Jeff Gardiner on aliens

[Crni Vuk]

ah but to have the "right" to do or change something doesnt mean that you HAVE to do it as well.

Who has the right today to the books and stories of Lord of the Rings today? Its Tolkies son. And do you see him release every year a new book? And changing the setting from a medieval-fantasy setting in to a horror-survival-sci-fi story? No you dont. Why? Cause the Story for it self is a masterpeace just how it is. And its great how it is.

This is Fallout 1, how it was and how it should have always been. A bit old by now, a bit "outdated". But a Masterpiece without any doubt.

This is the Fallout Bethesda would have loved to see and make. Awesomness and action without limits. And more modern then ever. If its Fallout? Who knows ... but Tactics was somewhat in that direction.

But sadly, THIS is the Fallout that we have got as Bethesda isnt even capable of making a game that would have somewhat a style for itself. (what do you expect from something based on Oblivion?)

 

[jero cvmi]

So, it's either guys who love the series and have money, or just the guys who love the series.

Or just the guys who have the money and dont give a fuck.

 

[Black]

So, it's either guys who love the series and have money, or just the guys who love the series.

I assume that the guy who have money and love the series refers to bethesda?
If so, quick question. How can you love a game you haven't even played? Because according to Meet the devs, majority of bethesda hasn't even played Fallout.
Or maybe Todd or Pete just said they all loved it and you believed them?

 

[Minorkos]

They also happen to have resources and the license to make their speculations a part of the franchise. Sure, most here agree that they're really not the ones to decide it, but neither are you. So, it's either guys who love the series and have money, or just the guys who love the series.

So basically your argument consists of incoherent sarcasm and a variation on the tired old "they have the license so everything they do fits by default and you should just accept it"?

I really don't understand what the problem is. They're making new games, which BARELY break the canon. There's around 5 million guys who like the game, and then there's around 17657 guys on this forum. A lot of this forum doesn't like the game.

Why do you want no one to play the game?

"They're raping the canon!"

Who decides what the canon is anymore? If you hate the canon breaking so much, just ignore that the game ever existed.

So, it's either guys who love the series and have money, or just the guys who love the series.

I assume that the guy who have money and love the series refers to bethesda?
If so, quick question. How can you love a game you haven't even played? Because according to Meet the devs, majority of bethesda hasn't even played Fallout.
Or maybe Todd or Pete just said they all loved it and you believed them?

Well, Todd and Pete are the guys deciding most of what the game has and so on. The rest are mere modelers, texturers, physics coders etc.

And yes, Todd and Pete have played them. Why do you insist on making this random claimings "No they haven't because I say so!" They've obviously played them, Todd even wrote how his encounter with the Master went in the first game. Something along these lines:

"I managed to kill the Master, but he unfortunately crippled my legs so I couldn't escape in time."

 

[Leon]

Why do you want no one to play the game?

Who wanted this? If other people enjoy the game, that's fine. I really don't think most of us here care about that. Just because other people like it doesn't mean that we have to.

And yes, Todd and Pete have played them.

It doesn't show.

 

[13pm]

There's around 5 million guys who like the game, and then there's around 17657 guys on this forum. A lot of this forum doesn't like the game.

Why do you want no one to play the game?

Ah, so you came to enlighten us, to show how blind we are? Okay. Thanks, dude.

Bethesda made it mainstream and put a lot of effort to hype it, so it's no surprise that many people liked it. It's a game where you don't have to think too much, it's a normal nu-gen game.

Yes, many people would've had problems if the game was like the originals. You know, the time has changed. People use twitter instead of blogs and forums and so on. Bethesda's making money and it's understandable.

The problem is that their game is fine for what it is, but doesn't resemble Fallout too much. It's their right to fuck it as they want for sure. The thing is the game is targeted on the different audience than the old fans.
We like to read, we like to think, we like to imagine. We want a clever game, not a dumbed-down straightforward railway RPGish shooter.

And yes, it's our problem that we're not the target audience of this game. It's just sad that we will hardly ever see games named Fallout ever resembling those we've played.
It's understandable why they took the Fallout title for the game that they could've titled with any other random name, it's understandable why they do put all those cheesy ideas into the game and DLCs.

So dude, don't enlighten us, 'kay? Nearly everyone here tried Fallout 3. Nobody is bashing it without his own reasons. You have your own reasons to like it. Just play the game you're enjoying and don't try to makes us change our minds

 

[Ravager69]

Geez, another flamefest.

Anyway, does anybody think that we will be able to have at least one conversation with the alien dudes?

 

[Leon]

Anyway, does anybody think that we will be able to have at least one conversation with the alien dudes?

Much like their evolution beyond the need for triggers, these aliens have evolved beyond the need for verbal communication and instead speak through lasers. Unfortunately, the Lone Wanderer misinterprets their friendly greetings as an attack, and the whole thing goes SNAFU.

