50 Minutes of 76

[SquidWard]

another mystery is how come bethesda's fans are losing their shit now but still like f3 and f4 which were equally absurd?

Considering it was a lot of young console players first time in a quasi-RPG sandbox and if it wasn't, it was probably Oblivion before F3 or Skyrim before F4. They're going to love it. The games are accessible, they aren't too hard, they're clear in what your decisions lead to (good/bad karma as a MAJOR focus in 3), hard to really fuck up your character build as well. After that, it makes sense. They're only mad at 76 because it's multiplayer, not much else.

But Fallout 76 isn't that. It's an obvious cashgrab. A buggy mess even by Bethesda standards. It's half a Fallout game to the nu-fans and worse yet the half they get is just recycled out of Fallout 4.

Eh, I'd say just about anything a company of Bethesda's stature is a "cashgrab." They don't care so much about the artistic integrity as they do money. Same goes probably for most in this industry, we just usually appreciate it when someone is allowed to use their visions a bit more than others. I think the 90s were a great time for that because a lot of different games could sell so artistic ideas had more flexing room and could still bring the studios the money they wanted. There is some datamined info about 76 that implies some more ideas and stuff for the game. One of them is Team Deathmatch events/arenas/something. I don't know how well that will fly, but they're not seemingly just going throw this game out and not update it. It has an in-game shop that has real money as an option. They're gonna probably update it with at least something somewhat meaningful to the playerbase if the revenue says it's worth it.

Fallout 3 and 4, the way I see it, are toys. In the same vein as people don't take Super Mario too seriously neither do Bethesda take Fallout seriously and the fans are probably along that same mindset.

I mean, mostly yeah. It's that brand hype and brand recognition I've always told others about with it. Mario doesn't have to be consistent for most things. Fallout doesn't either. Give them Enclave, Supermutants, Brotherhood of Steel, and 50s music. And apparently as long as it's singleplayer, most of the fanbase will buy it without question.

 

[sesom]

Considering it was a lot of young console players first time in a quasi-RPG sandbox and if it wasn't, it was probably Oblivion before F3 or Skyrim before F4. They're going to love it. The games are accessible, they aren't too hard, they're clear in what your decisions lead to (good/bad karma as a MAJOR focus in 3), hard to really fuck up your character build as well. After that, it makes sense. They're only mad at 76 because it's multiplayer, not much else.

I suspected that too. But actually no ... it seems to go further reading a lot on Reddit.

 

[Mr Fish]

Eh, I'd say just about anything a company of Bethesda's stature is a "cashgrab." They don't care so much about the artistic integrity as they do money.

That's too broad of a definition for a cashgrab to me.

Fallout 3 has all new assets, they had to rework the gameplay to suit the pip-boy design, to add in projectiles, to add in a VATS system. Same with Fallout 4. They put half a decade at the very least into both of those games individually. That's not a cashgrab. It's steamlining for a wider market appeal. A cashgrab is something where there is very little effort put into something and pricing it unfairly for what it is.

 

[TorontoReign]

Best. Fallout. Yet.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/erikka...will-be-the-no-mans-sky-of-2018/#498966085e4f

Dude does a good Walken impression.

 

[Gonzalez]

another mystery is how come bethesda's fans are losing their shit now but still like f3 and f4 which were equally absurd?

See? We are finally getting our revenge on the F3/4 fans. Muhahahahaha!

As for the PVP, haven't even wanted to try it. Had a couple of run ins with other players in which we pointed at each other and then lowered our guns after realizing we weren't just one more of the wasteland monsters.

I think most people are playing this game solo, at least on the servers I was in. Maybe cooperating for an event or a "quest" on occasion. Either because they really want to play that way or because they realize PVP sucks.

Personally I would have PVP and PVE servers, or be able to engage on PVP after an agreed upon request, rather than make it that anyone can attack you but try to mitigate it with damage reduction etc.

The game so far has been unimpressive. I wouldn't say underwhelming because I wasnt' expecting much to begin with. I think the game has potential if they are seriously going to continue to add content and updates, or if there is stuff we haven't yet seen that makes the game cooler with further progression.

So far I stand with what I said before, the experience is not worth 60$ but it can well be worth 30$ for the right audience. At least from what I've played thus far. And the biggest potential for this game are new players, not old ones. If that's what Bethesda is going for they are actually not doing too bad, as long as they fix the bugs and the performance issues.

Just face it, they are not loyal to you and they owe you nothing, they are going for someting completely different and I can actually see how this could turn into a real success for them, at least financially. I do not wish them ill, in fact I hope they suceed and, who knows, maybe the game wil improve to the point it can actually be worth what they are charging for it. But it will take both technical and gameplay improvements, and lots of them.

 

[SquidWard]

I think the game has potential if they are seriously going to continue to add content and updates, or if there is stuff we haven't yet seen that makes the game cooler with further progression.

I agree with this so far. The game is nothing stellar and it's nothing Fallout besides the way it looks and the general setting of nuclear wastelands. That it makes Bethesda fans mad that Bethesda is "evolving Fallout" makes me laugh too since they tried to apply that sort of argument to me before.

