The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

[Alphadrop]

Might give it that ol' rougelike feel with the computer generated quests.
Well apart from the challenge and complex systems that most roguelikes have.

 

[TheWesDude]

1) bethesda hypes a lot of shit

2) bethesda delivers on very little

3) i expect a game that looks no better than oblivion or fallout 3 and just as buggy as either

4) i expect a ton of bugs and professional media to ignore it and call it GOTY material

5) i expect "RPG" features to be removed in favor of action/fps mechanics

6) i expect it to be fully voiced and that it will detract from the experience

 

[Ausdoerrt]

The way Bethesda seems to be imagining their approach to quests this time around is that you can discover things based on your character class, level, where you are in the story, that sort of thing, not necessarily at preset intervals or simply by talking to an NPC. I actually think it's a pretty cool idea, just maybe not achievable given Bethesda's technical, budgetary and design limitations.

It's an interesting idea, but I can't think of a way to implement it well. If people ask you for help randomly, then it'll just feel like a number of generic side-quests are being dumped at you in set increments. If you still have to go asking around, then that's hardly significantly different from the traditional approach. And while the idea is nice, I don't see why there's a need to reinvent the bicycle. The worst thing about it by far is the transferring of quests to another person if the questgiver is dead: it nigh annihilates any importance of choice and consequence. The system also seems to make everything level-scaled to you, which is just plain boring; I don't see the appeal of an open-world game where you can't have your ass handed to you if you stray too far.

Also, noticed this:

The expansive Oblivion and Fallout 3 settings created a wonderful sense of place, but the robotic and unrealistic character animations sometimes betrayed the sense of immersion the environments imparted.

And there I remember reading all those reviews about how absolutely perfect and fantastic FO3 looked. Do they really have to do this for every next game they release?

 

[UncannyGarlic]

It's an interesting idea, but I can't think of a way to implement it well. If people ask you for help randomly, then it'll just feel like a number of generic side-quests are being dumped at you in set increments. If you still have to go asking around, then that's hardly significantly different from the traditional approach.

I think that it's worse than the traditional method since you cannot or it will be a pain in the ass to try to get specific quests. There is something to be said for a structure which is consistent and can be navigated upon knowing it or in which different routes can be explored, especially with Bethesda's quest quality.

Being able to avoid the crap and go for the gold on future playthroughs is nice. Removing that seems like it would kill any inclination anyone would have to replay one of their games. This is especially true since they seem to be sticking to their guns about not cutting the player off from any quests (ie implementing choices and consequences).

And there I remember reading all those reviews about how absolutely perfect and fantastic FO3 looked. Do they really have to do this for every next game they release?

They can't miss a golden opportunity to use the Rybicki Maneuver.

 

[sampson70]

that screenshot is pretty good and even if it's not 100% true to how the game will look, I really like the scenery and style and if it comes even close to that I will be more than happy. what I'm more interested in aesthetically is animations and npc faces. those things affect my feelings towards a game way more than textures, lighting, shadows, reflections and so on.

I don't know why some folks just can't admit...the game(at least) will look awesome ! Oh btw here are more (scan copies) screenshots from GI ,also there is a nice female NPC.http://nerdreactor.com/2011/01/10/elder-scrolls-v-pictures-and-information-revealed/

 

[Bad_Karma]

The problem i see with how they describe their quest-system (with changing locations, NPC's and so on) is that they won't be able to add different approaches in such a scenario.

Take for example the Dark Brotherhood questline i mentioned before, you had to kill certain NPC's and in a lot of these single-quests you had the possibility to either blindly go there and kill the guys, or use some special approach. For example there was some Nord (i guess it was a Nord) you had to kill, so you could either do it by entering and slaugthering him and his bodyguard or sneak in, loosen some trophy at a certain moment and the trophy would fall down and 'crash' him.
-> Now if you make the whole quest randomly generated it will be quite more difficult to give the players more options to 'solve the problem'.
Simply because you'd to plan for every location some extra options or extra items for the player. Taking such a thing away would make it really feel more generic.

I wouldn't nearly compare such a thing with a rouglike, simply because rouge-likes aren't about story (like Bethesda claims for their games) but about character advancement.
It's like playing a PnP and the only thing your GM does is throwing new monsters at you - you won't take diplomacy or any skill like that. You will build a 2 dimensional picture of Rambo.
That said i still love playing stonesoup and gearhead 2 now and then.