 

[Brother None]

"I managed to kill the Master, but he unfortunately crippled my legs so I couldn't escape in time."

Uh, what? I might be wrong but I do believe crippled legs only lower action points in combat, there's no reason you wouldn't be able to walk out of the cathedral with crippled legs.

 

[IMissLark]

"I managed to kill the Master, but he unfortunately crippled my legs so I couldn't escape in time."

Uh, what? I might be wrong but I do believe crippled legs only lower action points in combat, there's no reason you wouldn't be able to walk out of the cathedral with crippled legs.

It's possible he was in combat the entire floor. Even once you kill The Master himself, you have the mutant sentrys, the eyebots, and I believe a few robed straglers back closer to the elevator who would keep you in combat.

Still, getting crippled limbs from gatling lasers is extremely rare. Criticals from that weapon normally bypass armor/instant death, so the story seems implausible.

 

[DexterMorgan]

There's around 5 million guys who like the game

Transformers 2 is making millions upon millions and is being watched by many, many people. It's still complete and utter shit, and Michael Bay is a pompous hack who couldn't film a good movie to save his life.

So what's your point?

 

[TwinkieGorilla]

Well, Todd and Pete are the guys deciding most of what the game has and so on. The rest are mere modelers, texturers, physics coders etc.

gotta love a guy who steps on both feet at the same time. you're not making friends on either side of the fence with condescending shit like this, friendo (also, lol at the idea of Pete writing script for Fallout).


as for the rest of your misplaced defense for a horrible videogame? dude, just admit you love shitty games and go back to that other forum full of awesome.

 

[Black]

Well, Todd and Pete are the guys deciding most of what the game has and so on. The rest are mere modelers, texturers, physics coders etc.

Oh, ok, it's okay to say bethesda's played Fallout even if only 2 guys (give or take 1) actually played it. And don't forget to put writers and other guys bethesda obviously is lacking in your list.
Thanks for clarifying, I didn't know whether to waste my time with you or not. Now I know.

 

[Ulysses]

Geez, another flamefest.

Anyway, does anybody think that we will be able to have at least one conversation with the alien dudes?

I get the feeling we'll talk to some Alien Overlord type being (hopefully not convince him to leave Earth alone via conversation though, given FO3)

 

[Morbus]

Re: Isn't it really hinted at in previous Fallouts?

1) The crashed alien ship in Fallout 1, obviously

I think they should have also included godzilla and a police box in the DLC.

2) The alien blaster you get from this encounter, one of the best weapons in the game, which has its own proper item description, and which you can continue to use throughout the game

And talking brahmins.

3) Alien corpse in The Glow

No such thing, to my recolection. And I've been there well over a 20 times.

4) Brotherhood Scribe can randomly mention having seen an alien space ship

While driving one of Bob's pre-owned cars, I guess.

5) Skynet in the Sierra Army Depot in Fallout 2 mentions being made with alien technology. (Is he reliable? Does the fact that he has a few dates wrong make him unreliable? More like unreliable developers doing inconsistant dates when writing the script.)

I think this wasn't meant to be taken literally. But well, maybe.

6) Merchant encounter lets you get several alien blasters.

You're right. He should also be selling mini police box portable shelters, but that was pulled at last minute because it would explode when used.

7) For years many people thought of the Wanamingoes as being aliens, and there are Fallout 2 walkthroughs that call them aliens. The Fallout Bible set the record genetic experiments, but the Fallout Bible is an after-the-fact document written by one Fallout developer, and only hardcore Fallout fans have read it. The average normal person that played Fallout 2 a few times and chatted about it with mates is likely to have thought of them as aliens.

It was said ONCE in the game by one secondary character. It's obviously something easy to remember as they are weird as shit, so it's no wonder. The game doesn't state their origin, but just because someone says their the lost sons and daughters of the guy in the old protrait, doesn't mean they actually are.

 

[Per]

Re: Isn't it really hinted at in previous Fallouts?

3) Alien corpse in The Glow

No such thing, to my recolection. And I've been there well over a 20 times.

There is a skeleton that you can only see if you step behind a piece of scenery. It was meant to be part of an X-Files joke, but the reference didn't make it into the game. Hence it can be rationalized either way, like most of the evidence, but if you only look at what's in the game, I find it more reasonable to interpret it as a random freak in a research facility, not an extraterrestrial.

 

[Crni Vuk]

I really don't understand what the problem is. They're making new games, which BARELY break the canon. There's around 5 million guys who like the game, and then there's around 17657 guys on this forum. A lot of this forum doesn't like the game.

Why do you want no one to play the game?

"They're raping the canon!"

