You think Bethesda cares about lore contradictions towards Fallout 3 in New Vegas? They set up Obsidian to fail for crying out loud. But you and @Norzan both come out incredibly stupid - yes stupid - by criticizing lore in a game that came out in 2008 because of the lore added in a game that came out in 2010 due to the latter's lore contradicting the previous one. That's just dumb.
Who cares if Bethesda approved it or looked the other way. I don't care about Bethesda. Bethesda Bethesda Bethesda. That's all people bring up. We're talking about lore continuity and it should have been Obsidian, not Bethesda, that did their homework to prevent these so-called "contradictions."
I never said they care, and the presence of the east coast brotherhood is not contradicted by Fallout New Vegas, it is contradicted by the events of F2 (which clearly presents the decayed state of the brotherhood long before the NCR war) and Tactics (which presents the midwest brotherhood, whose existence is confirmed by Brotherhood members in the pentagon fortress, and, more recently, by Caesar and cpt.Kells). Both titles that came out years before F3. The presence of the brotherhood that far east didn't expect New Vegas to make zero sense, it made zero sense in 2008 already.
Even if the legion didn't exist ; there is no scenario where an entire chapter could leave California with enough supplies for a year long walk, find their way through the many, many hostiles on the way (New Vegas simply gave some of them a name...), establish radio towers every 45 miles, walk through the midwest's turf, find them (or actually not finding them, depending on whose brotherhood member you ask, because this is such a consistent story...), and continue their journey east alive.
You think Bethesda cares about lore contradictions towards Fallout 3 in New Vegas? They set up Obsidian to fail for crying out loud. But you and @Norzan both come out incredibly stupid - yes stupid - by criticizing lore in a game that came out in 2008 because of the lore added in a game that came out in 2010 due to the latter's lore contradicting the previous one. That's just dumb.
Who cares if Bethesda approved it or looked the other way. I don't care about Bethesda. Bethesda Bethesda Bethesda. That's all people bring up. We're talking about lore continuity and it should have been Obsidian, not Bethesda, that did their homework to prevent these so-called "contradictions."
Fallout 3 already contradicted established lore by having a faction that was already deteriorating by the events of FALLOUT 2 cross the entire country, meaning they didn't already had the manpower and resources to make a trek across the entire country. What, should we now ignore Fallout 2 too? You are the one looking extremely stupid here.
So, Bethesda set out to make Obsidian fail by making their own writing even more stupid than it was before? Because allowing the NCR-BoS war and Caesar's Legion to exist before the expedition to be canon made BoS going to the East Coast even more idiotic than it already was. Therefore making Bethesda look more stupid than they already are. And you think Obsidian cared if it contradicted anything established by Bethesda? Several things in New Vegas actively mock Bethesda like making aliens canon and the Vault 87 mutants being extremely stupid.
Like mithtrap said, all New Vegas did was give some of the hostile tribes a name. They already EXISTED before they were given a name, meaning BoS would have to deal eventually if they wanted to cross the country. Meaning they already exist before Fallout 3 was even made.
Don't you honestly see how idiotic your arguments are? You are clearly oblivious to a lot major details that make the trek across the entire country to be even stupid by the events of Fallout 2. New Vegas adding stuff that makes that journey even harder doesn't make it more stupid than it already was.
I just wanted add this and i'm officially done with this argument. Got better shit to do.
I'm no fan of Bethesda, but blame the real culprits for these so-called "contradictions." Blame Obsidian. You would think that the people that worked on Fallout 2 wouldn't need Bethesda looking over their shoulder. I wouldn't have if I was Todd Howard.
They already EXISTED before they were given a name, meaning BoS would have to deal eventually if they wanted to cross the country. Meaning they already exist before Fallout 3 was even made.
Yeah, they existed, even though they were never mentioned existing in Tactics... or Fallout 2... or Fallout 1. But they existed. Yeah... right...
I can't have an argument with people that literally create evidence out of thin air. No matter what I say they'll have a counterargument, even if it's just repeating the same thing over and over again after I debunked it.
