could be those Bloatflies though... not sure if many of you have ever played Morrowind, but the Bloatfly seems very much like the Fallout version of a Cliff Racer, which could easily be one of the most retarded design decisions they've made.
For those who don't know, the Cliff Racer is this irritating bird-lizard thing that flies around randomly in various areas in Morrowind, until it notices you and makes a god-awful "SCRREEAWWW!!!" noise, after which it will proceed to follow you around directly above you no matter how fast you move, slowly lowering towards your character inches at a time while still making that damned noise, until it gets close enough to start whacking you around with its tail. Also, if you manage to pick up more than one they will all do that exact thing in a giant mass of floating design idiocy that you can't escape until you kill each and every one. (or quit the game)
So basically if the Bloatfly (or any other flying creatures) acts anything like that, it could easily be a game-killer, or at the least one of those things the mod community has to "clean up" because somehow the designers and playtesters at Bethesda didn't think this was a bad idea.
Ausir wrote:
Quote:
Have you ever seen house-hold appliances that use "radiation" in the brandname? "Radiation King" is the name of something that is - y'know - powered by or producing radiation, which a TV set would normally not be
You do realize that it's the same brand as the TV in the Fallout 1 intro?
I'm sure Brother None realizes it, but that's exactly where I was leading Garlic. The Radiation King brand is one of the first things you see in the intro to the original Fallout. However, in the context that he understood it, as an invention of Bethesda, suddenly it's style is something the "previous games never had", absurd, and doesn't fit the Fallout setting. That level of negativity is usually aimed at something that Bethesda actually created, but I don't think those times are any less baseless.
That post really does put a few people in their place. Maybe now, those who blatantly hate anything to do with FO3 will just grow a pair, come out and say it, instead of insisting that they want to be part of a discussion with an open mind.
Quote:
Have you ever seen house-hold appliances that use "radiation" in the brandname? "Radiation King" is the name of something that is - y'know - powered by or producing radiation, which a TV set would normally not be
You do realize that it's the same brand as the TV in the Fallout 1 intro?
I'm sure Brother None realizes it, but that's exactly where I was leading Garlic. The Radiation King brand is one of the first things you see in the intro to the original Fallout. However, in the context that he understood it, as an invention of Bethesda, suddenly it's style is something the "previous games never had", absurd, and doesn't fit the Fallout setting. That level of negativity is usually aimed at something that Bethesda actually created, but I don't think those times are any less baseless.
That post really does put a few people in their place. Maybe now, those who blatantly hate anything to do with FO3 will just grow a pair, come out and say it, instead of insisting that they want to be part of a discussion with an open mind.
Bernard Bumner said:
So you're saying that if its a great post-apocaliptic game, and is highly entertaining, but fails the verisimilitude test we should be outraged? Would you rather have a really lousy, yet thematically accurate game? I'm sure we would all rather have a game that does both, but its impossible for sequels to perfectly capture the feeling of the original. After all you said it yourself, Fallout 2 didn't have the same bleak tone as the original. Should we then consider the original the only game? Personally, if I pick up Fallout 3 and get to play a great post-appocaliptic game because of it, then I'll be darn happy...and a little sad that the game only has passing resemblance to a great game that went before it.
Of course if we have another BoS which soils the name Fallout, then I'll be outraged. But I remain cautiously optimistic that while there is a large chance that the game has many thematic changes over previous games that the core of the story remains unchanged.
After reading NMA's forums and news for years, Moester's post made me finally register... Please excuse my bad English, it's not my first language.
This postmodernism of Fallout 2 is exactly why I love it so much more than its predecessor. It's the same with any art: I'm just a sucker for movies breaking the fourth wall and making sure, that the viewer is aware of it being an artificial work. And this anti-illusionism is right what I want to have from a descent Fallout-Sequel. I like games and movies who don't pretend to be smarter than their audience and try to held a dialoge on equal terms. Every single gamer knows that is just an 'game' - not reality.