Who decides what the canon is anymore? If you hate the canon breaking so much, just ignore that the game ever existed.

Barely break canon? What about the artistic inconsitencies? Changed style in armor, clothes and other objects in a uneeded fashion? Like for example the Vault door of Vault 101. The clothes of the Vault people. The Pip Boy. etc. I know its seen like Nitpicking. But there are lot of such details that do not work with Fallout and somewhat show how much the lead designers and developers of Bethesda paid attention to the game itself. It seems like everything needs a stamp on it that is screaming for "designed by Bethesda".

Another issue is the part about its Story, the Brotherhood and Enclave. The reason why everything "needs" to be there. While not a direct contradition to the Canon its somewhat definetly antipodal to the usual proceeding of the xenophobic Brotherhood. Not to speak about the Enclave which was meant to die with the end of Fallout 2. I would not be surprised if Bethesda resurrects them again in Fallout 4 ... probably as well with new great dialogues to talk their leader in to suicide. But anyway. Bethesda proved with Lockout and Mothership Zeta how much they care about the consitency inside of the Fallout setting. Not even a inch.

And 5 Million fans? Maybe you should get back to the source again. But we will do it here and as well with the same link that you provided:
Bethesda has shipped an estimated 4.7 million copies of the game to retail outlets all across North America and the UK, representing retail sales of more than $300 million
Mhmm. Yes exactly cause 4,7 Million "shiped" units mean 4,7 Million units in costumers hands. Right. Or that it means 5 Million fans. At the moment as sad as it sounds. Numbers alone mean NOTHING. Not yet anyway. What ever if one is thinking NPD numbers are accurate or not is a different question and no one probably knows anything really accurate by now anyway. But fact is that its very unlikely to expect 5 Million copies have been sold when all talk about 4,7 "shiped" copies. By the way, even if it would have sold 4,7 Million. Of course yeah every one is a happy costumer and only those "people" with bitterness in their hearts and stubborn minds are registered here lamenting about the Fallout that never was. Maybe you should try to browse the support forum on the Bethesda board and roam a bit inside their PS3 section? Or the Bug forum? Sure all happy costumers. Everyone one. No one has issues. No one is blaming Bethesda. We are talking about "players" here. Not the Gaming media.

I am not sure if it would be allowed to link to those threads in the Beth tech support forum now as I shure would. But it might be seen as cross side trolling which I want to avoid.

Though I think its not wrong to go with some random quotes:
"I'm seriously so pissed right now. The last 4 weeks I've spent getting up to the DLC content have been wasted."

"I mean, I'm happy that DLC is coming, but I bought fallout when it came out out. I paid money I worked hard for for this product. I still crash after about an hour, damn near every time I play. My ps3 actually freezes, which it has NEVER done with any other game.

Now before I buy the DLC and give these people MORE money, is there any hope they'll solve these crippling issues so that I don't have to manually deactivate my PS3 when I play their game?"

Just a randoom search. Usual gamers. Without any "fanboyism" but with serious issues and bugs which shows that not everyone is a "fan" but just trying to eventualy enjoy the game which is neither always possible. Its doubtfull that 5 Million people are all satisfied costumers.

You also probably missed a lot of those comments from dissapointed players about the story in Fallout 3 and particularly the ending which was to put it mildly embarassing. For a story writter like Emil anyway which was used to make better content like with the Thief games. Yet he feels very "proud" and "satisfied" with how it tourned out in Fallout 3. Awesome. Tells alot about future projects in the Fallout world and what one can expect. Ive been long enough registered there to have seen many of those "usual" and not "flame like" comments which have been honest oppinions and discussions in the official forums but most of it got over time filtered till you had a situation left where 90% of the time people are talking about "do you LARP as Guard/Merc/Bandid/?" and "how much guarden gnones you colected so far" or "games so rocksors! What you stuffed in your house?!". Very helpfull indeed.

...
Well, Todd and Pete are the guys deciding most of what the game has and so on. The rest are mere modelers, texturers, physics coders etc.

And yes, Todd and Pete have played them. Why do you insist on making this random claimings "No they haven't because I say so!" They've obviously played them, Todd even wrote how his encounter with the Master went in the first game. Something along these lines:

"I managed to kill the Master, but he unfortunately crippled my legs so I couldn't escape in time."

Well maybe he played the games. Maybe he didnt. I sure would not go so far to say "he sure did not played it cause I say so!" cause no one can konw it for sure but I definetly do not take everything Todd says as "pure Gold" either anymore. and I can definetly put two and two together. That simple. Want some example? Sure. Youtube is here for everyone. I could also tell you how well such kind of criticms is received in the offical Beth Forum about Oblivion and show you some nice comments by mods and their community manage. But yet again I want to avoid cross side trolling. Anyway everyone is free to form his own oppinion anyway:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8l8ARtNqcAc[/youtube]
Interesting. Isnt it. Though I guess they just did the mistake to shiped the wrong game. And when they realised it it was to late. So they had to say "Xbox was to weak for Radiant AI so we needed to scale it down". Yes. Strange enough modders never found any of this "advanced" AI in the scripts or something so they could have worked with it somehow on the PC. Very strange indeed ... can we count 2 + 2 = Bethesda ?