 

[TorontoReign]

It's a shame to see people buying this garbage.

 

[Walpknut]

Oh Geez Rick, this game is so boring.
Sh-sh-*BUUUUURP* Shut the fuck up Morty, they are payin' us to play it.

I also saw them release some promo videos with someone who I assume is like a popular Basketball player. It's such an obvious disgusting sell out, I was okay with the game being a piece of shit, bu this amount of whoring out is just going beyond.

 

[The Dutch Ghost]

Oh Geez Rick, this game is so boring.
Sh-sh-*BUUUUURP* Shut the fuck up Morty, they are payin' us to play it.

I also saw them release some promo videos with someone who I assume is like a popular Basketball player. It's such an obvious disgusting sell out, I was okay with the game being a piece of shit, bu this amount of whoring out is just going beyond.

Well as you know that is now happening with any merchandise that used to have a nerdy reputation. A normy demonstrating to others that this product isn't just for basement dwelling, comic book reading (which reputable nerd still reads comics these days? Well I still do some of course but definitely nothing from the Big Two), media merchandise collecting (who else buys Star Trek toys, anime statues, replica weapons and other overpriced crap?), convention going, endless debating on aspects of movies & books & games, and often science loving introverts who prefer to be among their own peers because at least these often know what you are talking about when you bring up a subject like Farscape.

There is currently this talk going on among right leaning Youtubers that Europe is importing economic migrants in order to replace the native population and ensuing that the "liberal" leaderships (not sure if I would call them liberal anymore) in countries and the EU government in Brussels will be re elected (and to provide cheap labor to the economic sector that seeks to slash payments) repeatedly again in the future; installing a voting base that will surely vote for you if you will. This group doesn't necessarily exist but they hope to create them.

I am starting to feel that the media industry, not just the gaming industry, is working on this plan to replace its previous focus groups that used to buy their products with a new group that will buy products that do not require as much design and consistency (quality of writing if you will) as their old franchises did in order to attract this new fandom they have in mind, having to actively create it themselves rather than that it forms naturally.

Of course it is all about money but you have to make sure that there plenty of people who actually want to buy your products to pay for the production costs and supply the extra profits the sometimes ridiculous lifestyles of the management depends on.
It is a shame that they can't charge people yet to be able to watch a trailer or play a demo.

 

[Hulk'O'Saurus]

Of course it is all about money but you have to make sure that there plenty of people who actually want to buy your products to pay for the production costs and supply the extra profits the sometimes ridiculous lifestyles of the management depends on.

I am starting to feel that the media industry, not just the gaming industry, is working on this plan to replace its previous focus groups that used to buy their products with a new group that will buy products that do not require as much design and consistency (quality of writing if you will) as their old franchises did in order to attract this new fandom they have in mind, having to actively create it themselves rather than that it forms naturally.

The dreaded reality of smart nerds.

One possible problem arising with from that is lowering the IQ in humans. Far from the only possible cause, mind you, but one among them, still.

Regardless, an excellent observation.
​

 

[nighty]

It is a shame that they can't charge people yet to be able to watch a trailer or play a demo.

Might have overread the sarcasm there, but in case of F76 they clearly DID the latter.

 

[Walpknut]

I don't think Bethesda is seeking to create any new audience, they are just continuing their trend of going for what is popular and now that they have money they are even employing big studio tactics like paying big Streamers and athletes to appear in their commercials even if it's the cheesiest shit on the planet.

I don't know what they are doing tapping into Ninja's fanbase seeing how it's mostly preteens and the game is still Mrated I would assume.

It's a complete sell out. Simple as that. Fallout can no longer be satire of consumerist culture, because it officially represents it.

 

[TheHouseAlwaysWins]

There is currently this talk going on among right leaning Youtubers that Europe is importing economic migrants in order to replace the native population and ensuing that the "liberal" leaderships (not sure if I would call them liberal anymore) in countries and the EU government in Brussels will be re elected (and to provide cheap labor to the economic sector that seeks to slash payments) repeatedly again in the future; installing a voting base that will surely vote for you if you will. This group doesn't necessarily exist but they hope to create them.

That's a neo nazi conspiracy. So what is actually happening is that Germany started to import immigrants during the 70's (If I remember right it was to fill in the missing population from events like the world wars) and they started to import in more migrants as the economy grows. Japan is facing a similar problem with their economy where the population is stagnant even though their economy is groing and there is not enough labor present for it so Japan will likely face some kind of problems.

There are lots of people on Youtube trying to spread fascism as a religion so you shouldn't believe what you see on the internet at first glance just because a lot of people are parroting it.

I am starting to feel that the media industry, not just the gaming industry, is working on this plan to replace its previous focus groups that used to buy their products with a new group that will buy products that do not require as much design and consistency (quality of writing if you will) as their old franchises did in order to attract this new fandom they have in mind, having to actively create it themselves rather than that it forms naturally.