Tactics is non canon so for all we know based on all pre-Fallout 3 content the regions between California and DC are completaly barren of life. So great job guys.
To some of you, the introduction of new lore that contradicts the old lore is stupid but against the previous installment. That makes no sense no matter how you spin it. I can understand people that dislike Fallout 3 on valid reasons but this is just a parody of what people already believe NMA is all about.
Basically, to sum it all up, the BoS can't reach DC because 1. tribes 2. resources 3. war back home. Even though Power Armor beats spears, @TorontRayne already said you can loot the enemy to replenish supplies and everyone is saying they left after the war started because it serves their point even though we don't know in what year it began. Brilliant.
I don't want to jump into the conversation too much, but I do want to acknowledge one thing. I feel it's good Bethesda didn't try to force Obsidian to drop the Legion entirely just so the BoS expedition would be "more clear" than it is now.
Not only would it look extremely controlling on Bethesda's part to dictate what Obsidian could and couldn't do but the reason for the veto would be so, SO petty. Honestly, would literally any of us give Bethesda a thumbs up for stopping Obsidian from putting in a major faction they wrote themselves just so the East Coast BoS made more sense? I'm glad Bethesda gave Obsidian as much rein that they did and if it makes the East Coast BoS a bit harder to understand then so be it. The Bethesda Fallouts are largely "take it or leave it" anyway and presumably Bethesda themselves only barely care about internal consistency so odds are they wouldn't care much either.
I don't want to jump into the conversation too much, but I do want to acknowledge one thing. I feel it's good Bethesda didn't try to force Obsidian to drop the Legion entirely just so the BoS expedition would be "more clear" than it is now.
Not only would it look extremely controlling on Bethesda's part to dictate what Obsidian could and couldn't do but the reason for the veto would be so, SO petty. Honestly, would literally any of us give Bethesda a thumbs up for stopping Obsidian from putting in a major faction they wrote themselves just so the East Coast BoS made more sense? I'm glad Bethesda gave Obsidian as much rein that they did and if it makes the East Coast BoS a bit harder to understand then so be it. The Bethesda Fallouts are largely "take it or leave it" anyway and odds are Bethesda themselves only barely care about internal consistency so odds are they wouldn't care much either.
These people are just nitpicky as hell and wanna hate on Fallout 3 no matter how it's done. In truth, a nomadic force of BoS troops wouldn't be stopped by the Legion and they would know this and instead would simply scout them from afar. Once they realize they're not settling in their territories they would watch them until they left completaly. The Legion aren't crazy tribals that attack everyone on sight. They don't do it to you in New Vegas when you encounter them with Neutral reputation and much less towards a small army of the BoS.
Addressing your point that New Vegas handled the BoS/NCR conflict well...
The only reason they died is because ELIJAH was leading them. They would not have been wiped out if they simply retreated. It was the primary motivator for Dead Money so it made sense for the plot, but story wise it was just another example of the BoS being treated like bitches to preserve the status quo.
Operating from the Brotherhood's HELIOS One base, he sent paladins out on a number of missions that could be considered tactically questionable in efforts to secure vital technologies he was adamant would swing things in their favor. He eventually discovered that the secret to victory lay on his own doorstep, with the ARCHIMEDES I weapon. Though the Brotherhood position was tactically unsustainable,
You don't hold a position with overwhelming odds and expect victory. That is not the case for a scouting expedition though is it?
It should be noted that the Brotherhood, despite being forced into their bunkers, have not given up the fight against the NCR. Colonel Moore states that she recently survived four tours against the Brotherhood in California, suggesting that they are indeed still fighting.
4 tours against the BoS? At the TIME OF NEW VEGAS? The BoS sounds weakened, but they can obviously still fight somehow. The way people make it sound the BoS got their asses beat by the NCR all over California, and Nevada, now they are all sleeping in the bunkers waiting to die out. New Vegas says these assholes are STILL fighting back in California...
The number one issue we are having is this:
We have the NCR/BoS war that has NEVER BEEN WITNESSED.
We have a vast territory of LEGION AND NCR TERRITORY that has NEVER BEEN SEEN.
