T
TorontoReign
Guest
I think people are confusing the difference between the higher ups running the company and the people busting ass in the trenches so to speak.
What the fuck happened to Fallout 4's weapons?
- Thread starter ThatZenoGuy
- Start date
You right its the indivdual who really made fallout 4. I gota admit I don't like all their ideas and how they developed the game really. It not really against them because I think they could made another decent game it just ins't really fallout to me
0wing
Все умрут, а я волномут
I don't think they are that much lazy beyond mathematical mean, though. They are not just lazy. They are extremely arrogant egoists. Bethesda dumbs down everything their claws can reach because that's how they roll. That's what they like to play no matter what legacy lies before them. And this unexcusable, and anyone who finds this acceptable and approves their "games" as good products - contributors to the crime. So, @Greed and that other guy who seriously defended F4 are not just trolls.
Gizmojunk
Antediluvian as Feck
I doubt it... That's how they SELL, because that is the sad state of the mass market today.
*ie. Making it a better RPG would probably hamper their overall sales; [except for those few of us that appreciate better RPGs].
0wing
Все умрут, а я волномут
Well, nope. That's how Pete Hines, who represents the target audience, rolls. That's how Todd rolls, since according to him, if their games suck, that will indicate that BGS tries (i.e. works) too hard. Remember also, BGS is like one big close family, so they all kinda roll the same and just love Call of Duty they try to mock with current Fallout 4. (they failed and got poor man's Far Cry, but that's another story)I doubt it... That's how they SELL, because that is the sad state of the mass market today.
No, that doesn't have to do with market state. Twitcher 3 sells, GTA V sells BIG, bigger than bethtardia can push.
Walpknut
This ghoul has seen it all
The people toiling on the game aren't lazy, with how buggy their games tend to be released I would actually imagine they are overworked regularly just to rush things out the door. The problem isn't with the Oompa Loompas, they just have a bunch of unimaginative idiots as their Willy Wonka.
But how much could be achieved, with a clear vision, a correct team and planing though? Sadly no one here has any insight how Bethesda manages their finances, resources and actuall development. It would definetly be a very intersting read.
I remember years ago, on the Bethesda forum when Fallout 3 was still in development, we had this discussion about how Bethesda actually approaches their projects. It was spawned by some interview where Todd mentioned that they don't have really a 'design-phase' to speak so, they move directly from the brain storming, to the actuall game develpoment. In hinsight, it really doesn't surprice me anymore how they could overlook such an obvious mistake like companions wich can't be harmed by radiation so they had to change the dialog to reflect that. I think we all remember that dumbfuck of writing ...
And then you look at what Obsidian achieved in a much shorter time frame, with less money, probably less people and you have to ask your self what the hell is acutally going on in Bethesda.
BigGuyCIA
Yer fond of me Lobster!
I doubt it... That's how they SELL, because that is the sad state of the mass market today.
*ie. Making it a better RPG would probably hamper their overall sales; [except for those few of us that appreciate better RPGs].
Would it have killed them to at least keep the features that made it an RPG? Fallout 4 makes 3 look like a diamond in the rough [when it comes to rpg mechanics].
Of all the flack 3 got I doubt the criticism amounted to "more shooting; less C&C."
SarcasticGoodGuy
*R O T T E N*
I don't know, Pete "Petey" Hines said he couldn't be bothered listening to the dialogue in Fallout 3.
Actually having said that, when you look at F3's writing, Petey kind of had a point.
Gizmojunk
Antediluvian as Feck
Apparently ~yes, it would seem so.
It was certainly that way the first time around with FO3, with not tossing out the Fallout series' precepts and game mechanics that made it ~the Fallout series.
As we've seen, they more than helped themselves to Fallout's rich reputation, but offered none of it in FO3 ~so as to get rich off of it.
IE. The perfect Fallout 3 would not have made them more money than their FO3 impostor product. Business-wise, they did the right thing...
(By screwing us over, and ruining the IP with their brand of shallow-Ocean franken-shooters.)
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BigGuyCIA
Yer fond of me Lobster!
Yeah...it's in line with Bethesda's concept of doing the absolute bare-minimum for one thing, and scrapping it entirely [rather than improving it] in the sequel.
I get why they did it. You're given 100 million to produce the game, and expected to make even double/triple that on sales.
I just don't see how you can squander 100 million producing such a painfully average title (Fo4) that not only fails to be an RPG, but fails to be a competent shooter/crafting game. Just compare Fallout 4 to the big kids on the block and it's already behind by at least 5 years.
Gizmojunk
Antediluvian as Feck
... And what if "a painfully average title" is the goal... to sell it to a painfully average [mass] consumer base?
(...That don't want RPGs in the first place; but prefer an empowerment sim that stroke their ego.)
I too fear, what looks like amateurishness to us, is actually professionalism by them with most what we see, was made on purpose, as they think it sells well - and why should they not believe this, their previous titles followed a pattern here, less mechanics, less story, less role playing, higher sales.
ThatZenoGuy
Residential Zealous Evolved Nano Organism
That's a scary thought, it really is.
What appears to us, as sheer laziness and disregard for a breathtaking franchise, is professional game design and 'good lore making' in the eyes of others.
This is the case.
This is why franchises get ruined.
I honestly cannot think of a franchise which was not ruined in this way.
Alien? Ruined, until Neil Blomkamp can make one.
Predator? Ruined.
Mechwarrior? Absolutely ruined, 4 is debatably good, 3 was the best.
Tremors? Ruined with 5.
Etc.
What appears to us, as sheer laziness and disregard for a breathtaking franchise, is professional game design and 'good lore making' in the eyes of others.
This is the case.
This is why franchises get ruined.
I honestly cannot think of a franchise which was not ruined in this way.
Alien? Ruined, until Neil Blomkamp can make one.
Predator? Ruined.
Mechwarrior? Absolutely ruined, 4 is debatably good, 3 was the best.
Tremors? Ruined with 5.
Etc.
Gizmojunk
Antediluvian as Feck
BigGuyCIA
Yer fond of me Lobster!
Aww, cmon. Aliens was a great sequel.
ThatZenoGuy
Residential Zealous Evolved Nano Organism
Aliens was a MARVELOUS movie, I loved it, and still love it greatly.
Ultimately its a fine movie, and is a nice addition to the franchise, its the Action Ying to Alien's Horror Yang.
But Alien 3 and 4 (And AVP1-2) sucked balls.
Shardik
Still Mildly Glowing
That rather nicely sums up the whole idea of creative bankruptcy, I think.
No one really knew what direction the Alien franchise should take after the release of Aliens, only that there was still gold in them thar hills. So they threw a bunch of shit together for the third and fourth movies, with no real vision of what they wanted for the series except to keep it mining them thar hills.
ThatZenoGuy
Residential Zealous Evolved Nano Organism
IMO Alien 3, and even 4, could have been awesome movies.
A dog-alien, in a defenseless prison sounds AWESOME!
And a queen chestburster? Wowie!
What a shame it killed off the main character we all loved, killed off Hicks, Newt, and had shitty CGI... ;(
R.Graves
Confirmed Retard
Its wierd because alien 3 had a lot of alternate scripts which were feckin amazing. But they went with the one where the movie started with everyone dead.