Many criticize Fallout 3 for everything that it supposedly does wrong, but many fail to see that Fallout 3, in many aspects, is the best Fallout game.
Hoo boy - what a start. I have a feeling where this is going to go. Don't worry, you're not the first one on the internet to come to NMA to try to preach about the "virtues" of Fallout 3 and why Todd Howard was god's gift to the series and I'm sure you're not the last. Despite the fact that this discussion has been done to death on this forum, I'll take a swing at this.
1. Atmosphere
Atmosphere is the center stone of every Fallout game. Fallout 3 excels at this, carving out a far superior atmosphere to any of the other games. Wandering through Downtown D.C. and the subway tunnels is harrowing, and an example of the brilliant tone set by the game.
I actually agree here... begrudgingly and with two huge asterisks - we'll get to that soon. The atmosphere of Fallout 3 was really good, the best I've seen
since Fallout 1 (big emphasis on "since", neither Fallout 3 nor any other game has done the post-nuclear atmosphere better than Fallout 1), even Fallout 2 had too much of a silly element to it's atmosphere. I had up until that point failed to see a game since Fallout 1 which captured the post-nuclear apocalypse atmosphere so well - although a few games like ATOM would take that crown. I'm pretty sure even the most hardcore haters of Fallout 3, at one point or another reflected on how good the atmosphere was. You do really get the feeling at many points in the game that you're trudging through a fairly-recently destroyed civilization, with the feeling of loneliness and desperation unshakeable in certain areas.
The Asterisks:
That being said... the atmosphere also makes no fucking sense considering the time period Fallout 3 is trying to go for. You're telling me 200 years after the war and the Capital Wasteland STILL looks this way? What in the flying fuck has humanity been doing for the past 200 years, sitting around huffing jet with it's thumb up it's ass? Bethesda could have easily circumvented this issue if they had set the game to take place around the time of Fallout 1, but they just
had to have the Enclave plot line. Speaking of - let's talk about the game world. The atmosphere is great, the
world and setting is great (even though that's really just chalked up to having the affinity and charisma of being Fallout) but you know what isn't great and fucking stupid? What's IN that world.
You've got Super Mutants, Enclave, BOS, gangsters, ghoulified Chinese spies(wtf?!), and so much absolute nonsense all condensed down into one small area that it's like somebody took every single thing that was ever in a Fallout game, threw it into a blender, and hit the "Fuck It" button. They took everything that people criticized Fallout 2 for being too silly and over-the-top of, and then turned the notch up to eleven. Super Mutants with no explanation as to why they're on the East Coast other than "yeah, so they took a cross country hike to escape the BOS and look for more FEV (something that was supposed to be unique to the Mariposa facility, a West Tek facility that created and was experimenting with it but for no reason at all is suddenly in a vault on the opposite side of the nation). The Enclave are there... besides the fact that their entire command and leadership was fucking atomized.
Oh, and for no reason, absolutely no fucking reason, Harold is there... on the East Coast. WHY?!? I'm guessing it was just so they could have an iconic character, and then look over at the old school fans and say "see? We listened". Also, D.C. is absolutely infested with ghouls like it got hit with a fucking zombie virus, this makes absolutely no sense. If ghoulification was that easy, why isn't L.A. and every other major city on the West Coast absolutely infested with the things? The conditions needed to create a ghoul were supposed to be very specific in the old lore, but for Bethesda, "fuck it". Apparently radiation = ghouls.
Bethesda - the pinnacle of "fuck it".
Anyways, I can probably write up a 5,000 word report on the D.C. area and Fallout 3 make no fucking sense at all. Then I could probably expand that to 25,000 words if I went and used all of the old archived threads we have here from the 08-10 era. But for now I'm hoping four paragraphs is enough to suffice.
2. Map Design
Not only does Fallout 3 have a better map design than any other Fallout game, but it also has the most free map design out of any Fallout game. Take for instance where the player starts the game on the map. It is pinpoint in the middle, not to North or the West and close to an invisible wall, deathclaw sanctuary or anything restricting. This effectively encourages exploration of it's already well-designed map.