We have radioactive tornados mentioned in passing now taken as fact as the biggest barrier to the East Coast. Tornados aren't year long for the record.
We have a bunch of primitive tribes we don't know about, mentioned as potential obstacles to what amounts to the most badass armored super soldiers in RPG's.
This is what the BoS is like in essence. Not by ideology but by their tactics and strength of force.
Here is the NCR.
Just for fun here is the Legion or Raiders perhaps.
Of course everyone knows there are fewer Space Marines. It is about how you use them. This is a what we call a standstill.
@Pwener you are correct that some rabidly defend Obsidian due to New Vegas and irrationally hate on Bethesda due to pet reasons. That doesn't change the fact that we are all making a lot of assumptions based on shoddy world building, or that Bethesda and Obsidian both suck dick.
I am making assumptions that people don't just stroll through the middle of open plains expecting to not get shot. Whether they are in their armor at the time or not. For the record they would not always be in the armor. You don't just start walking to fucking D.C and keep going and not stop. You move to one location, secure, scout, resupply, move on. Verily you would have SCOUTS to let you know if all the shit you guys are talking about is coming to get them.
They would deal with locals like Veronica did. If the Lyon's BoS is any indicator they would have helped quite a few people out along the way. Fact of the matter is you can't say they couldn't make it without making up things to kill them that do not exist. You can't say Calculator would kill them, then say Tactics did not happen. You can't say they would run into Midwest BoS then say they didn't run into them, then say well...they ran into a scout or two.
I still hold to the belief that the BoS had a perfectly good reason to check on their men that were sent out East. They acted out of character just like the previous two Chapters did in the DARK YEARS OF INTERPLAY. The BoS is ONE OF THE FEW THINGS that made Fallout 3 even feel like Fallout. Otherwise it could have been any other generic post apocalyptic shitfest.
I adhere to the belief if Bethesda did not use the BoS there would a contingent of fanboys here at NMA clamoring for the BoS to appear again because Bethesda "Fucked up by making up their own shitty factions like the Institute!"
Now here you will think I am talking shit about NMA, or a Bethesda apologist, but really I see the human condition and fanboyism as something that much like war...never changes. It can be predicted to some extent.
They weren't wiped out. They retreated. That's the whole story there. Elijah was ousted as Elder and McNamara took over and led the surviving me members through the NCR assault and into Hidden Valley. Also explained in the game.
Also take into account the BOS aren't "The most badass soldiers in the wasteland", maybe the first generation was but an isolationist culture just leads to stagnation, and with them mostly having vr simulations as their only form of combat experience they are at a disadvantage if they have to make long journeys. Power armor offers protection but also calls attention, reduces mobility and it isn't the end all be all protection to the dangers of the Wastes. I think you know there is more than enough evidence of more advanced forces being defeated by a combination of terrain and guerrilla tactics, not to mention falling to disease.
The specifications of Power Armor as seen in the first games specifically says that T-51b can only resist 2500 joules of kinetic impact. This is not even close to being a tank. Here is a short table of some common cartridges kinetic energy, just for reference:
You mean his post full of assumptions? He talks like the city of Chicago is a whole state that you can't go around. Furthermore, the Legion didn't even exist when Fallout 3 came out outside of concept ideas for Van Buren which is where New Vegas got them from so if anything that's a fault in New Vegas and not Fallout 3.
I get he is on the bandwagon with you but nodding at everything he says just because he agrees with you is stupid. All he says is "hellhole" a bunch of times and "creatures that attack on sight." That's hardly an argument.
I don't see any argument from you at all. At least I base my "assumptions" on what the games and lore tells us.
Not to mention that Bethesda approved all the content in Fallout New Vegas (they didn't allow Obsidian to include quite a few things in FNV for example an entire town, because it would clash with their lore somehow) and even uses some stuff from Van Buren too, so it's obvious they consider at least some Van Buren as canon.
Not to mention that the Midwest BoS didn't only controlled Chicago, it controlled a huge territory. But even with their "technological superiority" it struggles to survive (and by what Elder Lyons and Rothchild say in Fallout 3, the Midwest BoS must have lost a lot of territory since they couldn't find them at all).