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YN1j5Tq8RkU&feature=related[/youtube]
Why not show more of those "gates" and what is inside? Ah yes ... cause it are boring repetitive worlds. And nothing special. So letz make a secret around it.

is that the same "Todd" by the way we are talking here about? The Todd that was absolutely honest to us about everything around Oblivion? Well it must be cause Todd about the Oblivion Magic System:
"The magic system has so much more in it, that it would take me 100 pages to answer it all."

Or Radiant AI
I'd say the "Radiant AI" system, and the NPC life. It's something no one has ever tried on this scale, and we're just starting to see how powerful it is, and how we can translate those NPC behaviors into meaningful gameplay.

Oblivion review :: rpg codex

Well without the intention really to "bash" or flame Todd only now but since you mentioned him already. He would not be first and he will for sure not be the last developer with inacurate quotes and statements about his game (Spore anyone?). But it shows one thing. That anything people like he say that are so heavily involved in marketing and PR of a game which DEFINETLY make up a large part of Bethesdas development even so much that it dominates their game development one should take everything those people like Emil, Todd or anyone say with a grain of salt.

 

[Sander]

I really don't understand what the problem is. They're making new games, which BARELY break the canon. There's around 5 million guys who like the game, and then there's around 17657 guys on this forum. A lot of this forum doesn't like the game.

Why do you want no one to play the game?

"They're raping the canon!"

Who decides what the canon is anymore? If you hate the canon breaking so much, just ignore that the game ever existed.

Yes, let's just ignore the official sequel that has hence completely changed the series we all love. Because if we don't like it, we shouldn't complain about, we should just ignore it!
What?

Also, the fact that people like it has jack shit to do with how appropriate it is for Fallout. And what is appropriate for Fallout can be easily deduced from the content of the original game, or what the developers claim is the core of the game.

Bethesda, on the other hand,

Well, Todd and Pete are the guys deciding most of what the game has and so on. The rest are mere modelers, texturers, physics coders etc.

And yes, Todd and Pete have played them. Why do you insist on making this random claimings "No they haven't because I say so!" They've obviously played them, Todd even wrote how his encounter with the Master went in the first game. Something along these lines:

"I managed to kill the Master, but he unfortunately crippled my legs so I couldn't escape in time."

The fact that someone played a game does not mean that they are competent enough to create a faithful sequel.
I'm not magically good enough to write a proper Anna Karenina 2 after I read the original.
Or perhaps a more apt comparison: the fact that J.K. Rowling sold millions of Harry Potter books does not mean that she'd be any good at writing a sequel to a completely different kind of book.

 

[AskWazzup]

I really don't understand what the problem is. They're making new games, which BARELY break the canon. There's around 5 million guys who like the game, and then there's around 17657 guys on this forum. A lot of this forum doesn't like the game.

Because most of the people on this forum loved the originals, and seing the third instalment manifesting into an oblivion esque circus with guns isn't exactly what they were expecting...

Why do you want no one to play the game?

Well, some might be amazed (including me) how so many people praise the overhyped game known as F3, but i haven't seen anyone saying that they don't want other people to play the game.

"They're raping the canon!"

Who decides what the canon is anymore?

You can adhere to the "guidelines" set by the original developers, you don't really need to brake the canon in order to create tasteful new content that is consistent with the setting. I haven't seen any proof of bethesda at least trying to do that, they said it themselfs - "we make games that we like to play".... So basicly they don't give a shit about that, they bought the license because they were not creative enough to make their own version of a post-apocalyptic setting.

Do they have the right to rape Fallout? Yes!
Do they have the moral right to rape Fallout? No! They are assholes for that, albeit legal ones....

If you hate the canon breaking so much, just ignore that the game ever existed

Damn, how come i didn't think of that?! Listen friend, it's not so easy to forget that your favorite game franchise is in the hands of an impotent developer, denying any chance of a worthy sequel being made....

 

[TwinkieGorilla]

the third instalment manifesting into an oblivion esque circus with guns isn't exactly what they were expecting...

well, no. i think that's exactly what we were expecting. not what anybody wanted, but yes...exactly what we expected. and exactly what we got.

(The Fallout franchise) is in the hands of an impotent developer, denying any chance of a worthy sequel being made....

well, there is the off-chance that FO:NV could still be good. even great? i'm doubtful but you nevah, evah know.