This is... dumb. I'm sorry* but this is nonsense. First off, Fallout 3 literally copied and pasted Oblivion's map design philosophy for 75% of the map. Settlements, then surround said settlements with dungeons. Rinse and repeat until done. It's all very bland and shit is often in places that make absolutely no sense, like Tenpenny's skyscraper being literally in the middle of nowhere. On top of that, the actual settlements are pitifully tiny - if you didn't know anything about Fallout lore I wouldn't blame you if you thought the game was taking place just a few decades after the bombs fell (something they arguably should have done to justify how they made the world). Raiders outnumber people living in the settlements, and for some reason the Talon Mercenary Company is fucking massive. Who the hell are they taking jobs from that's making them so rich? Tenpenny? The Enclave (lol)?
Now let's talking about the
other 25% of the map, D.C. D.C. was done in the way that it was, being a couple of closed off zones interconnected via sewer and rail systems, because Bethesda didn't put in the time or effort to build a full city of ruins. Now I'm not even blaming them for anything, that's a huge task and it's makes sense why they did it the way they did (though it is fairly criticized). However, to act like it's a stroke of genius in map design and it was done to elicit a certain feeling or atmosphere from you... no. Just no. It was done so they could cut down on what otherwise would have been a massive amount of work hours and a sizeable portion of disk space (which, worrying about disk space was still definitely a thing in 2008). Many players understandably criticized the fact that while they were in D.C., they had to spend equal or almost more time in the metro and sewers than they did exploring the actual city.
* Disclaimer - Not actually sorry
3. Side Quests
Fallout 3 follows a philosophy of quality > quantity.
I'm going to stop you right here. No they don't. This has been talked about to death, and no they fucking don't. Maybe - maybe if this was a discussion on Morrowind I would say "yeah ok, I can definitely see that", but the side quests in Fallout 3 are almost all, with the exception of few, boring dungeon-delving dogshit with even worse writing. How many side quests can you honestly tell me weren't "go into this place and get a thing". On top of that, the side quest dialogue writing is just absolute ass. Complete ass, you won't even find that much ass on Kim Kardashian, Fallout 3's dialogue has so much ass.
While some have criticized it for having less side quests than several other Fallout games
Pretty sure that, including the DLC, Fallout 3 has more side quests than Fallout 2 (this may even be true than without the DLC). Standalone, Fallout 3 definitely has more sidequests than Fallout 1 so I'm really not sure where you're getting this "quality over quantity" thing, unless you're trying to criticize the radiant quest system so many games use today. In that case - yeah, I'd take Fallout 3's quests any day over radiant quests, but I think it's also fair to point out Bethesda now uses this very same system... in Fallout...
Fallout 3's side quests are arguably the best designed quests in the franchise.
Definitely opinion, not fact. And for reasons I explained above, given that the majority of Fallout 3's side quests are fetch quests "go get me this", I'm inclined to vehemently disagree. In fact I respect your opinion just a tiny bit less now because of how atrociously arrogant this line is.
Take for instance the Superhuman Gambit, an excellent showcase of how campy yet grounded Fallout can be, without straying into Wild Wasteland or Fallout 2 territories. The Power of The Atom showcases just how scenic and fun a side quest can be, as well as how impactful it can be on the environment.
Don't you think it's a problem you were only able to pull TWO quests up as examples of "good side quests"?*
Never before or after Fallout 3 has a side quest ever managed to pull this off.
Compared to, say:
* Infiltrating the local mob in Junktown
* Helping Set perform a coup d'etat and overthrow the Super Mutants in Necropolis
* Exploring the Glow
* Intervening in the gang wars in Adytum/Boneyard
* Working for the Thieves Guild in the Hub
And that's Fallout 1.
Fallout 1.
*Side Note - As I said above, the Superhuman Gambit is a perfect example of how Fallout 3 took Fallout 2's wackiness which was criticized and not as well received, and amplified it as if it was something people enjoyed. Poor oversight.
4. Factions
Fallout 3 possesses the most beloved and iconic factions in the franchise, the Enclave and the Brotherhood of Steel.
Lol. C'mon man. Just... come on. That's like saying "the Star Wars sequel trilogy possess some of the most beloved factions of the franchise, such as: the Jedi. The Sith. The Empire (remnants)! The Republic!" All those factions already existed, they built on foundations that had already been established for them, and Bethesda didn't really do much to change any of them except give the BOS altruism. This is kind of a moot point.