The grey zone is the Midwest BoS territory:
Now tell me how could a technological superior faction with power armor lose all of that land if the place was peaceful and nice?
Want another stupid thing about Fallout 3 BoS lore? They say that the West BoS would send reinforcements and supplies from time to time, but stopped after they discovered Elder Lyons disobeyed their direct orders, so not only does the game wants us to believe that Lyons expedition successfully reached Washington DC, but during the years others did too. Even when in Fallout 3 itself, they say that the West BoS is also struggling .
Also another note about BoS and power armor, Power Armor is shit. Fully armored BoS didn't last in the glow by themselves .
And in Fallout 3 people in the BoS say that Super Mutants can rip open a PA and remove the soldiers from inside, like they were canned food.
They weren't wiped out. They retreated. That's the whole story there. Elijah was ousted as Elder and McNamara took over and led the surviving me members through the NCR assault and into Hidden Valley. Also explained in the game.
Not totally but the way you hear people talk here and elsewhere - they are practically non-existent. According to this throwaway line in New Vegas, they are still kicking ass in California. I find it interesting.
I said LIKE A TANK Rise....addressing the rest.
The Midwestern BoS for one tried to expand and control the area. That is harder than simply moving through. These dudes held the largest territory of land in the series. They had to use vehicles to do it, which the NCR is supposed to have in limited supply. Only the Fallout 4 BoS can really compare to their force projection with them now having Zeppelins and all this new CANON SHATTERING flying power armor and shit, but I digress...
The Great Plains region would be pretty lawless in general with the weapon numbers being what they are, and ammo plants like this one, holding millions of rounds for the taking. Since there are fewer cities the groups would be spread out, like the Tribes Caesar describes in his region. But like it was said earlier, this will become pointless when they say:
*Ron Perlman Voice*
The year is 2355 and the location is the Great Lakes Wastes. Before the Great War, Detroit was one of the most pleasant and wealthiest cities in America. By 2030 the Motor City was producing most of America's automobiles. During the Sino-American War Detroit produced most of the nation’s ammunition from 5.56mm to micro-fusion cells. When the bombs fell The Greats Lakes Megalopolis was protected from 90 % of the nukes by an Advanced Naval Missile-Defense Network, but the anarchy that followed was just as devastating. Those dark years were known as the Burning Times. Many bombs did make it through the missile shield; fires ran rampant throughout the cities, the people that could not make it to the vaults were forced to scavenge for food, so many desperate souls turned to cannibalism. A disease known as the Jitterbug soon spread to those who ate contaminated meat. Those afflicted by the disease (Known as Buggies) suffered from tremors, violent outbursts, constant pain, and horrible dementia. Millions were slaughtered in those first few decades as the Jitterbug virus ran rampant and society crumbled, but there was hope on the horizon.
From the ruins of a Naval Base near Chicago the Great Lakes Confederation was formed. The founders were made up of the US Navy stationed in the area that had protected them from the incoming missiles. The GLC founded Great Lake City and began the process of rebuilding civilization in the surrounding areas. They quickly used their military expertise to set up supply routes along the Great Lakes, occupy nearby towns, and defend against enemy resistance. In the following years they were a beacon of hope for the survivors of the apocalypse.
The GLC has now revitalized the Detroit area with new businesses, supplies, and protection. A uneasy truce is upheld inside Detroit between the competing factions. Any violence will be met with deadly force from the GLC Troops. They have established a network of communities with a thriving supply route known as the Iron Road. The Road runs from Chicago, Detroit, Cleveland, all the way to the Pitt.
Various factions have begun to struggle for control. One such group is known as the Brotherhood of Steel. They were deemed heretics by their original clan, so they were cast out years ago, nearly defeated by many enemies, but they are quickly converting local tribes to their cause. They struggled for many years until they stumbled across the Great Lakes Wastes. It was there in Detroit that they settled due to its pre-war manufacturing resources, but conflicts have quickly escalated in recent years. They are coming into contact with the GLC and quickly turning hostile. The GLC is not tolerant of outside parties settling in the region, especially ones with such advanced technology. Emissaries have been sent, but no message has returned. Meanwhile on the horizon a new threat rises...