Moester said:
This postmodernism of Fallout 2 is exactly why I love it so much more than its predecessor. It's the same with any art: I'm just a sucker for movies breaking the fourth wall and making sure, that the viewer is aware of it being an artificial work. And this anti-illusionism is right what I want to have from a descent Fallout-Sequel. I like games and movies who don't pretend to be smarter than their audience and try to held a dialoge on equal terms. Every single gamer knows that is just an 'game' - not reality.
Anani Masu
Still Mildly Glowing
Bewitched said:
Some of the videos like the Capitol and Washington Monument seem to be truncated.
El Topo said:
I actually feel the same way, I was simply commeting on what the guys at Beth were talking about wanting to avoid the "mistakes" of fallout 2.
I'm also a huge fans of movies and books who break the 4th wall...as long as they do so in a tasteful way.
I must also say that F2 was a much less visceral game that Fallout. Simply because F2 felt like the protagonist was having fun going through his adventure, while the Vault Dweller was definitely having a sh*t time with it.
I definitely felt that the two games had a different appeal even though they used the same engine. I remember the big deal people made about how bottle caps were replaced in the game. And how Fallout 2 wasn't really Fallout. I just don't see how you can always make everyone happy.
Not necessarily. For example, the ewoks in Episode VI of Star Wars. I always felt they were unnecessary, and didn't fit into the whole setting or "vibe" of the original Star Wars movies at all.taag said:
Just because something was a part of the originals doesn't mean you can't have a legitimate beef with it or feel that it's out of place and that replicating it in a sequel is a poor decision.
That said, I actually rather like the use of the Radiation King brand-name myself, and I thought I remembered it from somewhere in the originals (though I didn't actually place it until I saw the F1 intro movie again).
Also, good work on pointing that out Aero... even though Ausir already pointed it out a page ago.
As for the PreparefortheFuture site... eh. I think they're trying too hard, and going way overboard, with the whole 50's thing. Most of it misses the mark, and isn't that great even on its own merit. Just compare the F1 intro and then watch some of those videos again. Not even in the same ballpark as far as quality goes, imo. Doesn't have the same feel either.
Finally... yeah. Those videos with the fatman... just awful. Color me less than impressed. The Protectron was okay, but the animation is just so abysmally bad. You'd think stiff, robotic animations would be one thing Bethesda could get right...
Texas Renegade
Look, Ma! Two Heads!
I can't get the book on 10 to work.
UncannyGarlic
Sonny, I Watched the Vault Bein' Built!
Huh, well I guess that just makes me plain wrong.Bernard Bumner said:
Maybe you should read the post of which this was taken out of before claiming it's maker hates "anything to do with FO3". You'll notice that there are both compliments and criticisms.squinty said:
Indeed, that's what I was getting at though I think I'm wrong on this one.Kyuu said:
Indeed and it's a pity. I think that they had a lot of good concepts with their videos but that they are mostly poorly executed. Still, I think that there would have been better approaches for a couple of them (VATS stands out in my mind).Kyuu said:
Ausir said:
Yes, but Anani Masu asked why it doesn't make sense, and I answered him. It being in Fallout 1's intro does not make it make sense.
I was never saying I had a problem with it, just that if you think about it the name doesn't make a lot of sense.
Bernard Bumner said:
""Radiation King" is the name of something that is - y'know - powered by or producing radiation, which a TV set would normally not be.
Sweet. I love it. I think they did a great job on this.
I'm starting to think that FO3 might actually turn out to be a great game. Not the sequel I expected in any way, and I'll never forgive them for doing their own thing with number 3, but a great game nonetheless.
I'm still not buying it, though.
I'm starting to think that FO3 might actually turn out to be a great game. Not the sequel I expected in any way, and I'll never forgive them for doing their own thing with number 3, but a great game nonetheless.
I'm still not buying it, though.