Video games are toys and so I don't think it's anymore wise to compare them to politics anymore than it is to compare politics to Harry Potter. The majority of people don't give a shit about video games like they do about something serious like politics.

 

[SquidWard]

Fallout can no longer be satire of consumerist culture, because it officially represents it.

Actually seeing it put into words like that makes me kinda sick, you're right.

I am starting to feel that the media industry, not just the gaming industry, is working on this plan to replace its previous focus groups that used to buy their products with a new group that will buy products that do not require as much design and consistency (quality of writing if you will) as their old franchises did in order to attract this new fandom they have in mind, having to actively create it themselves rather than that it forms naturally.

You're right in my books. Star Wars may have been the first blockbuster but we live in the age of blockbusters, hypemen, and hypetrains. People preorder and go to releases of anything the first day out of hype, they gotta make sure they can be excited as everyone else will be at the same time!
C'mon you haven't seen Infinity War on the opening week? YEESH are you even a nerd? Here's my nerd card! I bought Red Dead Redemption 2 on launch day! C'mon keep up man!
I see it a lot. I also see a lot of validation among people (kinda like I mocked above). Gotta prove you're a "real gamer" or a "nerd" now. It's not quite gatekeeping but if you aren't keeping up you don't seem as interested as the rest of the masses. It's the excitable people that don't smell the bullshit that will rake them in the money. The same people that defended Battlefront 2's lootboxes and monetization to me.
That's not to say none of us, certainly not me, have never been a victim to this. But I preorder one or two games a year at most and I still want to stop preordering. I don't ever buy a game on launch outside of those one or two preorders I make.

I'm not going into actual politics on this thread, just the state of the media and its practices especially the gaming ones.

 

[nighty]

@TorontRayne : Thanks for sharing. I will mentally replace any statement of Todd or Pete with "Wubba Lubba dub dub" now.

@Walpknut : Good point there. But F76 is only the latest step of this path. Accessibility - or what we like to call the "dumbing down" of recent games is just one part of this process, the part you highlighted is the marketing-bravado to accompany it.
The complaints about what voice-chat in F76 has to offer seeems to back up your point perfectly, too.

 

[Gonzalez]

More playing and yes, the game gets boring fast. It better not be just this, because it's certainly not worth 60 USD. Bugs aside.

It's a complete sell out. Simple as that. Fallout can no longer be satire of consumerist culture, because it officially represents it.

Sorry but, where were you in 2008? Because this is old news for me, like ten years ago news. And the irony is even better for me because Fallout 2 is a 1998 game. I can't help but savour other people's ourtage rather than feel any outrage myself. Sorry, what can I say.

I guess it's like that Tzun Tzu quote? "If you wait by the river long enough, the bodies of your enemies will float by."

 

[SquidWard]

More playing and yes, the game gets boring fast.

How far along are you? I know someone hit around level 50, no idea how. I figured it's got to have decent endgame if they played it this incessantly in beta. But then again, they are a well off streamer so they can invest time like that into something whether or not they fully enjoyed it because it's making them money at the same time.

I'd be inclined to play a lot more shit mainstream games if it made me money at the same time instead of the few I play every year.

 

[Gonzalez]

I'm level 15. It gets boring solo so I started doing weird shit, like stalking a lower level player in a creepy location at night, sometimes killing the enemies around him with a scoped hunting rifle in a "mysterious stranger" kinda way, while hearing him comment to his friends how creeped out he was, and then walking up to him and join him and the guy saying how some creepy guy was stalking him. That was fun.

But then you try to join other players and because there is no push to talk everyone has the voice setting off and can't be bothered to turn it on, so they ignore you/can't even have a conversation with them like if they were the replacement for the NPC's they were trying to create. It soon gets very lonely and boring with no NPC's and players that will, not only show no interest in taging along with you, but completely ignore you.

 

[Kommie]

So what is actually happening is that Germany started to import immigrants during the 70's (If I remember right it was to fill in the missing population from events like the world wars

importing economic migrants in order to replace the native population

You just said what he said

 

[Walpknut]

@Walpknut : Good point there. But F76 is only the latest step of this path. Accessibility - or what we like to call the "dumbing down" of recent games is just one part of this process, the part you highlighted is the marketing-bravado to accompany it.
The complaints about what voice-chat in F76 has to offer seeems to back up your point perfectly, too.

Accesibility is a good thing, but this isn't accesibility. This is just whoring out the game. Because if we were to talk about accesibility this game completely fails at it, with clunk interfaces and lack of options for players.

Sorry but, where were you in 2008? Because this is old news for me, like ten years ago news. And the irony is even better for me because Fallout 2 is a 1998 game. I can't help but savour other people's ourtage rather than feel any outrage myself. Sorry, what can I say.

I guess it's like that Tzun Tzu quote? "If you wait by the river long enough, the bodies of your enemies will float by."

There is a different level of sell out here. One thing is to retool the game to follow trends which is something Bethesda has been doing more and more each game, there is another level where you pay a Basketball team to wear an ad for your game while partering with Microsoft and then holding a stream with Ninja, Justin Roiland and Logic being paid to play it.