I think a bunch of sheltered, full of themselves inbred kids in Power armor who think they are invinicible because of their pew pews and shiny armors would be the more likely population to die by getting over ambitious and cocky.
Want more proof that in Fallout 3 Power Armor is also not supposed to be like a Tank?
The BoS has been fighting the mutants for 20 years and yet the best they managed to do was contain them to prevent them from spreading and increase their numbers (nevermind that there is no more FEV, so their numbers will never increase again).
They are in a standstill against dumb green orcs where the majority of them are brutes that use wooden boards, baseball bats, assault rifles and hunting rifles, and where only 1% of them use heavier and more powerful weapons.
So if Super Mutants can beat down BoS using those weapons, so can raiders, tribals, settlers, etc who use them too.
Also in Fallout 3 they decided that Deathclaws ignore all DR, which means that doesn't matter if you wear a PA or a business suit, the Deathclaw deals the same damage. So by Fallout 3 lore, deathclaws shred any type of armor and so does anyone who crafts a Deathclaw Gauntlet.
Want more proof that in Fallout 3 Power Armor is also not supposed to be like a Tank?
The BoS has been fighting the mutants for 20 years and yet the best they managed to do was contain them to prevent them from spreading and increase their numbers (nevermind that there is no more FEV, so their numbers will never increase again).
They are in a standstill against dumb green orcs where the majority of them are brutes that use wooden boards, baseball bats, assault rifles and hunting rifles, and where only 1% of them use heavier and more powerful weapons.
So if Super Mutants can beat down BoS using those weapons, so can raiders, tribals, settlers, etc who use them too.
Also in Fallout 3 they decided that Deathclaws ignore all DT, which means that doesn't matter if you wear a PA or a business suit, the Deathclaw deals the same damage. So by Fallout 3 lore, deathclaws shred any type of armor and so does anyone who crafts a Deathclaw Gauntlet.
Sure, if you take into account they were using all that shitty T45 and they ruined the Power Armor in the first place.
See...this is where you lose me. Being disingenuous and saying PEACEFUL AND NICE. Who said it was peaceful and nice anywhere in the wasteland? The BoS would have taken heavy losses. Enough to where they would need to fuck a lot to pop some more troops out since they are Xenophobes by the time the dumbass F3 protagonist comes along.
My point is they gave them shittier armor and degraded the PA strength to where it portrays them as pussies. We all know the damage resistance debate. That is part of it.
See...this is where you lose me. Being disingenuous and saying PEACEFUL AND NICE. Who said it was peaceful and nice anywhere in the wasteland? The BoS would have taken heavy losses.
CT Phipps said so. When he compared the BoS expedition to Lewis and Clark. He said the unknown wasteland would be so peaceful that settlements would be willing to help the BoS and there would be caravans traveling all over that would also help the BoS...
My point is they gave them shittier armor and degraded the PA strength to where it portrays them as pussies. We all know the damage resistance debate. That is part of it.
And that is why me and others keep saying that by Fallout 3 standards and lore, it doesn't make any sense that the BoS managed to not only have the manpower and supplies to send a successful expedition to the other side of the country, but that they actually reached it and had enough numbers to fight a giant army of Super Mutants that by their own words "would have already overrun the capital wasteland and it's settlements".
The thread is about our opinion on the BoS on Fallout 3 and Fallout 4. And lets be honest, by Fallout 3 lore, it makes no sense that the BoS managed to do what they say they did in the game.
And it just gets worst, in Fallout 4 we learn that the East Coast BoS managed to make contact with the West Coast one at 2287, and it receives support from them, allowing them to grow and manage to control the Capital Wasteland and they plan on control the entire Eastern Seaboard. Now this is even more idiotic because there's no chance in hell that the West Coast BoS could send supplies and fortify the East Coast because of them being locked in their bunkers and having lost most of their troops and supplies because of the war with the NCR and Caesar's Legion existing and all of that (the war which is still going and since Fallout 4 came out after FNV, totally destroys Pwener "argument" about game releases dates).