 

[Crni Vuk]

that screenshot is pretty good and even if it's not 100% true to how the game will look, I really like the scenery and style and if it comes even close to that I will be more than happy. what I'm more interested in aesthetically is animations and npc faces. those things affect my feelings towards a game way more than textures, lighting, shadows, reflections and so on.

The problem is that now in such a early state it can look amazing. Now we can be pretty sure (I think) that those screenshoots are cosmetic. Which block-buster game today is NOT throwing out tweaked screenshots today ? Strange enough for example with Oblivion that many had trouble to get the same kind of visuals on their machine even with a good PC as how it was shown in some screenshoots. But there are as well enough which claim to have them. So letz leave it as that.

But thing is that when the game is near to its release or finished we have to check again if the visuals really are impressive. Particularly when new games will be developed and new engines will see the light eventually with more breath taking features. So to say that while it might look impressive now I doubt it will be more then "standart" later when all the hype and anticipation has a bit worn off.

The problem i see with how they describe their quest-system (with changing locations, NPC's and so on) is that they won't be able to add different approaches in such a scenario.

Take for example the Dark Brotherhood questline i mentioned before, you had to kill certain NPC's and in a lot of these single-quests you had the possibility to either blindly go there and kill the guys, or use some special approach. For example there was some Nord (i guess it was a Nord) you had to kill, so you could either do it by entering and slaugthering him and his bodyguard or sneak in, loosen some trophy at a certain moment and the trophy would fall down and 'crash' him

Hmm no offense meant but I dont think thats a good example because the outcome is still the same and thats all which matters.

Now the difference is more the situation (which is one of the REALY! rare situations in Oblivion) where you get the task to kill some argonian and get his heart back as proof. Expect some small spoiler here but heh it really is nothing big not to the story anyway. Well Why i made my sword ready to hack another corpse strange enough the victim offers you to spare his life and return a fake heart! How awesome is that ! OBLIVION REALLY OFFERS ME A CHOICE sheeeesh. Anyway it has no meaning to game if he survives or not. Killing him doesnt give you anything and if he survives it just boosts your ego (because the game doesnt recognize it any way). So even here I dont see how choices with the new quest system will bring some issue if those "choices" have no meaning if they dont lead in different directions, change your path or those of some NPCs.

I mean at the moment no one can say how it works in detail. But I doubt that the creative heads at Bethesda want to change to much from Oblivion and now suddenly deliver us a game with the writting and quests on the level of some of the really good RPGs. Again that is as how Bethesda thinks NOT what their player base is crying for. - Shiny graphics and hacking bandits with a sword from a horseback that is ...

 

[Ausdoerrt]

They can't miss a golden opportunity to use the Rybicki Maneuver.

Yup, a great observation and a great article, and interestingly still true despite the shitstorm it raised among certain people when it came out

 

[sampson70]

I think the graphics will still be impressive ,also how many games out there have wind effects...like tree &water swaying.Bethesda has finally got them a Triple A engine...face it!

 

[generalissimofurioso]

Some new words on the new Shouting mechanic of Skyrim. Yes, shouting.

Some key bits.

The amount of time you hold down the shout button is how many words come out,” Howard continues. “It becomes a bit of a collection mechanic – to collect all the words.”

Not everything had to be such a tremendous challenge. Because Bethesda was designing the dragon language from scratch, they could shape the way it sounded to the vibe they wanted to express in the game. “You can choose the words for a concept that sound the best. The ones that feel more epic. The ones that roll together well,” Pagliarulo declares. “Like the word ‘dovahkiin.’ ‘Dova’ means dragon. ‘Kiin’ means child. So we did a lot of that. We played with the words. How did it all flow together?”

In the game, the final result of all the hard work is exhilarating, and even more so when you know how deep the rabbit hole goes. Every ancient wall you encounter carries an ancient legend. Every creature that cries out in dragon is saying an actual translatable thing to you. And perhaps most importantly, every dragon shout you acquire carries real meaning behind it. One power used in the game acts like a sort of invisible push of staggering power. Spoken in the game, your hero will intone the three words for the full shout: “Fus, Ro, Dah!” Translated into English, “Fus” means force, “Ro” means balance, and “Dah” means push.