Some have criticized Fallout 3 for having an angelic BoS too uncharacteristic of Fallout 1's Brotherhood. This is addressed in lore in how the Brotherhood Outcasts came to exist.
The BOS Outcasts, especially given their sheer irrelevance to the greater world and plot, and small size, did not feel like that... it felt more like a "see, we know the lore" cop out. The way this should have been done would have been to have the Outcasts be the larger portion of the BOS, while Lyons and his group is a small and struggling offshoot. The Brotherhood of Steel, especially by 2277, are almost all raised in the Brotherhood itself, and thus since a young age are taught and indoctrinated in it's ideals. It would have made much more sense, and been more lore accurate, to have Lyons and his group be the small, struggling outcasts, NOT the other way around.
The BoS in Fallout 3 is Lyons' chapter of the BoS, who set aside their main goal of capturing technology to use it to help the Wasteland prosper. When combined with James's goal to purify the Potomac river, one can see why the BoS in Fallout 3 is so much more understandable and human than any other iteration of itself in the series.
No. No they can't. They were all specifically sent to the East Coast to look for and attain pre-war tech. Imagine a commanding officer takes his division across an entire country, and then tells his men "yeah... so remember the thing they told us to do? We're not going to do that, we're going to do the exact opposite and go AWOL. Cool? Cool." Better yet, here's a better analogy. Imagine a US division deploying into Afghanistan towards the beginning of the war. Then the Major General in command, the division C.O. turns to his men and tells them, "alright, we're supposed to be here to hunt down the Taliban, but fuck that. I've got a better idea. See those people over there in mud huts farming opium poppy that clearly don't want us here? They need our help, so what we're going to do is sit in their village and defend them, oh and also given them half of our MRE's and water".
5. Design
The outfits, the weapons, the armors, the miscellaneous items and the creature designs in Fallout 3 were all designed by Adam Adamowicz, who has been applauded and acclaimed by many Fallout fans for his unique style and take on Fallout, never seen before in the franchise. Not only have many of his designed been carved into the public perception of Fallout (the leather armor and T-45 come to mind), but his style combines with the atmosphere to give Fallout 3 an apocalyptic yet beautiful aesthetic that is synonymous with Fallout in 2021.
Eh... Alright, so some of the changes and aesthetics he made were pretty good, but again he already had a foundation to build off, and in the case of the T-45 all he really did was take the T-51b and give it sloped armor to give it a more old-school WWII tank-esque look. Not that big of an aesthetic improvement. The leather armor is VERY clearly based directly off Fallout 1's leather armor, who in turn based it off of what Mel Gibson wore in the Road Warrior. The only real difference is that they added some pads and belt straps here and there.
Again, everything you're appraising them for, are things they were already given hundreds upon hundreds of pieces of concept art and game files to build off of. It's like taking a story in the Star Wars extended universe and saying "look at all these cool, unique and original ideas!" Granted, while they're definitely are original concepts in the SW:EU, they were already given a massive foundation to work from.
If a whole is greater than the sum of it's parts, then Fallout 3 is not only a masterpiece in it's own right, but a masterpiece on the basis of it's own individual parts. Fallout 3 is a fun and enjoyable departure from the Borderlands-esque humor of Fallout 2 or New Vegas, while also being having more artistic sensibilities than Fallout 4.
I think the problem here, is that Fallout 3 fans are getting offended that original Fallout fans just flat out don't like the game, and because we were here first you guys not only feel backed into a corner but also like you're obligated to defend something you like. Guess what? You're not. We're just a bunch of fucking dudes on the internet who furiously masturbate over the glory of a video game that is old enough to drink, and older than most of Fallout 4's fanbase. While some might consider our opinion valuable as a site in all actuality our opinion doesn't mean jack shit or have an effect on anything really, Beth proved that after they blacklisted us and, even without our support was able to keep Fallout 3 chugging along to become a best seller and critically acclaimed game.
So let me put it this way. Fallout 3 is a good game in it's own right. Fallout 3 is NOT a good Fallout game.
EDIT & P.S.: If you noticed not many people here cared to write up a thought out response. That's because this argument is literally older than Fallout 3 is (it's been going on since FO3's development), we've all seen and had it a hundred times over, and most NMA posters kind of just want it to die because they're so sick of it. Only neckbearded fans like me still care enough to write up responses.