So to answer this thread, I will have to say that Fallout 3 and 4 BoS make no sense being there and make no sense getting reinforcements and supplies from the West Coast BoS, using the lore and canonicity approved by Bethesda.
EDIT: I also forgot to mention that the trip couldn't have been that bad, since Sarah Lyons was part of the expedition and she was only 3 years old, and Arthur Maxon was sent from the West Coast BoS to the East one during the BoS NCR war after his father died (which already shows how the West Coast BoS somehow managed to still send troops and supplies during the damn war, this also shows that Bethesda does acknowledge the BoS and NCR war in Fallout 3) while he was just a little kid too. So kids manage to survive that long and dangerous trek, while not using PA... I don't buy it.
CT Phipps said so. When he compared the BoS expedition to Lewis and Clark. He said the unknown wasteland would be so peaceful that settlements would be willing to help the BoS and there would be caravans traveling all over that would also help the BoS...
And that is why me and others keep saying that by Fallout 3 standards and lore, it doesn't make any sense that the BoS managed to not only have the manpower and supplies to send a successful expedition to the other side of the country, but that they actually reached it and had enough numbers to fight a giant army of Super Mutants that by their own words "would have already overrun the capital wasteland and it's settlements".
The thread is about our opinion on the BoS on Fallout 3 and Fallout 4. And lets be honest, by Fallout 3 lore, it makes no sense that the BoS managed to do what they say they did in the game.
And it just gets worst, in Fallout 4 we learn that the East Coast BoS managed to make contact with the West Coast one at 2287, and it receives support from them, allowing them to grow and manage to control the Capital Wasteland and they plan on control the entire Eastern Seaboard. Now this is even more idiotic because there's no chance in hell that the West Coast BoS could send supplies and fortify the East Coast because of them being locked in their bunkers and having lost most of their troops and supplies because of the war with the NCR (which is still going and since Fallout 4 came out after FNV, totally destroying Pwener "argument" about game releases dates).
So to answer this thread, I will have to say that Fallout 3 and 4 BoS make no sense being there and make no sense getting reinforcements and supplies from the West Coast BoS, using the lore and canonicity approved by Bethesda.
Ok, that is clearly nonsense, but CT Phipps was right still about Lewis and Clark. You said they had 30 men. Well, the BoS had at least that. You say they had support? Look at Fallout Tactics. Do all the Tribals try to kill the BoS? We have to look at the cultures in the region, population dispersal, possible paths they could have taken...it isn't covered much in game because they can write it off. Shit like that can happen. Lyon is practically idolized after that trip.
Side Comment Of Interest: Lyon Estates in Back to the Future.
My only purpose was to show that they could make the voyage across, without getting raped by ignorant hill tribes and giant ants. Their ideological shift I can even understand because people, while prone to being zealots, also tend to think for themselves when they have direct experiences that contradict their beliefs.
Now when you start getting into would the West support the East and so on? That is total retardation that is simply Bethesda lending credence to their shitty BoS Chapter that wants to save the Wasteland with bottled water. All of that is nonsense. That being said they were better in Fallout 4 because they were a force to be reckoned with, concerned with technology again, and generally less "White Knightlike"...yet still they fail miserably with Ad Victoriam!!!!
We don't know how many the BoS send on their expedition. The game never says numbers.
Also if the BoS was already locked in their bunkers because of the tremendous losses in NCR war. How would they be able to have a force of 30 BoS coming out of Lost Hill (which is pretty much sieged by NCR, but it will not be assaulted because of the fear that the BoS would explode it with stuff like nukes) and that is in the middle of NCR territory? And traveling through the Legion Territory? And then they kept sending reinforcements and supplies too?
See? That is the problem with FO3 BoS. Nothing in the game holds up when compared with it's own lore, never mind the previous official lore too.
Even Fallout Tactics BoS only managed to reach Chicago because they used a prototype airship that ended up crashing there.
