Bethesda's Lore Recons

So now Ghouls are zombies or what the fuck? The kid was in a fridge for over two hundred years. I thought they needed to eat but I assumed I remembered incorrectly. That is one for the books I guess.
 
Someguy37 said:
The Dutch Ghost said:
You do have to understand that this was basically Obsidian having to go along with an idea that Bethesda had first introduced in Fallout 3; instant Ghoulification when some people are exposed to severe radiation.
Click to expand...
I am aware, and that really doesn't change anything.

If Obsidian didn't like the idea, they could have very easily ignored it, and left it as the one off case of Moria Brown it was in Fallout 3.

They especially didn't have to make the majority of the enemies in their final, main game and DLC spanning story arc completing, DLC a result of the same thing.
Click to expand...

They really can't in this case because they don't own the rights to the IP and it would retcon what Bethesda has retconned.
At best Obsidian could only lessen the retcons of Bethesda such as for example explaining where the different model of plasma rifle came from, it being a redesign that was developed by REPCONN.

Bethesda now has the final say and could easily had retconned a lot of stuff from Fallout New Vegas in Fallout 4. For example that the NCR since Hoover Dam has now completely expanded across the Mid West and now borders on the East Coast.
Or that the West Coast Brotherhood defeated the NCR and now rules it.
 
Someguy37 said:
Walpknut said:
Yeah and a drug turnning someone into a Ghoul is the retarded part. New Vegas even had a character that was trying to become a Ghoul but failed as those are supposed to be RARE.
Click to expand...
New Vegas also had an entire NCR camp, Searchlight, all transform into ghouls in literally moments after the Legion opened up canisters of nuclear material from before the war that were being stored in the firestation. It was so recent one of the few guys who was stationed there, but was outside the camp when it happened, is still patrolling the area around it warning people off because no one really knows about it yet.

Not only was it mass ghoulification, it was also instant ghoulfication.

The same thing happened in the Divide as well, mass ghoulifcation, as well as near instant ghoulfication.
Click to expand...

They didn't transform into ghouls immediately. There is nothing to support that they turned "moments later", we just know how it is by the start if the game, also most people in searchlight actually died from the radioactivity, only a copuple of troops ghoulified. It stands to reason that it could've taken days for it to happen, you can even find some Ghoul troopers in the mountains, maybe some of them fled the camp but succumbed to radiation poisoning and eventually Ghoulification and flocked back into Searchlight because of the radiation feeling comfortable to Ghouls.

Also the Divide didn't Ghoulify everyone, and the status of the marked men as Ghouls is debatable as they lack skin entirely because of the storms of the divide and the explosions of the Nukes, they could easily be another type of mutant entirely and it's stated that if they ever left the divide they would just drop dead because radiation is the only thing keeping their skinless bodies alive at that point.
 
Walpknut said:
They didn't transform into ghouls immediately. There is nothing to support that they turned "moments later", we just know how it is by the start if the game, also most people in searchlight actually died from the radioactivity, only a copuple of troops ghoulified. It stands to reason that it could've taken days for it to happen, you can even find some Ghoul troopers in the mountains, maybe some of them fled the camp but succumbed to radiation poisoning and eventually Ghoulification and flocked back into Searchlight because of the radiation feeling comfortable to Ghouls.

Also the Divide didn't Ghoulify everyone, and the status of the marked men as Ghouls is debatable as they lack skin entirely because of the storms of the divide and the explosions of the Nukes, they could easily be another type of mutant entirely and it's stated that if they ever left the divide they would just drop dead because radiation is the only thing keeping their skinless bodies alive at that point.
Click to expand...
Also worth noting that the Divide was destroyed around the time of the First Battle of Hoover Dam, so even if the Marked Men are ghouls, that is more than enough time for the effects to become visible.
 
Monco said:
It wasn't "literally" instant at all, nowhere does anyone say that the soldiers in searchlight were transformed instantaneously. It could have taken days or even weeks to happen, we don't really know for sure
Click to expand...

attachment.php


The Dutch Ghost said:
They really can't in this case because they don't own the rights to the IP and it would retcon what Bethesda has retconned.
Click to expand...

They "can't"? They couldn't not make Camp Searchlight?

Walpknut said:
They didn't transform into ghouls immediately. There is nothing to support that they turned "moments later", we just know how it is by the start if the game, also most people in searchlight actually died from the radioactivity, only a copuple of troops ghoulified. It stands to reason that it could've taken days for it to happen, you can even find some Ghoul troopers in the mountains, maybe some of them fled the camp but succumbed to radiation poisoning and eventually Ghoulification and flocked back into Searchlight because of the radiation feeling comfortable to Ghouls.
Click to expand...