 

[Dario ff]

I'm pretty sure that will end up in just a silly minigame. In fact, you can assume that every bit that makes it sound "Wow!" will just be a minigame. : /

Regarding faces, has there been a single game that's been able to beat the expressions in Vampire Bloodlines? It's been nearly 5-6 years for that game and I haven't seen better since.

 

[UncannyGarlic]

Thats typical for Bethesda. THougn not saying that its a bad thing just somewhat they are known for. They are extremly paranoid when itcomes to informations or anything with it. I think they like to always have something to show to the public when they think the time is right. Or maybe they want simply to avoid what happend with Oblivion (the stuff they have shown on the E3 but which was not in the game).

What they did with Oblivion was pure fabrication. But yeah, expect screenshots and videos to start popping up around 6 months (maybe 3?) before release and then they'll steadily start beating the drums faster and faster until their insane push the month before release. It's a reasonable marketing strategy as it means that people have less time to think about it and it's fresher in their mind. Marketing is the only thing Bethesda does well, and they excel at it.

 

[maximaz]

It seems they might have gotten some of their inspiration from Diablo 2, what with "barbarian" shouts and the mountain you have to climb to reach grey beards a la Mount Arireat and the three warriors (and you know there will be something you have to fight up there too). Maybe not but I'm getting that impression.

I think they might hype this shout thing some more and do a Kinect integration as the mandatory MS exclusive addon this time around.

Also, lol at the article stating that tense is not really necessary in a language. Sounds like they're taking it far enough for their purposes though.

 

[Crni Vuk]

The battlecry has been great with the barbarians in Diablo 2 in my eyes. And geting in conversation and fight with the Nephalem on Areat was probably the most entetaining part of the whole game. As it feelt deep and ancient. I love such moments. Even when its just a mindless hack and slay game.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cNxO8CqV3GY[/youtube]

Well no clue what to make out of those "dragon-shout-cry-language" magic in Skyrim. But I guess we have to wait and see.

*Edit
Sure from reading about it it sounds interesting ... but knowing their habits. Might become a repetitive boring stupid mini-game ... I mean hey! Remember ? They wanted to make dialogues in anever see super cool intuitive way. Dialogue wheel anyone ... blargh. Hopefully they learned from it. Somewhat.

 

[Ausdoerrt]

Also, lol at the article stating that tense is not really necessary in a language.

It isn't. There's a number of languages where it's vague enough it may well be non-existent.

What I don't see is, why there's a need to "design a new language" if it's just gonna be used a few random times. Either they're spending way too much time with this, or hyping it too much.

In any case, in the end it'll probably end up being just like shonen manga heroes shouting out their attack names

Also, if that's all that magic amounts to in the game, then it's effectively being reduced to a little special ability or move like the stuff they have in some action games. Reminds me of the stuff they had in Collapse.

 

[UncannyGarlic]

There's also the problem of when you make up words for a fake language without and linguistic knowledge, the language sounds extremely fake.

In any case, in the end it'll probably end up being just like shonen manga heroes shouting out their attack names

Hahaha. To be fair, when done satirically it's hilarious. Too bad that isn't the case...

I'm pretty sure that will end up in just a silly minigame. In fact, you can assume that every bit that makes it sound "Wow!" will just be a minigame. : /

Agreed and unfortunately Bethesda is one of the worst in the business at making minigames.

 

[generalissimofurioso]

This means there's a button dedicated to shouting.

And I thought games were going to go down the hole when they developed a button that shows you which direction you need to go.

Also, why do I have to hold the button down?

Does this mean that I basically have a knock everyone down and go into bullet-time button provided that I hold down a button long enough?

There's just something disconcerting about it.

 

[Ausdoerrt]

There's also the problem of when you make up words for a fake language without and linguistic knowledge, the language sounds extremely fake.

There's that, too. It does sound like they're mashing all the different random stuff from existing and fictional languages together without much regard for verisimilitude.

“Fus” means force

I mean, really?

 

[maximaz]

It isn't. There's a number of languages where it's vague enough it may well be non-existent.

But it is. Vague =/= non-existent. I don't think there is any language with no tense structures of some kind.

 

[Stanislao Moulinsky]

Sooooo, we'll be shouthing at least once per battle? The idea scares me, it could become extremely annoying.