If I was going to write that the BoS managed to reach the East Coast, I would just make it so that they are Midwest BoS instead. Those had vehicles and a huge territory.
They were not at war with anything anymore, they are way closer, they are expansive, there wouldn't be NCR or Legion to meddle with anything, they recruit outside of the "order" and they are more sympathetic towards wastelanders.
It's the perfect opportunity to have an already established and recognizable organization, but that would still allow an almost blank-state for me to mess around with in the game.
It would also make more sense in terms of established lore. The Midwest BoS territory borders with the Legion territory. The Midwest Elders could be worried about the Legion turning their eyes towards the east and attack. So, following information from a terminal or pre-war military facility about Liberty Prime, the Elders decide to send an expedition to reach the Pentagon and secure and repair Liberty Prime, secondary mission, to recruit and "conquer" the Capital Wasteland and then expand both from the Midwest and Capital Wasteland in a pincer "attack" to control the whole East Coast. With all of that territory, Liberty Prime, whatever else they could get (like tech, knowledge, weapons, etc), they would be a force that even the Legion couldn't deal with.
We don't know how many the BoS send on their expedition. The game never says numbers.
Also if the BoS was already locked in their bunkers because of the tremendous losses in NCR war. How would they be able to have a force of 30 BoS coming out of Lost Hill (which is pretty much sieged by NCR, but it will not be assaulted because of the fear that the BoS would explode it with stuff like nukes) and that is in the middle of NCR territory? And traveling through the Legion Territory? And then they kept sending reinforcements and supplies too?
See? That is the problem with FO3 BoS. Nothing in the game holds up when compared with it's own lore, never mind the previous official lore too.
Even Fallout Tactics BoS only managed to reach Chicago because they used a prototype airship that ended up crashing there.
If I was going to write that the BoS managed to reach the East Coast, I would just make it so that they are Midwest BoS instead. Those had vehicles and a huge territory.
They were not at war with anything anymore, they are way closer, they are expansive, there wouldn't be NCR or Legion to meddle with anything, they recruit outside of the "order" and they are more sympathetic towards wastelanders.
It's the perfect opportunity to have an already established and recognizable organization, but that would still allow an almost blank-state for me to mess around with in the game.
It would also make more sense in terms of established lore. The Midwest BoS territory borders with the Legion territory. The Midwest Elders could be worried about the Legion turning their eyes towards the east and attack. So, following information from a terminal or pre-war military facility about Liberty Prime, the Elders decide to send an expedition to reach the Pentagon and secure and repair Liberty Prime, secondary mission, to recruit and "conquer" the Capital Wasteland and then expand both from the Midwest and Capital Wasteland in a pincer "attack" to control the whole East Coast. With all of that territory, Liberty Prime, whatever else they could get (like tech, knowledge, weapons, etc), they would be a force that even the Legion couldn't deal with.
If anyone in the world has a reason to seize that kind of technology, it is clearly the midwest BoS. They were on a big scale war with machines in the past, they know the potential of such technology.
As for the fact that even the midwest only reached Chicago, let's also point out that they do not have any kind of radio contact with the west. It would take about one radio tower every 40-50 miles or so to maintain radio contact with Maxson State. Yet, apparently, Lyons little party, who managed not to find the very nation they were crossing, managed to keep radio contact with the council of elders. For years.
Which means that they just gave the midwest brotherhood radio contact with the council of elders too, and apparently, nothing happened. New Vegas actually tried to solve the problem, by having scribes not even knowing who Maxson is, when questioned by Caesar.
And that is why me and others keep saying that by Fallout 3 standards and lore, it doesn't make any sense that the BoS managed to not only have the manpower and supplies to send a successful expedition to the other side of the country, but that they actually reached it and had enough numbers to fight a giant army of Super Mutants that by their own words "would have already overrun the capital wasteland and it's settlements".
Which is also another plot hole by itself. If the super mutants could have overrun the capital settlement, they would have done it. They were there 180 years before the Brotherhood arrived, and yet, despite having zero force to oppose them, they did not manage to even seize any kind of territory. For 180 years.
.