"Ehi Jack, we have become Ghouls, the area is irradiated and if we absorb more radiation we'll go feral. What should we do?"
"Let's stay here"

-----

"Ehi Srgt. Astor, those ghouls are trying to enter Camp Searchlight. We should stop them"
"Why?"
"But...you are making us patrol non stop the area so that no-one will enter that irradiated hell hole."
"Lalalala, can't hear you".
 
Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 are not canon to me. So it doesn't matter what Bethesda says. Besides, what they decided to say happens to contradict a bunch of events with ghouls. No, ghouls turn crazy through the usual insanity. Hell, just look at their transformation, it makes sense a bunch of 'em goes insane after turning into walking corpses.

[edit]

On that note, I also don't consider ghouls turning "feral" in the first place to be canon. They can lose their minds and turn animalistic, sure, but they're far more Romero than they are 28 Days. For my next FNV playthrough I'm thinking of creating a mod that just removes feral ghouls completely and replace them with something like the crazed troopers at Searchlight. If I can lower their running speed by like 40% then that'd also be neat. Cause I ain't considering that shit to be canon in the slightest. Hell, if I could do it I'd change regular ghouls to look like deteriorating mangled corpses and not freaking burn victims as well. But I can only do so much. Fallout 1 trumps everything else and Fallout 1 says they can go mindless or be crazy. Not that they can turn into ferals that run faster than a healthy human being despite the fact that they look severely malnourished.
 
Last edited:
Stanislao Moulinsky said:
Mr Fish said:
Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 are not canon to me.
Click to expand...

New Vegas treats FO3 as canon, and in the dialogue with the soldiers they mention the "radiation turns ghouls into feral" thing. Are you going to ignore it because FO3 it's not canon to you?
Click to expand...
He THOUGHT that radiation might turn him feral, but there is no evidence to prove that. Obviously a private in the NCR isn't going to be a reliable source on the process of ghoulification
 
Stanislao Moulinsky said:
Mr Fish said:
Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 are not canon to me.
Click to expand...

New Vegas treats FO3 as canon, and in the dialogue with the soldiers they mention the "radiation turns ghouls into feral" thing. Are you going to ignore it because FO3 it's not canon to you?
Click to expand...
I am, because it conflicts with already established lore. I literally just went and talked to him and he's a soldier that just recently turned into a ghoul so obviously he is traumatized by this event and he's freaking out and speculating wildly. Sure, 'he' says that the radiation will turn him feral. But REPCONN kinda, yknow, contradicts that when the ghouls are down on the lethally irradiated launch room for however long you decide to take completing the quest and Bright tells us that he plans to take his flock to some place that is even worse off when it comes to radiation and if you launch them then the ending slide for Novac has them coming back and helping with the evacuation of the citizens.

So a soldier is freaking out because he just turned into a ghoul? And 'he' is supposed to be a reliable source of information?

I don't know why the rest of the camp turned feral and crazy, nor do I understand why Vault 34 turned out the same way. But radiation causing feralization contradicts a bunch of lore so I'd say there are other reason for why they turn crazy.

So okay, let's try to be fair here. Obviously Vault 34 and Searchlight happened. That's canon, we can't avoid that. But what are the circumstances for them turning into ghouls? Like... Let's put it like this, what if the brain burns out 'before' the transformation into a ghoul is complete and so by the time it 'is' complete they're already lost? That means that radiation doesn't turn ghouls crazy. It means that a certain amount of radiation during a certain amount of time during the process of ghoulification 'may' turn someone crazy.

We go by this then people can turn crazy or "feral", but ghouls can't. People during the process of turning into ghouls can. Ghoul who's finished the process and turned out sane can't. Would make one hell of a lot more sense than radiation turning ghouls cray cray.
 
Mr Fish said:
Like... Let's put it like this, what if the brain burns out 'before' the transformation into a ghoul is complete and so by the time it 'is' complete they're already lost? That means that radiation doesn't turn ghouls crazy. It means that a certain amount of radiation during a certain amount of time during the process of ghoulification 'may' turn someone crazy.

We go by this then people can turn crazy or "feral", but ghouls can't. People during the process of turning into ghouls can. Ghoul who's finished the process and turned out sane can't. Would make one hell of a lot more sense than radiation turning ghouls cray cray.
Click to expand...
That makes a lot of sense actually, maybe before they're ghoulified people's brains can be affected by the radiation in a way that makes them feral (it doesn't make any less sense then ghoulification) and that damaged brain is just carried over into the ghoul body. If someone receives enough radiation to damage their brain, but doesn't turn into a ghoul then they would just die of radiation poisoning so it wouldn't matter.
 
I found this mod: http://www.nexusmods.com/newvegas/mods/34933/?
It does the trick relatively well.
Now the only problem is that they don't have the speed on their side so they are piss easy...
Does anyone know of a mod that adds radiation to their attacks?
Oh and I'm definitely creating a mod that alters their name from "Feral Ghouls" into "Mindless One" or "Crazy" or something.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top